I know a portion of this video has been posted in other threads, but I thought this was so good it needed its own. I encourage everyone to watch the entire 16 minute video. It is exactly how every invested Sox fan is feeling right now, and a great summary of all the bad decisions that were made that made this rebuild a complete failure. The White Sox, as a WHOLE, should be ashamed of themselves.

6 minutes ago, ScooterMcGuire said:

I know a portion of this video has been posted in other threads, but I thought this was so good it needed its own. I encourage everyone to watch the entire 16 minute video. It is exactly how every invested Sox fan is feeling right now, and a great summary of all the bad decisions that were made that made this rebuild a complete failure. The White Sox, as a WHOLE, should be ashamed of themselves.

Priceless

Laurence Holmes is credible and consistent on his show when I listened to his solo show. I hope he is still boycotting the team after cancelling his tickets post Tony.

I don't want to hear from Bernstein or Leila, who both said Dylan Cease wasn't even close to being enough to acquire Joc Pederson last year. (The Twitter link is no longer active, the owner must have taken down the clip).

Bernstein should have been shitcanned several years ago after his series of tweets commenting on Bulls' sideline reporter Aiyana Cristal's breasts.

45 minutes ago, ScooterMcGuire said:

I know a portion of this video has been posted in other threads, but I thought this was so good it needed its own. I encourage everyone to watch the entire 16 minute video. It is exactly how every invested Sox fan is feeling right now, and a great summary of all the bad decisions that were made that made this rebuild a complete failure. The White Sox, as a WHOLE, should be ashamed of themselves.

Not ALL of the bad decisions, but yes, this was cathartic. 

9 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Laurence Holmes is credible and consistent on his show when I listened to his solo show. I hope he is still boycotting the team after cancelling his tickets post Tony.

I don't want to hear from Bernstein or Leila, who both said Dylan Cease wasn't even close to being enough to acquire Joc Pederson last year. (The Twitter link is no longer active, the owner must have taken down the clip).

Bernstein should have been shitcanned several years ago after his series of tweets commenting on Bulls' sideline reporter Aiyana Cristal's breasts.

I'm not sure who Bridgeport Bob is but I'm pretty sure he fucking hates Tony LaRussa so yeah I don't want to hear from Bernstein.  Holmes is damb right......he was not wrong!!!

2 hours ago, ScooterMcGuire said:

I know a portion of this video has been posted in other threads, but I thought this was so good it needed its own. I encourage everyone to watch the entire 16 minute video. It is exactly how every invested Sox fan is feeling right now, and a great summary of all the bad decisions that were made that made this rebuild a complete failure. The White Sox, as a WHOLE, should be ashamed of themselves.

I appreciate his candor and fandom but JR simply could care less. No accountability...all that matters is loyalty.

 

I personally cannot stand Laurence Holmes.

Laurence is the only major Sox voice hip to one of the worst things Hahn did, which was guaranteeing Moncada, Eloy and Robert in exchange for 2 total years of extra control (and not for free, it will cost 45 million to exercise that control). 

Obviously, the primest of prime years of a super star player are very valuable, and these moves were universally celebrated at the time, but in hindsight it definitely appears that KW/Hahn knew their future was tied to these players, so there was no reason not to lock them in.

Edited September 22, 20223 yr by GREEDY

54 minutes ago, tray said:

I personally cannot stand Laurence Holmes.

Cool. That’s doesn’t make him wrong.

He's only saying what the great majority of Sox fans have been saying all season long . around the beginning of spring training, I think that many fans had that feeling of dread, worried that the moves weren't done to improve the team, and that this team just wasn't going to live up to the hype.

I really enjoyed that… ?

54 minutes ago, GREEDY said:

Laurence is the only major Sox voice hip to one of the worst things Hahn did, which was guaranteeing Moncada, Eloy and Robert in exchange for 2 total years of extra control (and not for free, it will cost 45 million to exercise that control). 

Obviously, the primest of prime years of a super star player are very valuable, and these moves were universally celebrated at the time, but in hindsight it definitely appears that KW/Hahn knew their future was tied to these players, so there was no reason not to lock them in.

I'm not going to lie. Like most fans as far as I saw, I loved those extensions when they happened. Because we all feared the Sox wouldn't be able to afford these guys once free agency came and you had to pay them to[p dollar.

In hindsight - yeah, it's probably not a great idea going forward. Maybe the hunger isn't there due to the guaranteed dollars?

Anyway, there's a lot to rip Rick Hahn and Jerry Reinsdorf over, but I'll leave this one alone, since I loved it at the time.

21 minutes ago, Sarava said:

I'm not going to lie. Like most fans as far as I saw, I loved those extensions when they happened. Because we all feared the Sox wouldn't be able to afford these guys once free agency came and you had to pay them to[p dollar.

In hindsight - yeah, it's probably not a great idea going forward. Maybe the hunger isn't there due to the guaranteed dollars?

Anyway, there's a lot to rip Rick Hahn and Jerry Reinsdorf over, but I'll leave this one alone, since I loved it at the time.

