I posted this on the main board, but I’ll put it here too for those interested. Stat comparison so far this year:

Vaughn: .375/.532/.704 with 13 HR, 47 BB, and 28 K

Rutschman: .431/.581/.791 with 15 HR, 60 BB, and 31 K

Their number of at bats are almost identical (152 to 153).

Edited May 11, 20196 yr by SoxBlanco

Don't scout the stat line.

6 hours ago, fathom said:

Don’t want Abrams for numerous reasons, but it sure seems he’s their guy 

With you on this. I'm starting to accept it though. 

1 hour ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Don't scout the stat line.

That’s true but an up the middle player, a catcher (maybe play some OF too) at that, a positive defender, who can switch hit, projects to be an 55+ hitter and have 55+ power is extremely valuable. I don’t think it’s crazy to project that Rutschman can hit around 20+ homers in a season regularly. 

A player like that is very valuable and rare. 

9 hours ago, OneDog847 said:

Let's hope the Sox get one of Ruschtman, Witt, or Vaughn. 

 

Yup, this where I'm at. I want Adley, Vaughn, and then Witt, in that order, but any of the 3 and I'm happy. 

4 hours ago, SoxBlanco said:

I posted this on the main board, but I’ll put it here too for those interested. Stat comparison so far this year:

Vaughn: .375/.532/.704 with 13 HR, 47 BB, and 28 K

Rutschman: .431/.581/.791 with 15 HR, 60 BB, and 31 K

Their number of at bats are almost identical (152 to 153).

I understand there are more that go in to their scouting grades than actual numbers, but they both play in the same conference and Rutschman's numbers are vastly better than Vaughn's, so what things are contributing to Vaughn being considered the far superior hitter? Just that it's assumed he's playing below his capabilities and Adley is playing above his own right now? Or the line-ups around each guy? Keith Law seems to think Vaughn is a way better hitter, but why?

10 hours ago, SoxAce said:

They need to start sinking or swimming in that regard. Hostetler, Getz, etc. have long said the sox development process has changed (and they didn't "have the players" back then)... has it? well lets see it. Develop a high school kid who projects well into an mlb regular. 

Amen. People are also using “raw” in dumb ways here. 

I hope Vaughn goes to either Baltimore or KC so I don't have to argue this, and he's not an option. I've seen rumors from either KLaw or fangraphs that Baltimore is thinking of taking Vaughn. 

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

I hope Vaughn goes to either Baltimore or KC so I don't have to argue this, and he's not an option. I've seen rumors from either KLaw or fangraphs that Baltimore is thinking of taking Vaughn. 

There is that but it is very possible that the Sox have already ranked Rutcshman, Witt and CJ Abrams as 1-3 and will take whichever one is available.

Vaughn has packed on too much weight for his height  and age.  If that continues, it could slow him down in every aspect of his game.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/andrew-vaughns-special-bat-puts-him-in-rare-air/

42 minutes ago, tray said:

There is that but it is very possible that the Sox have already ranked Rutcshman, Witt and CJ Abrams as 1-3 and will take whichever one is available.

Vaughn has packed on too much weight for his height  and age.  If that continues, it could slow him down in every aspect of his game.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/andrew-vaughns-special-bat-puts-him-in-rare-air/

Vaughn does not appear to have a body type, which will result in his having a weight problem. He just has very thick legs. It's easy to see how that exaggerated leg kick helps him generate power, given the size of his lower body.

This notion of taking the "best player available" requires some caveats. "Best player" simply refers to the ratings for the various baseball skills. It does not take into consideration such things as the value of the position he plays, from which side of the plate he hits, how easily he could be replaced by another player, or what his trade value might be, once he has become a pro. Those are all important considerations, irrespective of what the rest of an organization may look like. Therefore, there are other things, besides "best player available," or drafting for need, which should enter the equation.

Edited May 11, 20196 yr by Lillian

3 hours ago, bmags said:

Amen. People are also using “raw” in dumb ways here. 

Please name the last high school player that Kenny Williams scouted and the Sox developed into an above average player. 

3 hours ago, bmags said:

Amen. People are also using “raw” in dumb ways here. 

But Abrams is very raw. Witt is someone that is much more advanced. I see Abrams as someone that’s going to need to tweak a lot to unleash his potential, and I don’t think the Sox are a good organization to do this.  

