Zack Burdi not coming to Chicago this season

[GreenSox]

Addison Reed and Sergio Santos were both young stud relievers who the Sox were willing to move...

But neither brought even 1/4 of Giles' return. Williams just gave Santos to the Jays. Reed was an honest trade (that didn't work out) but it was for one prospect, not a boatload like Giles brought.

But that's a good example...Burdi turns into Reed - that's a reasonable goal for a reliever...all he brings is another good not great prospect in trade. i.e. no surplus value.

Burdi was drafted with this year's pen in mind. That demonstrates how limited the organizational thinking is; and how they still live in la la land about the major league team they built: this Front Office apparently doesn't know what constitutes a contending baseball team.

Edited August 19, 2016 by GreenSox

[Jerksticks]

Hell yea. Screw the service time argument, it's not relevant. The Sox plan to contend next season so let's see if Mr. Fireballs can anchor a critical spot in the pen. Looking like the Samardzija for Burdi trade might be a winner.

[kitekrazy]

Sox traded Santiago, a guy you valued as a top of the rotation starter who turned out to not be a top of the rotation starter for Adam Eaton, a guy who might put up a 6.0 WAR this year.

 

Outstanding trade.

 

Agreed even if Santiago lived up to expectations. The Sox are better at identifying pitching prospects and horrible with position players.

 

[caulfield12]

http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2016/08/18/dave-s...&yptr=yahoo

 

There seems to be a more incompetent (sorry, Greg) front office than ours...AZ, with Dave Stewart and Tony LaRussa.

 

Keith Law apparently is going to war with them, and it's happened before with him and TLR.

 

 

 

http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/09/17/tony-l...inst-keith-law/

Edited August 19, 2016 by caulfield12

[tray]

Hell yea. Screw the service time argument, it's not relevant. The Sox plan to contend next season so let's see if Mr. Fireballs can anchor a critical spot in the pen. Looking like the Samardzija for Burdi trade might be a winner.

 

"Mr. fireballs"?? Wow, your the master of wise--- sarcasm.

 

There is no downside to bringing him up on a team that is not making the playoffs and is in the process of evaluating young players. Is Carson Fulmer's career ruined because he made some relief appearances in the majors? No, but Sox management now knows he probably won't be in the rotation in 2017 and based on how he performed they probably aren't counting on him for anything next season.

[caulfield12]

Hell yea. Screw the service time argument, it's not relevant. The Sox plan to contend next season so let's see if Mr. Fireballs can anchor a critical spot in the pen. Looking like the Samardzija for Burdi trade might be a winner.

 

Sure, if he can give you 3+ war per season like Semien...how it can already be looking like a winner when he hasn't thrown a single major league pitch is pretty farfetched.

Edited August 19, 2016 by caulfield12

[southsider2k5]

But neither brought even 1/4 of Giles' return. Williams just gave Santos to the Jays. Reed was an honest trade (that didn't work out) but it was for one prospect, not a boatload like Giles brought.

But that's a good example...Burdi turns into Reed - that's a reasonable goal for a reliever...all he brings is another good not great prospect in trade. i.e. no surplus value.

Burdi was drafted with this year's pen in mind. That demonstrates how limited the organizational thinking is; and how they still live in la la land about the major league team they built: this Front Office apparently doesn't know what constitutes a contending baseball team.

 

The trade value of a closer has exploded in the last two years.

[Kyyle23]

Where did you read it...a link would be nice

 

Probably in the Zach Burdi thread

 

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=100388

[Jerksticks]

Sure, if he can give you 3+ war per season like Semien...how it can already be looking like a winner when he hasn't thrown a single major league pitch is pretty farfetched.

 

It MIGHT be a winner. We all know he hasn't thrown a pitch yet. It's not a bad trade if he's a lockdown bullpen piece moving forward. Just admit it would be nice to have a dependable guy to help the Sox bot piss all these 1-run games away next year. A draft pick that contributes to the major league club winning games is a good draft pick no matter where he is drafted. And this quickly? Mercy, that's a home run of a pick. I can live with Semien and his stone hands contributing elsewhere.

[Balta1701]

It MIGHT be a winner. We all know he hasn't thrown a pitch yet. It's not a bad trade if he's a lockdown bullpen piece moving forward. Just admit it would be nice to have a dependable guy to help the Sox bot piss all these 1-run games away next year. A draft pick that contributes to the major league club winning games is a good draft pick no matter where he is drafted. And this quickly? Mercy, that's a home run of a pick. I can live with Semien and his stone hands contributing elsewhere.

Well, another person who hasn't noticed that Semien has cut his error total in half.

[Dick Allen]

Well, another person who hasn't noticed that Semien has cut his error total in half.

So has Jose Abreu.

[Balta1701]

So has Jose Abreu.

Interesting. Although your math is off enough that I'm noting it, it's provocative to note that his error numbers have gone down at the same time as his total defense metrics gotten worse.

 

Given the dropoff with the bat also, left wondering if maybe there isn't a more specific physical issue bothering him all year that he's just playing through.

[oldsox]

Interesting. Although your math is off enough that I'm noting it, it's provocative to note that his error numbers have gone down at the same time as his total defense metrics gotten worse.

 

Given the dropoff with the bat also, left wondering if maybe there isn't a more specific physical issue bothering him all year that he's just playing through.

all of which has nothing to do with your earlier post that Semien has improved a lot, which he has.

