Could you root for Sox losses

[rowand's rowdies]

Good news is we won't have to cheer for losses they will just happen in the competitive AL. In the NL there are too many bad teams who have to play each other too often to really add up. Should have an edge up as far as a harder schedule than the other top spot contenders.

[Jake]

I want them to win every time I watch. This is especially true for a team like the White Sox, but in general every time a fan comes to see your team play or sees your team on TV, you risk losing that person by playing s***ty. I don't care that much about whether we pick 1, 5, or 10. We don't stand to gain in international free agency anymore, which was a big part of the Cubs plan.

 

Cubs got:

Rizzo in a trade for a prospect that was in the system when Epstein took over.

Bryant #2 in the draft

Russell in a trade for Samardzija.

Javier Baez was taken #9 in the draft in 2011, before the rebuild began or Epstein took over.

Arrieta was acquired in a trade for Scott Feldman, a vet signed to the MLB squad for the purpose of trading for prospects.

Hendricks was acquired in a trade for Ryan Dempster.

Willson Contreras was an international free agent acquisition in 2009, long before any rebuild began.

Miguel Montero via trade after transition to "win now" mode.

 

Travis Wood, Pedro Strop, Carl Edwards, Justin Grimm, Mike Montgomery, Aroldis Chapman in trades.

Trevor Cahill as a minor league free agent.

Hector Rondon in Rule 5 draft.

 

Via free agency:

Jon Lester

Ben Zobrist

Dexter Fowler

Jason Heyward

John Lackey

 

Some bit players in WS run who might become important this year:

Almora, #6 pick in 2012

Schwarber, #4 pick in 2014

 

I write this to say that the extent to which losing had something to do with the Cubs winning, most of it had less to do with the losing and more to do with the trading of veterans and getting something in return. I think rooting to lose every game very well may have more costs than benefits. Hell, the Sox got the best draft pick (at the time, at least) in 2014 at #3 anyway.

 

[GreenSox]

No. I will not and simply cannot root for the Sox to lose on a day to day basis.

The losses will happen and the Sox will get a high pick.

 

And as per above, the Cubs got a lot in trades of mediocre pitchers...lucky really.

The Draft helped them.

 

The Astros are the team that was really fueled by the draft. They got very little in their dispersal trades, but a lot of their acquisitions were riskier low minors guys.

Edited December 14, 2016 by GreenSox

[Leonard Zelig]

We've had this thread the past 4 seasons. I think this is the first time it came out before the season started.

[Chisoxfn]

During games, I root for the Bears to lose. It's easy. They're bad, there aren't that many games, and football is my third or fourth favorite sport.

 

With the Sox it's more complicated for me. The Cubs turned losing into Bryant, Baez, etc. They may rip off 3 ringz in 5 years, and it happened with losing, smart drafting and THEN free agent signings.

 

But to mimic it, we have to be very bad for at least a few years. To jump right back in in 2018 is taking half measures (but not like the usual Sox 'half measure', granted)

 

Now, the Sox have been cutting guys that those bad Cubs teams had at the forefront (i.e. Mike Olt) so it may be very difficult for us to be THAT bad. Even after a total firesale, we probably still have quality contributors like rodon/anderson/saladino - and then other guys like melky, lawrie and shields who are still veterans and capable of creating wins.

 

So a couple questions: how bad can we be, and can you root for badness, or is it not in your makeup to do so?

No...I can't root for losses, but when we are in a rebuild, I can easier stomach the losses because they are part of a greater good. Even in football, during the game, I'm rooting for the Bears to do the best possible job...because you know...the guy you draft isn't going to be who makes your team a winner...it also will involve a lot of the guys current on the roster (who you hope to get better).

[tray]

Out of 8 position players we have two young players, Moncada and Tim Anderson, to build around, and possibly a third Zack Collins,, that could grow into a future core of star players in their early/mid-twenties around the same time.

Unless and until that core of elite position player prospects is added to we may not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Time is of the essence in at least accumulating that young core so that they will all reach a career crescendo in the same time frame.

 

 

[Rowand44]

Yes. If I think it's the best thing for the long term health of the franchise then it's an easy thing for me to do. Cheer for the young/core players of the team and hope the others somehow blow games.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Rowand44

[Eminor3rd]

Nah, I always hope they do better than expected...

 

...until like September. Then, if the season is way lost, I can root for losses.

[steveno89]

Out of 8 position players we have two young players, Moncada and Tim Anderson, to build around, and possibly a third Zack Collins,, that could grow into a future core of star players in their early/mid-twenties around the same time.

Unless and until that core of elite position player prospects is added to we may not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Time is of the essence in at least accumulating that young core so that they will all reach a career crescendo in the same time frame.

 

With two trades we already have a solid start to the rebuild. It is going to take many more moves to get where we need to be

 

Sox fans just need to be patient

[Boopa1219]

I never want to see the Sox lose, but when there is a generational talent like Seth Beer in the 2018 draft class, I'd be ok if they stunk next year as long as they get him.

