On 5/12/2025 at 8:59 PM, WhiteSox2023 said:

I wanted Taylor two offseasons ago.  Then he sucked last year and was another year older (34) so I realized he was likely done.  I wasn’t excited about his signing this past offseason.

But continue to misrepresent things the way you always do.

Regarding Keaschall, an actual notable MLB sports writer reported it.  Why am I silly to have believed it? 

Sucks when one troll puts up half of the posts. 

https://thedishwasher.blog/2025/05/03/is-mike-elias-the-worst-at-free-agency/&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwjsnN-kyaWNAxVYDEQIHXuTHoQQFnoECAIQAg&usg=AOvVaw0uw6cwla3LKx1Kj3rKloZ_

 

Thought this was interesting....very very deep into his article.

White Sox 10th in FA spending ($320ish million) from 2020-2024 but only 21st in results (fWAR per $$$).

 

Seems the pretty limited spending ($15ish million) and fWAR results for early in this 2025 season are pretty closely aligned...within three spots in the standings.

Pretty sure this methodology doesn't count Amaya against the Sox either.

Ofc, last year was obviously a pretty big debacle in this particular metric.

Edited May 15, 2025May 15 by caulfield12

For 2 seasons, this asshat has been the GM for a team that on most days has no chance to win the game. That is friggin ridiculous in MLB. Alot had to go wrong to lose so many games last season and they are on a worse pace this year.

48 minutes ago, wegner said:

For 2 seasons, this asshat has been the GM for a team that on most days has no chance to win the game. That is friggin ridiculous in MLB. Alot had to go wrong to lose so many games last season and they are on a worse pace this year.

But remember JR is content (and that apparently is all that matters)

This White Sox team is pathetic.  They simply cannot hit for some reason.  Our so called top players are hitting under .200.  This team could not compete at the AA level.  Getz should have already been fired.  This season is another disaster.  Find some front office people from successful franchises. 

4 hours ago, Tomas said:

This White Sox team is pathetic.  They simply cannot hit for some reason.  Our so called top players are hitting under .200.  This team could not compete at the AA level.  Getz should have already been fired.  This season is another disaster.  Find some front office people from successful franchises. 

JR says, "No way, I'm comfortable losing games but making money."  

4 hours ago, Tomas said:

This White Sox team is pathetic.  They simply cannot hit for some reason.  Our so called top players are hitting under .200.  This team could not compete at the AA level.  Getz should have already been fired.  This season is another disaster.  Find some front office people from successful franchises. 

Getz was with the Royals in 2015. What more do you want?

#JR

Getz is just doing what he's told to do by JR. They don't care if the team is losing as long as the team has a  low payroll. I've pointed out before, low payroll = big profits for owner. This doesn't say much for JRs character. How much money does he need?  He's a billionaire. You would think he would be ashamed to have a team so bad but evidently he's not.

On 5/15/2025 at 6:35 AM, caulfield12 said:

https://thedishwasher.blog/2025/05/03/is-mike-elias-the-worst-at-free-agency/&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwjsnN-kyaWNAxVYDEQIHXuTHoQQFnoECAIQAg&usg=AOvVaw0uw6cwla3LKx1Kj3rKloZ_

 

Thought this was interesting....very very deep into his article.

White Sox 10th in FA spending ($320ish million) from 2020-2024 but only 21st in results (fWAR per $$$).

 

Seems the pretty limited spending ($15ish million) and fWAR results for early in this 2025 season are pretty closely aligned...within three spots in the standings.

Pretty sure this methodology doesn't count Amaya against the Sox either.

Ofc, last year was obviously a pretty big debacle in this particular metric.

By limiting the spending JR is eliminating that $10M per year player that has only a slightly better chance of being productive than the $3M player. Mid-level spending often results in poor production if you're signing once productive players who are aging out. JD Martinez would've have likely been in that category but no one signed him.