[caulfield12]

A league average SS or better than average 2b is worth a lot more than a short reliever unless that reliever is close to elite (Miller, Herrera, Betances, etc.)

[Dick Allen]

A league average SS or better than average 2b is worth a lot more than a short reliever unless that reliever is close to elite (Miller, Herrera, Betances, etc.)

That was a trade that had to be made according to you. Now you can't even let it go. Change your name to Trump.

[Dick Allen]

Interesting. Although your math is off enough that I'm noting it, it's provocative to note that his error numbers have gone down at the same time as his total defense metrics gotten worse.

 

Given the dropoff with the bat also, left wondering if maybe there isn't a more specific physical issue bothering him all year that he's just playing through.

Your math is off as well. Not quite 50% with Abreu but he has played 1B as much as he did all of last season. Semien still has some games to go to reach last years amount. Semien's defensive metrics were down a week or so ago as well. Now they are up barely.

 

I will now note you take total errors as a huge indicator of defensive prowess, as I remember how generous the official scorer in Oakland was to Marcus the first series of the year.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Dick Allen

[caulfield12]

So has Jose Abreu.

 

Most objective observers consider him a 1B in the same way Frank Thomas was one...it's one of the main reasons he's been at negative overall value for most of the season, and why his trade value is down dramatically.

 

He has to be an 850-875 ops hitter to justify that below average defensive.

 

And Semien has almost doubled Abreu in homers from a "defense first" position, although the overall offensive output from SS has improved dramatically over the last two years due to the injection of young talent at that position around the majors.

[caulfield12]

That was a trade that had to be made according to you. Now you can't even let it go. Change your name to Trump.

 

Filibuster?

 

And yeah, it had to be made because the White Sox essentially gave up on him...that was pretty obvious. Just like they did with Micah Johnson after hyping him heavily for two plus years.

Edited August 19, 2016 by caulfield12

[Dick Allen]

Most objective observers consider him a 1B in the same way Frank Thomas was one...it's one of the main reasons he's been at negative overall value for most of the season, and why his trade value is down dramatically.

 

He has to be an 850-875 ops hitter to justify that below average defensive.

 

And Semien has almost doubled Abreu in homers from a "defense first" position, although the overall offensive output from SS has improved dramatically over the last two years due to the injection of young talent at that position around the majors.

A trade that had to be made. Do I have to dig up your post again Donald? Or were you being sarcastic? I am just pointing out error totals don't tell the entire story. I know Abreu is pretty brutal at 1B.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Dick Allen

[Balta1701]

Filibuster?

 

And yeah, it had to be made because the White Sox essentially gave up on him...that was pretty obvious. Just like they did with Micah Johnson after hyping him heavily for two plus years.

One thing I'm finding interesting - every one that the White Sox have pushed aggressively up to the big leagues, to the point where I was wondering "why are they doing this" over the past few years was traded that offseason. Semien, Johnson, Montas, Bassitt, Thompson, going back farther even Santiago.

 

Fulmer's now the next guy on that list. And if they're going to do another "all-in" trade this offseason, I'm not sure who else they have as trade ammunition.

[GreenSox]

One thing I'm finding interesting - every one that the White Sox have pushed aggressively up to the big leagues, to the point where I was wondering "why are they doing this" over the past few years was traded that offseason. Semien, Johnson, Montas, Bassitt, Thompson, going back farther even Santiago.

 

Fulmer's now the next guy on that list. And if they're going to do another "all-in" trade this offseason, I'm not sure who else they have as trade ammunition.

Let's see Samardzija and Frazier were the "all in" acquisitions. And some James Shields for lagniappe.

Todd Frazier OPS: .747

Marcuse Semien OPS: .746

 

Mighty fine talent evaluation there, Rick.

 

After 8 years of trying short cuts with "elite veterans" and failing miserably, one would think Williams and Hahn would have learned something.

Edited August 19, 2016 by GreenSox

[Jerksticks]

Let's see Samardzija and Frazier were the "all in" acquisitions. And some James Shields for lagniappe.

Todd Frazier OPS: .747

Marcuse Semien OPS: .746

 

Mighty fine talent evaluation there, Rick.

 

After 8 years of trying short cuts with "elite veterans" and failing miserably, one would think Williams and Hahn would have learned something.

 

8 years? What are you talking about? Most of those years had badass rosters that looked competitve on paper. "Hey Paulie, screw your prime and your last good years, we're going to get some prospects. Piss off you old goateed-sometimes fool." GMAB

[caulfield12]

8 years? What are you talking about? Most of those years had badass rosters that looked competitve on paper. "Hey Paulie, screw your prime and your last good years, we're going to get some prospects. Piss off you old goateed-sometimes fool." GMAB

 

Would a salesman who had tons of potential prospects, always talked the talk and yet invariably failed to close out those deals or meet his quotas (bare minimum, we're not talking outstanding or superior performance) continue to have his contract renewed unless he was the son or son in law of the owner?

Edited August 20, 2016 by caulfield12

[GhostofDickeyKerr]

So has Jose Abreu.

 

Does Abreu hit well enough for a modern SS? That's the appropriate question.

 

 

[soxforlife05]

That was a trade that had to be made according to you. Now you can't even let it go. Change your name to Trump.

 

Didn't Trump vote in support of TPP dozens of times until Bernie came along? Oh wait.........I'm a low information voter I must have gotten that one mixed up.