Old Socks Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 After Lee was picked off in the ninth, he bolted for the dressing room. I think Ozzie went in there to chase him back to the dugout, but I'm not sure. Anybody get a better look? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSoxShuf Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 I hope he chased him down and gave him his 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 :headshake Carlos is starting to piss me off. Maybe this little episode (if true) will get him off the funk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 After Lee was picked off in the ninth, he bolted for the dressing room. I think Ozzie went in there to chase him back to the dugout, but I'm not sure. Anybody get a better look? I did see Ozzie go back to the lockerroom, as well he should have. there is ZERO excuse for being picked off in the 9th inning, and I remember it happening last year to Carlos as well. He is damned lucky that we won this game dispite his stupidity. If we lose 5-4, he gets crucified. Hopefully Ozzie ripped his ass a new one, so he never forgets this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 I'm sure Ozzie gave Lee a positive pep talk. Probably told him, "Look, you made a mental mistake, but this team still needs you. We all make mistakes. Nobody's perfect. Get your head outta your ass and deal with it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSFAN35 Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 C.Lee didn't make a mistake, the bag was blocked. As a fielder, until you have possession of the ball you aren't allowed to block the bag. It was a bad call by the ump, not Carlos's mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 I hope KW took the move as reason to start inquiring with other teams about their interest in this bonehead... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 C.Lee didn't make a mistake, the bag was blocked. As a fielder, until you have possession of the ball you aren't allowed to block the bag. It was a bad call by the ump, not Carlos's mistake. Ah I see. Didn't see the game till the bases were loaded at that time my fault on that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 C.Lee didn't make a mistake, the bag was blocked. As a fielder, until you have possession of the ball you aren't allowed to block the bag. It was a bad call by the ump, not Carlos's mistake. I said the same thing. In high school, I tried to do it a few times and the ump said I couldn't do it. That was awhile ago though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nokona Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 It doesn't matter, the fact is he got picked off. That's fine and dandy, but if Crede ends up grounding into a double play there would you all be saying "well it was illegal". No you'd be calling for his head, as well as i would. The thing is that it doesn't matter whether he it was Illegal or not. Had we not won, it would have been an L. And we could probably have blamed it all on Carlos, illegal or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 Go easy on Carlos. He obviously plays his ass off. He doesn't have a lackadaisical approach out there. He had a brain cramp today. Nobody's perfect. He hit .290 with 31 HR, 113 RBI, 100 R, and 18 SB last year. Remember? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 and he should have been traded in the offseason. everyone should remember my feelings on him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 Go easy on Carlos. He obviously plays his ass off. He doesn't have a lackadaisical approach out there. He had a brain cramp today. Nobody's perfect. He hit .290 with 31 HR, 113 RBI, 100 R, and 18 SB last year. Remember? And he's on pace for half that. I hope you're right and he pulls his head out of his ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDylan Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 I did see Ozzie go back to the lockerroom, as well he should have. there is ZERO excuse for being picked off in the 9th inning, and I remember it happening last year to Carlos as well. He is damned lucky that we won this game dispite his stupidity. If we lose 5-4, he gets crucified. Hopefully Ozzie ripped his ass a new one, so he never forgets this time. When the 1B covers the base like that and you slide in head first, you'll be out every time. Ozzie came out for a reason, the way that 1B covered was bush, the ump should have given CLee the base. Hawk agreed. As far as him going back to the dugout, I'm sure he just wanted to look at a tape. A lot of players do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 And he's on pace for half that. I hope you're right and he pulls his head out of his ass. We have only played 18 games. You understand that this is only 1/9 of total games to be played, correct? I have the feeling that a lot of people in here don't realize that. They're thinking that April is already over, and therefore, we're about 1/6 of the way through. Not knowing this in inexcusable. You said Carlos is on pace for half of that? He has 3 HR. What's 3 HR times 9? Like I said, inexcusable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 On the way home from the game I heard ozzies comments -- I don't remember his exact quote, but it was something like "getting picked off like that is dumb, just dumb, a dumb play" -- I remember him saying dumb 3 times very distinctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 I was really pissed, but fact is, if it wasn't for a great play by Eduardo Perez (How he blocked Lee) it wouldn't of even been close. Lee was back in plenty of