I'm trying to figure out if people here would be happier if JR allowed Getz to spent $50M more on players  this year when it might mean only 10 more wins in a year when you want the best shot at the 1st draft pick.

Apparently there's not enough money to spend on infrastructure and players. Isn't that the way it's always been with JR ? The only reason why he'd once in a while spend more is because it went to player payroll while infrastructure/ player development,  scouting etc. lost out.

15 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

By limiting the spending JR is eliminating that $10M per year player that has only a slightly better chance of being productive than the $3M player. Mid-level spending often results in poor production if you're signing once productive players who are aging out. JD Martinez would've have likely been in that category but no one signed him.

I'm trying to figure out if people here would be happier if JR allowed Getz to spent $50M more on players  this year when it might mean only 10 more wins in a year when you want the best shot at the 1st draft pick.

Apparently there's not enough money to spend on infrastructure and players. Isn't that the way it's always been with JR ? The only reason why he'd once in a while spend more is because it went to player payroll while infrastructure/ player development,  scouting etc. lost out.

The interesting thing about JR is that years ago he said that he doesn't believe in spending on "potential" i.e. the draft, international spending et al.

But at the same time he won't sign top level free agent talent.

Those two realities seem to contradict each other and leave the team bereft of talent and the means to get it.  

Gavin Sheets has 2 home runs today. Now 8 on the year. With a .281 Ave, 27 rbi and an .822 ops.......just throwing that out there. 

10 minutes ago, TheBooneLoganEra said:

Gavin Sheets has 2 home runs today. Now 8 on the year. With a .281 Ave, 27 rbi and an .822 ops.......just throwing that out there. 

But its a "meatball" take that this organization is the reason players under-perform here.....

16 minutes ago, T R U said:

But its a "meatball" take that this organization is the reason players under-perform here.....

We have the best player development.

On 5/12/2025 at 7:26 PM, WhiteSox2023 said:

Well, I sure as hell didn’t click my heels and wish for a return of Miguel Vargas!

That was your boy Getz.

You might have to start buying into Vargas. But let's be fair and say to buy into Vargas as having turned it around  he has to produce good hitting numbers for as many games as he sucked with the Sox . Is that fair? You tell me how much longer till you truly believe the Sox fixed him ?

On 5/20/2025 at 9:46 AM, Lip Man 1 said:

The interesting thing about JR is that years ago he said that he doesn't believe in spending on "potential" i.e. the draft, international spending et al.

But at the same time he won't sign top level free agent talent.

Those two realities seem to contradict each other and leave the team bereft of talent and the means to get it.  

There you go the conundrum of Reinsdorf. Wouldn't pay to scout draft and develop it and wouldnt pay for it once it reached a certain level of greatness.

Edited May 22, 2025May 22 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

3 hours ago, T R U said:

But its a "meatball" take that this organization is the reason players under-perform here.....

As usual misinterpreted.   Yes meatball take that Robert or any individual player for that matter, was an organizational failure unless you provide specific insight into the situation.  We don't have that knowledge outside of the generalization that JR didn't hire enough of the right people for the Sox to help most players throughout his tenure as owner. I believe that and you believe that and most Sox fans believe that based on Reinsdorf stating it himself according to Lip. If you have specific information about how the Sox failed Luis Robert, Jr. I'm willing to hear it. 

A meatball take is more emotional than analytical. I didn't see any analysis why it was the Sox who failed him .Applying a generalized belief of the whole organization sucking at it may not apply to one individual. That's an emotional response without specific insight into  pinpointing how Robert  was failed. Its painting with a very broad brush. A player fails it's the organizations fault. They succeed it's not because of the organization. It starts being able to scout everywhere and identifying talent and pay to bring it in. Sometimes there just wasn't the talent there to have much of a chance for it to develop. See White Sox international signings especially in the D.R.

The one GM they had who had a great but short run of picking talent that developed was Larry Himes. I think   he clashed with Reinsdorf and was fired after only 4 years.

