Prior to this season, Carlos had thrown a combined 42.1 innings in 2019 and 2020. He is already at 90 this year. Expecting him to pitch throughout the season and into the postseason doesn't seem realistic. There's no way he will be good in this playoffs at this rate. He'll be toast. 

Are you in favor of shutting him down and bringing him back later in the year? Rodon is essential to the playoff run. Hell, Boras may make a fuss if they don't give him a break. The division sucks anyway. IMO, shut him down for a bit.

Edited September 17, 20214 yr by ron883

Wouldn’t be surprised if they traded for another starter who was simply serviceable to help lighten the load for a few guys… while also ramping up Kopech, hopefully.

No, you play to win the next game.

Just now, chitownsportsfan said:

No, you play to win the next game.

How do you think he'll be come the playoffs after pitching 160+ innings?

29 minutes ago, ron883 said:

How do you think he'll be come the playoffs after pitching 160+ innings?

Chomping at the bit.

I wouldn't be surprised to see all 5 starters spend at least 1 stint on the IL. Give them 10-15 days off, bring them back on a pitch limit and build back up in mid-September and be ready for the playoffs. Nobody threw a lot of innings in 2020 and they'll all hit the wall sometime this Summer. 

 

Rodon is a special case based on his prior surgeries and limited innings. I'd likely shut him down post ALG and give him a solid month of "maintenance" time off, throwing side sessions to keep loose. There is a risk however you handle him, but he's shown that he's too valuable for us not to do whatever is necessary to have him ready in October. 

extended? like a fake IL trip? no, nor would his agent agree to something like that in his walk year

but if they wanna limit his innings or pitch count for a few starts, I could see that being helpful down the stretch

55 minutes ago, PitchatRisktoZisk said:

I wouldn't be surprised to see all 5 starters spend at least 1 stint on the IL. Give them 10-15 days off, bring them back on a pitch limit and build back up in mid-September and be ready for the playoffs. Nobody threw a lot of innings in 2020 and they'll all hit the wall sometime this Summer. 

 

Rodon is a special case based on his prior surgeries and limited innings. I'd likely shut him down post ALG and give him a solid month of "maintenance" time off, throwing side sessions to keep loose. There is a risk however you handle him, but he's shown that he's too valuable for us not to do whatever is necessary to have him ready in October. 

Better to ask Boras Corp.

I’m sure they made some kind of gentleman’s agreement when he signed about what to do in such a situation…but luckily their interests are aligned, as both sides want him as healthy as possible for the postseason.

PTAC?

What would you do?  In the past, your were somewhat critical of his mechanics and repeatability/control.

Would you keep him on a throwing program but only pitching 2-3 innings in games once or twice a week for 4-6 weeks or just let it rip and see how ling you can ride him? 

1 hour ago, PitchatRisktoZisk said:

I wouldn't be surprised to see all 5 starters spend at least 1 stint on the IL. Give them 10-15 days off, bring them back on a pitch limit and build back up in mid-September and be ready for the playoffs. Nobody threw a lot of innings in 2020 and they'll all hit the wall sometime this Summer. 

 

Rodon is a special case based on his prior surgeries and limited innings. I'd likely shut him down post ALG and give him a solid month of "maintenance" time off, throwing side sessions to keep loose. There is a risk however you handle him, but he's shown that he's too valuable for us not to do whatever is necessary to have him ready in October. 

That’s going to be called out pretty quickly…1-2 starters, maybe 3, but can’t recall an entire starting rotation deliberately ILed down the stretch.

You have Lynn and Rodon heading towards FA and Keuchel with bonuses/incentives/vesting related to being on the mound…so the players’ union would clearly not go along.

 

At least this is a more interesting and nuanced debate as Ron-generated threads typically go. 
 

Edited July 9, 20214 yr by caulfield12

I wouldn’t definitely skip Rodon every now and then in the rotation, but I wouldn’t shut him down per se.