 

I think everyone needs to calm down regarding Seth Beer.

 

Put the the keg down and take a deep breath. It's okay to be excited about possibly having a very high pick but to be this attached to a player a year and a half out from the 2018 is only setting yourself up for disappointment

[FT35]

I want to see my team play hard. Losing is not ok...intentional losing is even worse. But being a rebuilding process...if I still see my team play hard every day and put up a fight and maybe play spoiler to some teams in the fall--OK (for a limited time). It makes higher frequency losing more tolerable--as long as we are playing hard and fundamentally growing and all the losing is not due to building bad losing habits which would carry over to the years we're ready to contend. #1 goal--start building winning habits/culture. The pressure to win might be low, but still remains high to perform and build winning habits and culture. We still have to have standards through all this.

[username]

With two trades we already have a solid start to the rebuild. It is going to take many more moves to get where we need to be

 

Sox fans just need to be patient

 

Yep. Remember when Cubs fans and the general baseball public thought the Cubs had loaded up too much on position players, with no pitching talent? You have to get the best players period, and then you can leverage that talent to fill needs.

 

Our insanely low payroll level will give the team a lot of flexibility come 2018/19. Plus we still have so many valuable assets left to flip, and will likely have a high draft pick for at least a year or two. Think Bryant and Schwarber for the Cubs.

[KMule2545]

Yes, I hope they lose 100 games in 2017 at the very least and wouldn't be disappointed to see the same thing happen in 2018 - although I doubt it will. The way I see it, it's part of the process when you're doing a total teardown/rebuild. What is the point of a rebuilding team having a middle of the pack pick in the draft? There is none. The darkness for a few years will bring bright light to the Southside.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Ro Da Don

[Boopa1219]

Yes, I hope they lose 100 games in 2017 at the very least and wouldn't be disappointed to see the same thing happen in 2018 - although I doubt it will. The way I see it, it's part of the process when you're doing a total teardown/rebuild. What is the point of a rebuilding team having a middle of the pack pick in the draft? There is none. The darkness for a few years will bring bright light to the Southside.

 

I promise you... the dawn is coming.

 

[jenksycat]

Yes, lose all the games. I don't understand anyone who argues against that.

 

If you're nowhere near a wild card, lose all of em. I argue with Cubs fan friends about it and ask: would you rather have had 4 more wins in 2012 or Kris Bryant?

[KMule2545]

I promise you... the dawn is coming.

 

 

Hahahaha yup.

[Greg Hibbard]

For one year I'm on board with rooting for 103 losses.

 

 

[ChiSox59]

Yes, lose all the games. I don't understand anyone who argues against that.

 

If you're nowhere near a wild card, lose all of em. I argue with Cubs fan friends about it and ask: would you rather have had 4 more wins in 2012 or Kris Bryant?

 

Maybe because the season hasn't even started yet and we have no idea what this team will look like. Rooting for this team to win 55 games means guys like Rodon and Anderson - and later in the year Moncada, Fulmer, Giolito and Lopez - did not develop like we had hoped. Trust me, if the Sox continue to trade off pieces, they'll be lucky to win 70 games - but we also need our young players to develop. If some of these guys come up and produce well and cause hte Sox to finish with the 7th worst record instead of the 3rd - so what.

[Dick Allen]

Yes, lose all the games. I don't understand anyone who argues against that.

 

If you're nowhere near a wild card, lose all of em. I argue with Cubs fan friends about it and ask: would you rather have had 4 more wins in 2012 or Kris Bryant?

If they lost all the games, they might have wound up with Mark Appel instead of Kris Bryant. It goes both ways.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

I've been one of the more vocal ones in the "root for losses" group, and I definitely will in 2017, but not until the Sox are out of the race. I'll still root for them to win every game in April and May. But come June, if they are 10 games under .500 already and way behind everyone, I'll start rooting for losses.

 

But until I determine they are out of it, I'll still root for wins.

[Hatchetman]

I don't care how many wins they get as long as our supposed building-block players are performing well.

[KMule2545]

If they lost all the games, they might have wound up with Mark Appel instead of Kris Bryant. It goes both ways.

 

Not really. Appel wasn't a slam dunk 1st overall pick in the mold of Strasburg or Harper - as recent examples. When you don't have that slam dunk 1:1 guy, it comes down to scouting and making the right choice. All indications from the outside were that the Cubs would take Gray or Appel over Bryant because they "needed pitchers". The Cubs chose the player they thought would be the most impactful in Bryant over Jon Gray. They picked right. I'm willing to bet they would have stuck to their guns and chose KB 1:1 if they had that 1st pick - just like they picked Schwarber 4th overall, about 10 picks before his projections.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Ro Da Don

[SonofaRoache]

I don't root for losses in baseball because the draft is too unusual. The picks rarely pan out so I'd rather compete for a wild card.

[SonofaRoache]

Also it is going to be losing while watching the Cubs win championships and having to hear about it everywhere.

[shipps]

WWTD

 

What Would Theo Do?