Edited May 22, 2025May 22 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

The idea that JR eats, sleeps and drinks baseball has to be one of the greatest myths in history. If he loved baseball as much as he says he does he would have improved this team this past off season. Obviously, he doesn't care if this team keeps losing.

1 hour ago, WBWSF said:

The idea that JR eats, sleeps and drinks baseball has to be one of the greatest myths in history. If he loved baseball as much as he says he does he would have improved this team this past off season. Obviously, he doesn't care if this team keeps losing.

You can be passionate about something and still be incompetent at it.

1 hour ago, JoeC said:

You can be passionate about something and still be incompetent at it.

See COL Rockies and CLE Browns ownership/admin over the years.

Jacksonville Jaguars come to mind as well.

3 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

As usual misinterpreted.   Yes meatball take that Robert or any individual player for that matter, was an organizational failure unless you provide specific insight into the situation.  We don't have that knowledge outside of the generalization that JR didn't hire enough of the right people for the Sox to help most players throughout his tenure as owner. I believe that and you believe that and most Sox fans believe that based on Reinsdorf stating it himself according to Lip. If you have specific information about how the Sox failed Luis Robert, Jr. I'm willing to hear it. 

A meatball take is more emotional than analytical. I didn't see any analysis why it was the Sox who failed him .Applying a generalized belief of the whole organization sucking at it may not apply to one individual. That's an emotional response without specific insight into  pinpointing how Robert  was failed. Its painting with a very broad brush. A player fails it's the organizations fault. They succeed it's not because of the organization. It starts being able to scout everywhere and identifying talent and pay to bring it in. Sometimes there just wasn't the talent there to have much of a chance for it to develop. See White Sox international signings especially in the D.R.

The one GM they had who had a great but short run of picking talent that developed was Larry Himes. I think   he clashed with Reinsdorf and was fired after only 4 years.

Well let’s see. The Sox failed Luis Robert, in no specific order, by not meaningfully improving the roster. By not doing real searches to improve coaching or front office staff. By being woefully behind the times in advancements in analytics and preparation. By failing to develop anything to support the main roster. You’ve heard the comments from players that have left this organization, they are a total dumpster fire, they’ve absolutely played a part in failing a lot of players that have come through here. 

6 hours ago, TheBooneLoganEra said:

Gavin Sheets has 2 home runs today. Now 8 on the year. With a .281 Ave, 27 rbi and an .822 ops.......just throwing that out there. 

Speaking of Sheets apparently he "Lost his love for baseball with the White Sox"

https://fanrecap.com/sheets-reveals-he-lost-his-love-for-baseball-with-white-sox-2/

12 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Speaking of Sheets apparently he "Lost his love for baseball with the White Sox"

https://fanrecap.com/sheets-reveals-he-lost-his-love-for-baseball-with-white-sox-2/

Gee imagine that. Everyone who has opened their mouth after leaving here has pretty much said the same thing. This organization sucks top to bottom. 

9 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Speaking of Sheets apparently he "Lost his love for baseball with the White Sox"

https://fanrecap.com/sheets-reveals-he-lost-his-love-for-baseball-with-white-sox-2/

He's playing well but the Padres are reverting to mean this week...Cease M.King Suarez Arraez are going to be traded if they fall down to the .500 mark.

That said, Sheets would clearly be the best hitter on the White Sox this season.  Would be leading team in both homers and RBIs.  That's also what happens when you have much less pressure to produce AND feel comfortable in your environment.

3 hours ago, T R U said:

Gee imagine that. Everyone who has opened their mouth after leaving here has pretty much said the same thing. This organization sucks top to bottom. 

Crawling out from this enormous losing culture that Jerry has fostered it could possibly take a decade. That's how much damage has been done.