I also think we need to find a way to get Kopech regular starts in August & September or we will be in the same boat with him next year.

No to any kind of IL stint. 

1. Poor way to handle a guy trying to perform and get paid. 

2. Why mess with his current routine/rhythm? Let him pitch but limit his count for several weeks then ramp him back up prior to playoffs. 

Right now the White Sox are 31-14 at home and 20-21 on the road. No other AL team has such huge splits.

They are also 2 games behind Both Boston and Houston for home field advantage. Right now, if the playoffs started, they would have games 1-2 on the road in one of those parks. 

Maybe everything is wrapped up by a point in September where you can skip a start for him, maybe his arm gives you no choice as it breaks down at some point and you have to give him a few weeks off, but aside from that, shutting him down for an extended period creates a good chance of a first round loss.

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I wouldn’t definitely skip Rodon every now and then in the rotation, but I wouldn’t shut him down per se.

I also think we need to find a way to get Kopech regular starts in August & September or we will be in the same boat with him next year.

Agree w that approach.  Could even pair Rodon and Kopech for 3-4 innings, for a while, when Kopech returns. 

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Better to ask Boras Corp.

I’m sure they made some kind of gentleman’s agreement when he signed about what to do in such a situation…but luckily their interests are aligned, as both sides want him as healthy as possible for the postseason.

PTAC?

What would you do?  In the past, your were somewhat critical of his mechanics and repeatability/control.

Would you keep him on a throwing program but only pitching 2-3 innings in games once or twice a week for 4-6 weeks or just let it rip and see how ling you can ride him? 

I would think his agent would like it. If he continues to pitch regularly he has a good chance of injury from fatigue which won't help his contract situation. 

If they don't give him a break he will most likely either get injured or be so gassed by the post season that his performance will tank which won't help his contract situation either. 

I bet Boras has talked to the FO about it.

7 minutes ago, ptatc said:

I would think his agent would like it. If he continues to pitch regularly he has a good chance of injury from fatigue which won't help his contract situation. 

If they don't give him a break he will most likely either get injured or be so gassed by the post season that his performance will tank which won't help his contract situation either. 

I bet Boras has talked to the FO about it.

Really?  Which side initiated the call?  

Hello, Rick.  Scott here. Yes, the family is fine, thanks for asking.  Hey, about my boy, Carlos.  I want you to submit a few scenarios to me right after the ASG, giving us a few choices on how to preserve Carlos' arm for my free agency negotiations.  Yes, sure, we'll let you make an early offer.  Bye for now, Rick.

People still buy into this load management crap smdh.

3 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

At least this is a more interesting and nuanced debate as Ron-generated threads typically go. 

Well, that's because Ron probably was listening to The Score, and heard Stone talk about this very issue. (The question from the host was along the lines of whether they should go balls to the walls to get the #1 seed in the AL playoffs; Stone instead said something about controlling the IP count on this staff.)

 

All that said, I'd be in favor of limiting IP on this staff if they could find a cromulent AAAA type to eat a start here and there. Alas, I'm not convinced that there is a AAAA type on offer right now; Lopez sucks right now, and Cease has become questionable in his performance since the sticky stuff ban.

 

Pray for health among the starting rotation.

Edited July 9, 20214 yr by Two-Gun Pete

2 minutes ago, Chick Mercedes said:

People still buy into this load management crap smdh.

Yeah, some imbecile named, "Steve Stone" buys into the load management crap. I mean, he's a total fucking dumbass, right?

 

WTF does he know, anyway?

On 7/9/2021 at 4:22 AM, Balta1701 said:

Right now the White Sox are 31-14 at home and 20-21 on the road. No other AL team has such huge splits.

They are also 2 games behind Both Boston and Houston for home field advantage. Right now, if the playoffs started, they would have games 1-2 on the road in one of those parks. 