I loved the extensions thinking they would also make great additions around them with the money saved getting them cheaper early. We skipped the part of the rebuild where you get the core to the majors and then add a star caliber player when everyone is on the cheap side. Doesn’t even have to be star caliber but a good all around player or two.

This was a good listen. Hits home a lot of the things we’ve been saying here for the last year+. 

11 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I loved the extensions thinking they would also make great additions around them with the money saved getting them cheaper early. We skipped the part of the rebuild where you get the core to the majors and then add a star caliber player when everyone is on the cheap side. Doesn’t even have to be star caliber but a good all around player or two.

Looks that we might have gotten lucky with Lucas saying no to an extension. 

37 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I loved the extensions thinking they would also make great additions around them with the money saved getting them cheaper early.

I think fans didn't realize how little extra control the Sox received.  Our dogshit beat reporters and army of amateur bloggers dropped the ball reporting on these deals at the time.  We were definitely all drinking the rebuild kool-aid. 

 

Edited September 22, 20223 yr by GREEDY
Bad hot taek

29 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I loved the extensions thinking they would also make great additions around them with the money saved getting them cheaper early. We skipped the part of the rebuild where you get the core to the majors and then add a star caliber player when everyone is on the cheap side. Doesn’t even have to be star caliber but a good all around player or two.

Yep. Missing in Machado, and Wheeler to a lesser extent, still hurts alot. Still often think about what this club would look like had Manny signed. 

9 minutes ago, GREEDY said:

I think fans didn't realize how little extra control the Sox received.  Our dogshit beat reporters and army of amateur bloggers dropped the ball reporting on these deals at the time.  We were definitely all drinking the rebuild kool-aid. 

On Eloy they received zero extra control.  All they got was the ability to call him up on opening day and avoid the manipulation drama.  

On Moncada they gave him huge money in his arb years (gotta be very close to what the ceiling would/could have been) in exchange for his age 30 season at 25 million or the right to cut him for 5.  

Robert's was by far the best, and maybe the only one that truly made sense for anyone but the front office that was tied to these player's success.  They got an option at his final arb year at 20 million and then his age 29 year at 20 million as well.  So, obviously if Robert is a superstar or even just an above average CF, if he hit the open market at age 29, and was only seeking a 1 year deal... it would be a huge number.  

They got 2 extra years of control on Eloy if they were going to start him in the majors in 2019. So that’s not really accurate. 

1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

They got 2 extra years of control on Eloy if they were going to start him in the majors in 2019. So that’s not really accurate. 

Oh you are right.  Someone was just discussing this with me last week.  Whatever article I read didn't mention the options.  My bad. 

Eloy's is actually not that terrible then.   I guess that changes my opinion a tad on them as a whole. 

10 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

I appreciate his candor and fandom but JR simply could care less. No accountability...all that matters is loyalty.

 

Maybe he should start caring less. I don't know what the attendance was for game #2 with Cleveland but the stadium looked half-empty. And it was quiet. Absolutely no emotion. In the middle of a division race. I don't get why he doesn't care less. I wouldn't my name associated with this fiasco.

It was mostly good, but I second what others have been saying that it's less detailed than many of what has been called out here. And the sentiment I have seen was that sox fans were never happy and whiners prior to this year.

Hahn felt very entitled at Reggies to call out sox fans criticizing the move of a rebuilding team trading out Intl Bonus Money to shed a contract.

Sure enough, the last two 'competitive' years under hahn we have had a severely depleted farm that lacked pieces to send out without completely emptying the farm.

Seems related!

This board's hivemind is sometimes wrong but also tends to learn faster and be right more often than the sox front office. Most of all, none of us ever want to stop improving the team in any area. 

The front office will take one step forward and pat themselves on the back for years until they are heckled into improving it again by the fans.

 

59 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I loved the extensions thinking they would also make great additions around them with the money saved getting them cheaper early. We skipped the part of the rebuild where you get the core to the majors and then add a star caliber player when everyone is on the cheap side. Doesn’t even have to be star caliber but a good all around player or two.

Grandal was supposed to be the beginning of those moves, not the beginning and the end.

7 minutes ago, Snopek said:

Grandal was supposed to be the beginning of those moves, not the beginning and the end.

They learned that the only top of market talent they could afford rested in C, DH, BP

Most here were thrilled with all the extensions. Hahn was complimented for getting it done. 

1 hour ago, Highland said:

Maybe he should start caring less. I don't know what the attendance was for game #2 with Cleveland but the stadium looked half-empty. And it was quiet. Absolutely no emotion. In the middle of a division race. I don't get why he doesn't care less. I wouldn't my name associated with this fiasco.

Like I said, I've met him briefly twice and I know he wants to win but he wants to win HIS WAY, with his ideas and norms about how things should be done.

At his age he isn't changing now. And with his money he doesn't care about being associated with a clown show, he's obviously had great success in his life which is how he was able to get the team in the first place. The Sox are only a small part of what is his makeup.