8 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

I got the Athletic subscription for 75 percent off for the year on Cyber Monday. This was definitely money well spent as they do a great job. Ken thinks Wheeler will sign anyday for 5 years and about 100 to 110 million. Nothing new here, but has has spoken with league sources. 

Clubs he mentioned on Wheeler are White Sox, Twins, Reds, Rangers and Blue Jays.

Also in that article he mentions how Bumgarner had the biggest increase in spin rate on his fastball from 2018 to 2019 among all pitchers in baseball. Only team his mentions on Bum are the Braves.

14 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

I'm thinking he goes for 5/$110 but kinda feel like he might get a 6th year (at least as a team option).

Rosenthal does not think he’ll get six years.  I think he ultimately ends up right where you said at 5/$110M.

1 minute ago, DirtySox said:

Clubs he mentioned on Wheeler are White Sox, Twins, Reds, Rangers and Blue Jays.

Also in that article he mentions how Bumgarner had the biggest increase in spin rate on his fastball from 2018 to 2019 among all pitchers in baseball. Only team his mentions on Bum are the Braves.

MadBum is a guy who doesn't get enough love right now. Not saying he's a better fit, but I think he's a better value.

You can probably get away with MadBum on a 4 year deal at $65-70mm vs. Wheeler who's bids are going to be closer to 5/110. $40mm is no joke, plus one less year could be very nice when it comes to resigning some of our own young talent.

Hopefully the Wheeler domino falls soon 

6 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

Clubs he mentioned on Wheeler are White Sox, Twins, Reds, Rangers and Blue Jays.

Also in that article he mentions how Bumgarner had the biggest increase in spin rate on his fastball from 2018 to 2019 among all pitchers in baseball. Only team his mentions on Bum are the Braves.

I'd rather have Bumgarner on a 2 year deal than Wheeler on a 5 year deal. I'd love to have Wheeler, but I think we'll have too many pitchers who profile the same way. 97 mph from the right side looks way different the 3rd or 4th day you're seeing it in a row. 

Edited December 3, 20196 yr by TaylorStSox

2 minutes ago, Orlando said:

Hopefully the Wheeler domino falls soon 

Verbatim. 

Quote

But any day now, he will cash in.

 

4 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

MadBum is a guy who doesn't get enough love right now. Not saying he's a better fit, but I think he's a better value.

You can probably get away with MadBum on a 4 year deal at $65-70mm vs. Wheeler who's bids are going to be closer to 5/110. $40mm is no joke, plus one less year could be very nice when it comes to resigning some of our own young talent.

sacrificing the next three years so that we can solve something that may or may not even be a problem in year four.

16 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

I'd rather have Bumgarner on a 2 year deal than Wheeler on a 5 year deal. I'd love to have Wheeler, but I think we'll have too many pitchers who profile the same way. 97 mph from the right side looks way different the 3rd or 4th day you're seeing it in a row. 

Not all fastballs look or move the same. 

5 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

Not all fastballs look or move the same. 

Nor the sliders and change-ups and angles. Especially with Giolito.

1 hour ago, wegner said:

My wife put a bag of Halos in the grocery cart and asked me "are these the same as Cuties?"  I confidently said "Yes" but I do not really know.

You lied to your wife about something so important?  How unusual.

28 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

Not all fastballs look or move the same. 

But the tempo is similar. Rhythm is an unquantifiable variable of hitting. It would affect Wheeler and Reylo the most imo. 

14 minutes ago, poppysox said:

You lied to your wife about something so important?  How unusual.

Lie?!  I prefer Pure Canard or Prevarication

1 hour ago, BrianAnderson said:

MadBum is a guy who doesn't get enough love right now. Not saying he's a better fit, but I think he's a better value.

You can probably get away with MadBum on a 4 year deal at $65-70mm vs. Wheeler who's bids are going to be closer to 5/110. $40mm is no joke, plus one less year could be very nice when it comes to resigning some of our own young talent.

LH also.   I think rotation balance (at least not having 5 straight RH pithcers) is very important in today's game. 