time, he just couldn't get his hand past Perez's knee. Now I see a few people saying its not allowed. It may not be, could be interference. Then again, how would it be any different from a catcher blocking the plate, unless they aren't allowed to until they have the ball. IT could be one of those things that is just never called. I was so pissed though when it happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 I'm sure Ozzie gave Lee a positive pep talk. Probably told him, "Look, you made a mental mistake, but this team still needs you. We all make mistakes. Nobody's perfect. Get your head outta your ass and deal with it." And that is EXACTLY what Oz should tell CLee. Not that it's accepted or condoned, but it happened, move on, DON'T let it happen again and get back out there with your teammates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez Ghost (old) Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 C.Lee didn't make a mistake, the bag was blocked. As a fielder, until you have possession of the ball you aren't allowed to block the bag. It was a bad call by the ump, not Carlos's mistake. Carlos made a huge mistake. You can't let yourself get picked off there. I know that the 1st baseman had the base blocked, but you stop that by sliding feet first. Bobby Grich used to do this all the time at second during pickoffs - you'll sometimes hear Hawk say this, and again, you slide back feet first to make the guy pay for trying to pull a fast one on you. Carlos should buy dinner for the heroes of the 9th inning - they pulled his ass out of the fire. As for trading Carlos, let's not be hasty. He hasn't had a great start, but wasn't it about late June last year that he caught fire? I'd trade anybody in the right deal, but you don't just dump the guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 I'm not an advocate of trading lee but he is the one person who has not bought into the ozzie/small ball mentality -- Here's his situational numbers G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS Bases Empty 17 33 3 12 3 0 3 3 2 7 0 0 .364 .400 .727 1.127 Runners On 17 31 5 5 1 0 0 4 6 6 1 0 .161 .289 .194 .483 RISP 13 12 5 2 1 0 0 4 3 2 0 0 .167 .313 .250 .563 RISP w/2 Outs 8 7 3 1 0 0 0 1 0 2 0 0 .143 .143 .143 .286 Bases Loaded 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS None on/out 9 11 2 5 1 0 2 2 2 1 0 0 .455 .538 1.091 1.629 None on:1/2 Out 17 22 1 7 2 0 1 1 0 6 0 0 .318 .318 .545 .864 Men on, 2 outs 12 13 3 1 0 0 0 1 3 2 1 0 .077 .250 .077 .327 Man on 3rd, 3 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 Those numbers obviously illustrate that there is a difference in Carlos' approach at the plate when runners are on base as compared to when nobody's on. I don't know what his problem is, but he's not producing like an RBI guy should -- At the very least he should be moved out of the #5 spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 I'm not an advocate of trading lee but he is the one person who has not bought into the ozzie/small ball mentality -- Here's his situational numbers G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS Bases Empty 17 33 3 12 3 0 3 3 2 7 0 0 .364 .400 .727 1.127 Runners On 17 31 5 5 1 0 0 4 6 6 1 0 .161 .289 .194 .483 RISP 13 12 5 2 1 0 0 4 3 2 0 0 .167 .313 .250 .563 RISP w/2 Outs 8 7 3 1 0 0 0 1 0 2 0 0 .143 .143 .143 .286 Bases Loaded 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS None on/out 9 11 2 5 1 0 2 2 2 1 0 0 .455 .538 1.091 1.629 None on:1/2 Out 17 22 1 7 2 0 1 1 0 6 0 0 .318 .318 .545 .864 Men on, 2 outs 12 13 3 1 0 0 0 1 3 2 1 0 .077 .250 .077 .327 Man on 3rd, 3 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 Those numbers obviously illustrate that there is a difference in Carlos' approach at the plate when runners are on base as compared to when nobody's on. I don't know what his problem is, but he's not producing like an RBI guy should -- At the very least he should be moved out of the #5 spot. I think we found our new leadoff hitter. .455 AVG with a .538 OBP with none on, no out? Those are pretty good numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilMonkey Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 He couldn't do much worse than what we have now. I think the Sox should find out what it would take to get Crawford. He made our catchers look silly this weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 This is a tough crowd. We won the game. So what if Carlos got picked off. We win, we win. I think we'll miss his bat the day we trade Carlos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elcaballo45 Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 C.Lee didn't make a mistake, the bag was blocked. As a fielder, until you have possession of the ball you aren't allowed to block the bag. It was a bad call by the ump, not Carlos's mistake. Is that an official rule, because I thought you couldnt block any base unless it was home without the ball? What happens if you do block 1st base and the ump sees it? Carlos doesnt advance to 2nd does he? Look, Im pissed off that Carlos got picked off today, but it wasnt like he wasnt back to the bag in plenty of time, its just that he couldnt get around an entire leg blocking the bag. Carlos is known to make some plays that would make you do a look, but his hustle on other plays usually gets a . So lets give Carlos a break on this one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 26, 2004 Share Posted April 26, 2004 There is one way to stop Perez from blocking the bag, that is just as legal. Go in spikes first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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