16 hours ago, Whitesox27 said:

Let's says Baltimore goes underslot at #1 and Witt goes #2. Would you guys want Rutschman or Vaughn?

If you can draft Adley Rutschman, you draft Adley Rutschman.

15 minutes ago, Dam8610 said:

If you can draft Adley Rutschman, you draft Adley Rutschman.

Yup, / thread.

1 hour ago, OneDog847 said:

Please name the last high school player that Kenny Williams scouted and the Sox developed into an above average player. 

“Because the Sox player development is bad” should disqualify all of these players then.

The Sox have fucked up advanced college bats too. They’ve selected very little high school talent to say anything about it but I’ll say that just I’ve seen enough college bats not improve through higher competition while high school bats surpass them that I don’t care. 

You aren’t going to be able to hedge against the white Sox bad development in drafting.

2 hours ago, OneDog847 said:

Please name the last high school player that Kenny Williams scouted and the Sox developed into an above average player. 

Not a high school player but Timmy was about as raw as a high school player when he was drafted, I think he's a good example of when the Sox successfully scouted and developed a player.

 

I understand the inclination to draft high-floor/lower-ceiling guys to provide a solid foundation in our system but if that tactic is constantly repeated you'll eventually end up with a solid but ultimately mediocre farm system. At some point they'll have to take some chances on their development staff to truly get some game-changers in out system again.

10 hours ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

I understand there are more that go in to their scouting grades than actual numbers, but they both play in the same conference and Rutschman's numbers are vastly better than Vaughn's, so what things are contributing to Vaughn being considered the far superior hitter? Just that it's assumed he's playing below his capabilities and Adley is playing above his own right now? Or the line-ups around each guy? Keith Law seems to think Vaughn is a way better hitter, but why?

Home park, Oregon state has three really nice top 3 in their rotation - one of the best ones in conference and adley never has to face them.

Despite the numbers Vaughn has actually hit the ball harder as well.

4 hours ago, bmags said:

“Because the Sox player development is bad” should disqualify all of these players then.

The Sox have fucked up advanced college bats too. They’ve selected very little high school talent to say anything about it but I’ll say that just I’ve seen enough college bats not improve through higher competition while high school bats surpass them that I don’t care. 

You aren’t going to be able to hedge against the white Sox bad development in drafting.

I'm not opposed to the Sox drafting a high school kid. I'm extremely fearful of drafting any high school kid that KW has fallen in love with. We've already seen that movie and the ending sucked. 

Fool me once, fool me twice, fool me thrice, wont get fooled again. 

8 hours ago, tray said:

There is that but it is very possible that the Sox have already ranked Rutcshman, Witt and CJ Abrams as 1-3 and will take whichever one is available.

Vaughn has packed on too much weight for his height  and age.  If that continues, it could slow him down in every aspect of his game.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/andrew-vaughns-special-bat-puts-him-in-rare-air/

Is that factual? I'd be happiest with the first two, but Abrams is intriguing

13 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Despite the numbers Vaughn has actually hit the ball harder as well.

Based on what? Do we have Trackman data for this?

I'd consider taking Jacob Hurtubise at some point. Seems like he could be awesome leadoff hitter.

http://thebaseballcube.com/players/profile.asp?ID=205077

Edited May 12, 20196 yr by Chisox378

If Rutschman and Vaughn go 1-2, and we take Abrams, how would you guys react? Happy we didn’t settle for a college bat? Upset we chose Abrams over Witt? Annoyed because he’s a guy KW supposedly likes?

I looked at the college stats and really the player that kept appearing just by looking at the numbers was Rutschman, but I wasn't estatic on anyone else so I'd be happy with Abrams, although I don't know the high school field of best hitters. It's difficult for us because we need to see these players personalities. Are they guys that will always try to get better, what is their work ethic, what is their personality, will they be good role models, how do they handle failure, how do they handle success, what about their personal life. 

38 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

If Rutschman and Vaughn go 1-2, and we take Abrams, how would you guys react? Happy we didn’t settle for a college bat? Upset we chose Abrams over Witt? Annoyed because he’s a guy KW supposedly likes?

If Rutschman and Vaughn go 1-2 they are taking Jr.  The only way they would take Abrams is if Rutschman and Jr go 1-2.  I still doubt it will happen but I would absolutely love it.