Maybe everything is wrapped up by a point in September where you can skip a start for him, maybe his arm gives you no choice as it breaks down at some point and you have to give him a few weeks off, but aside from that, shutting him down for an extended period creates a good chance of a first round loss.

I've approached the home field advantage angle and resting Rodon in some way many times with people here. I've brought up the home field advantage as a reason to strengthen the team with trades to give the Sox the best chance in the playoffs.

What I've learned is the posters here don't care about home field advantage nor do they care about Rodon's health. The only thing they care about is not losing prospects and extending our imaginary decade of dominance that PT Barnum has sold us.

 I think it's possible to rest him and get home field advantage by trading for Escobar , Gallo ,  and some strong relievers but now you are talking about hitting the farm teams hard which very few want to do. Everyone is afraid of giving up the next Tatis and losing future superstars which would lose the Sox multiple championships.

Future teams are like Christmas packages waiting to be opened with the best toys imaginable. The children were nestled all snug in their beds, While visions of sugar-plums danced in their heads...

Just remember it's Jerry and Hahn promising these future gifts and in 40 years of ownership and multiple GMs they haven't been able to figure out how to sustain success. The one common thread has been JR.

 

Edited July 12, 20214 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

4 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

 I think it's possible to rest him and get home field advantage by trading for Escobar , Gallo ,  and some strong relievers

If you want this team to land all of that, you're probably losing either Kopech or Vaughn to get Gallo, as he's the rangers top trade chip to kick off their rebuild. They want/NEED a hefty return for Gallo.

 

I agree that there is a need to add to this roster, but I think that many here have a measure of irrational exuberance when it comes to what the SOX could get in trade, and what players will cost.

I'm thinking Escobar, and an arm or two is what they can get without trading away anything too valuable.

If the lead gets to a certain point, they could go to a 6 man rotation and stretch Kopech. 

Skip him when you can do so because of an off day, start Kopech in his place once or twice, but don't shut him down entirely. Don't want him to get rusty when he's in such a great rhythm.

On 7/9/2021 at 6:02 AM, Two-Gun Pete said:

If you want this team to land all of that, you're probably losing either Kopech or Vaughn to get Gallo, as he's the rangers top trade chip to kick off their rebuild. They want/NEED a hefty return for Gallo.

 

I agree that there is a need to add to this roster, but I think that many here have a measure of irrational exuberance when it comes to what the SOX could get in trade, and what players will cost.

I'm thinking Escobar, and an arm or two is what they can get without trading away anything too valuable.

That's what I think too. The Ranger's will probably wait till next year on Gallo just as they did on Lynn even though their record sucks and the rest of their roster sucks the Sox probably can't/won't put together a package that would land Gallo if he is traded this year.

San Diego might do it though. We have that to look forward to.

Edited July 12, 20214 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

40 minutes ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

Yeah, some imbecile named, "Steve Stone" buys into the load management crap. I mean, he's a total fucking dumbass, right?

 

WTF does he know, anyway?

Right? And Lebron  Kawahi and all the rest of them whining about their minutes  and too many games waaa waaa and still getting hurt. Bunch of new age malarkey

Edited July 9, 20214 yr by Chick Mercedes

6 hours ago, ron883 said:

Prior to this season, Carlos had thrown a combined 42.1 innings in 2019 and 2020. He is already at 90 this year. Expecting him to pitch throughout the season and into the postseason doesn't seem realistic. There's no way he will be good in this playoffs at this rate. He'll be toast. 

Are you in favor of shutting him down and bringing him back later in the year? Rodon is essential to the playoff run. Hell, Boras may make a fuss if they don't give him a break. The division sucks anyway. IMO, shut him down for a bit.

Shutting him down completely and waiting to later in the year would be a huge mistake. Eventually if they can get Kopech strong again as a potential starter, then maybe later in Sept, they could go to a 6 man rotation and keep all the arms fresh. When we get to the playoffs ,we will only need a 4 man rotation. This would put two starters to the bullpen and making for a strong bullpen.