 

1 hour ago, bmags said:

sacrificing the next three years so that we can solve something that may or may not even be a problem in year four.

I'm not sure it's really a sacrifice. MadBum has been a proven ace in his career, and although he has more innings on his arm, has also been healthier throughout his career. His stats can stand against Wheeler any day of the week, and one could easily argue are stronger. All for less money and less commitment. Not sure how it's a sacrifice ... You're getting yourself a #2-3 type guy. 

Just now, BrianAnderson said:

I'm not sure it's really a sacrifice. MadBum has been a proven ace in his career, and although he has more innings on his arm, has also been healthier throughout his career. His stats can stand against Wheeler any day of the week, and one could easily argue are stronger. All for less money and less commitment. Not sure how it's a sacrifice ... You're getting yourself a #2-3 type guy. 

I have defended bumgarner as someone I expect to be a productive starter but to me that's just a #4 guy. This team needs a top of rotation player, we don't know how good kopech can be. FA isn't a series of gradual steps, to me wheeler is the last guy with potential for long term high-end (3.75 ERA in the AL or lower) production.

Others on the lower end will certainly pop up, but may only be 1-year deals and require some luck.

1 hour ago, BrianAnderson said:

MadBum is a guy who doesn't get enough love right now. Not saying he's a better fit, but I think he's a better value.

You can probably get away with MadBum on a 4 year deal at $65-70mm vs. Wheeler who's bids are going to be closer to 5/110. $40mm is no joke, plus one less year could be very nice when it comes to resigning some of our own young talent.

I made some comparisons with Bum to the Sox as like Lester was to the Cubs weeks ago. Very similar in a lot of ways. People around here talk about Madbum as if he is a bum but do have some valid points about pitching in a bigger park helping his stats and his HR rate.

I backed off him because of a belief he'll end up in the NL but a guy like him with his post season excellence would be invaluable to our young pitchers. That's not really talked about at all because you sign players based on how you project them as numbers going forward.

However I have seen posters here talk about his attitude towards celebration/bat flips not fitting in to our fun loving group of youngsters. He's perceived as somewhat of a curmudgeon. I think the Sox could use a guy like him . there is no post season experience on the Sox . Who better to prepare them for the post season than him ? If the Sox can be winners, Madbum would have fun winning too, just maybe more on the inside.

MadBum gave up 30 HRs last year and his home field is gigantic.  

Let's overlay his spray chart at Oracle to a hitters park like CBP.  Oh, that's about 15+ more HR due to park factor.

I don't care how much spin rate he added, he would get destroyed in the AL.

32 minutes ago, wegner said:

Lie?!  I prefer Pure Canard or Prevarication

What's that mean, judge? 

1 minute ago, Pants Rowland said:

What's that mean, judge? 

A Lie

(Nice catch)

 

 

 

HA! I beat him!

Woo! Another week of unproductive twitter refreshing!

MLB app dropping some eyeballs. Haha

18 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I made some comparisons with Bum to the Sox as like Lester was to the Cubs weeks ago. Very similar in a lot of ways. People around here talk about Madbum as if he is a bum but do have some valid points about pitching in a bigger park helping his stats and his HR rate.

I backed off him because of a belief he'll end up in the NL but a guy like him with his post season excellence would be invaluable to our young pitchers. That's not really talked about at all because you sign players based on how you project them as numbers going forward.

However I have seen posters here talk about his attitude towards celebration/bat flips not fitting in to our fun loving group of youngsters. He's perceived as somewhat of a curmudgeon. I think the Sox could use a guy like him . there is no post season experience on the Sox . Who better to prepare them for the post season than him ? If the Sox can be winners, Madbum would have fun winning too, just maybe more on the inside.

Jon Lester was a way better pitcher at the time of his signing than Bumgarner is now. He was coming off a five win season, 2.46 ERA/2.80 FIP over 219 innings. 

Strasburg in 2019 is a better comp for Lester in 2015. 

Edited December 3, 20196 yr by Eminor3rd