1 hour ago, T R U said:

Well let’s see. The Sox failed Luis Robert, in no specific order, by not meaningfully improving the roster. By not doing real searches to improve coaching or front office staff. By being woefully behind the times in advancements in analytics and preparation. By failing to develop anything to support the main roster. You’ve heard the comments from players that have left this organization, they are a total dumpster fire, they’ve absolutely played a part in failing a lot of players that have come through here. 

"No plan, no thought process, no confidence.  The Sox have failed him so badly. " That's the quote you're backing as not meatball or a hot take.

No plan. Yes there is a plan. It's the same one they gave Tim Elko. Do your best to recognize pitches outside the zone and hit pitches that you can hit in the zone. That's the simplified version. I have no specifics on it but apparently it worked at the minor league level for Elko who doesn't have the physical gifts that Robert has except for perhaps strength. Of course Elko is brand new to MLB . He never had a season like Robert did against the best pitching in the world which leads me to  what comes next. I do have some specifics on Robert below.

No thought process. Kind of seems like the same thing as no plan. Seems rather vague to me but not to you apparently Coaches have been brought in to help all players and better ID mechanical issues through biometrics.  Vargas got help. Elko got help. One was a physical cure (mechanics) the other was a process or approach fix which seems like the same thing they tried with Robert. I have no idea why it can help Elko but not Robert. Different people of course. Doesn't appear the Sox are woefully behind the times anymore and Fuller was just hired and Fuller gave credit to the Sox biomechanist  (Aaron) in R &D

What was Robert's thought process in 2023 on a bad  team that had 101 losses ? Riddle me this. Why did he succeed then on a bad team but you can tell me the Sox failed him by not meaningfully improving the roster ? He didnt seem to need the roster to be meaningfully improved in 2023.

No confidence. Compared to this board the Sox coaching staff is all positive energy. They build these guys up like soccer moms . But maybe you can tell me who on the staff is fucking with his confidence.

I'm looking for answers though. I'm not just blaming the organization in a time that is easy to blame the organization.

In the Robert Trade Value thread I posted about the new statcast stats that have Vargas right up there with some of baseballs best hitters. The stats are Swing Path Tilt, Attack Angle and Attack Direction.

Ted Williams was known as a hitter who had all kinds of ideas about hitting but when it comes down to it he had incredible eyesight like 20/10 .Ted Williams' hitting philosophy emphasized a balanced, controlled swing with a focus on bat speed and proper mechanics, prioritizing a "push swing" rather than a wrist snap.. He also stressed the importance of identifying a "happy zone" – a specific area in the strike zone where he had the highest probability of success, and selectively swinging at pitches within that zone. Or course you have to have the eyesight to identify pitches in micro seconds and have the reflexes to actually hit the pitch on time.

The happy zone seems like the Elko and Robert thought process. Both have improved their walk rates but Robert cant get the timing down to identify hittable pitches early enough to smash them. There are also some differences in his stance now than in 2023.

Robert is deeper in the box 31.9 inches in 2025 to 30.2 inches in 2023. His stance is different . His feet are farther apart 32.7  in 2025. 31.8 in 2023. His stance angle is 22 degrees open now compared to 11 degrees open in 2023.

It appears that these difference were designed to allow him to see the ball better and longer but he's hitting the ball out in front of the plate more than in 2023 , 2.1  inches compared to .8 inches in 2023. His timing is off . He's too early which is why I said he was in between . Too early on hittable pitches but seeing pitches better to take more walks. He's also a tiny bit farther away from the plate which seems to be to help try to keep him away from pitches away from him. But these sweepers with so much horizontal break really seem hard for him to identify since they start inside and break outside. Makes me wonder how good he is at recognizing the spin differences or knowing the pitchers breaking ball repertoire.

By the way I just found a MLB article that explains the new statcast metrics and  they brought up Ted Williams just as I did in trying to explain it. Pretty good coincidence. https://www.mlb.com/news/new-statcast-swing-metrics-2025