AND THAT'S A WHITE SOX WINNER!!!

[The Ultimate Champion]

Something changed for him starting last season. He seems so comfortable always at the plate.

I think it was the offseason spent golfing. He finally figured a way out of his own head.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Nice to see some good pitching not wasted even though the Sox only got 5 hits again.

[caulfield12]

I think it was the offseason spent golfing. He finally figured a way out of his own head.

 

 

Well, it definitely hasn't worked for Gordon Beckham to get advice from everyone, but maybe Rios can help him out.

 

Konerko has tried to advise him, but he's always had his own personal psychological demons to battle in terms of the ups and downs of hitting, just like Quentin.

 

 

Edited April 25, 2013 by caulfield12

[greg775]

Nice to see some good pitching not wasted even though the Sox only got 5 hits again.

 

Your post said it all. Five hits?? Disgraceful. But the good guys win thanks to Rios and pitching.

Edited April 25, 2013 by greg775

[pettie4sox]

funny how you guys forgot the sox walked a lot yesterday...

 

b****in' just to b****...

 

soxtalk's motto.

Edited April 25, 2013 by pettie4sox

[Lillian]

Unless Dunn, or someone else gets hot, opponents will start pitching around Rios.

This team better find a productive, middle of the order, bat soon.

I have no solution, but I think that is a very serious problem.

[Kyyle23]

Unless Dunn, or someone else gets hot, opponents will start pitching around Rios.

This team better find a productive, middle of the order, bat soon.I have no solution, but I think that is a very serious problem.

 

 

We know. It is on order.

[Lillian]

We know. It is on order.

 

What are you trying to say?

Do you disagree?

Is that supposed to be funny?

Sorry, I don't understand the point of your post.

[witesoxfan]

What are you trying to say?

Do you disagree?

Is that supposed to be funny?

Sorry, I don't understand the point of your post.

 

Finding a middle of the order bat is similar to finding an ace because there aren't many of them around and to acquire them, you generally have to give up a lot. Are the Sox really at a place where acquiring a big time bat is logical? Personally, I think waiting until about Memorial Day to see if this team is going to contend takes priority over getting a big, middle of the order bat. If this team is 10 games under .500, then trading for a middle of the order bat is a really bad allocation of resources.

[Lillian]

Finding a middle of the order bat is similar to finding an ace because there aren't many of them around and to acquire them, you generally have to give up a lot. Are the Sox really at a place where acquiring a big time bat is logical? Personally, I think waiting until about Memorial Day to see if this team is going to contend takes priority over getting a big, middle of the order bat. If this team is 10 games under .500, then trading for a middle of the order bat is a really bad allocation of resources.

 

Of course, you're right, and I admit that it won't be easy. However, even if Dunn starts to hit, I don't think it's realistic to expect him to improve upon last year.

Waiting for that to happen isn't a viable option, because even if it materializes, it's not a solution. Even last year's Dunn would not represent a good enough bat to hit clean up, not with all of the strike outs, and the .200 average.

 

The Sox may have an extra starter to trade if, and when Danks comes back. If he can return to form, they would have 4 viable candidates for left handed starters;

Sale, Danks, Quintana and Santiago. It's hard to imagine that some team wouldn't be interested in acquiring a left handed starter in exchange for a decent left handed hitter.

Wouldn't the Dodgers be interested in acquiring someone like Danks to fill the void created by some of their injured starters? He could be a nice piece for their regular rotation, even after the injured arms return. They have Puig waiting to take a roster spot, and might be willing to swap Ethier's contract for Danks. He has always hit RHP really well. I'd take that deal, would you?

 

It's just seems like such a waste to have such a good pitching staff, and not be able to field a better offense.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Lillian

[Dick Allen]

Of course, you're right, and I admit that it won't be easy. However, even if Dunn starts to hit, I don't think it's realistic to expect him to improve upon last year.

Waiting for that to happen isn't a viable option, because even if it materializes, it's not a solution. Even last year's Dunn would not represent a good enough bat to hit clean up, not with all of the strike outs, and the .200 average.

 

The Sox may have an extra starter to trade if, and when Danks comes back. If he can return to form, they would have 4 viable candidates for left handed starters;

Sale, Danks, Quintana and Santiago. It's hard to imagine that some team wouldn't be interested in acquiring a left handed starter in exchange for a decent left handed hitter.

Wouldn't the Dodgers be interested in acquiring someone like Danks to fill the void created by some of their injured starters? He could be a nice piece for their regular rotation, even after the injured arms return. They have Puig waiting to take a roster spot, and might be willing to swap Ethier's contract for Danks. He has always hit RHP really well. I'd take that deal, would you?

 

It's just seems like such a waste to have such a good pitching staff, and not be able to field a better offense.

If Dunn returns to his 2012 form and a couple guys get back from injuries, the offense should be good enough to win. They were 4th in the AL in runs last season. I do agree, I don't know why Dunn is batting 3rd, 4th or 5th. I didn't understand it in 2011 or 2012. I guess the thinking is trying to have as many on base as possible when he bats in the event he doesn't strike out. When he doesn't strike out, Dunn is a .307 hitter during his White Sox career.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Dick Allen

[Eminor3rd]

If Dunn returns to his 2012 form and a couple guys get back from injuries, the offense should be good enough to win. They were 4th in the AL in runs last season. I do agree, I don't know why Dunn is batting 3rd, 4th or 5th. I didn't understand it in 2011 or 2012. I guess the thinking is trying to have as many on base as possible when he bats in the event he doesn't strike out. When he doesn't strike out, Dunn is a .307 hitter during his White Sox career.

 

Just FYI because it gives context: league average BABIP is pretty much always around .300. So, you would expect nearly all hitters to be +/- 15 points from there in a given season.

[Kyyle23]

What are you trying to say?

Do you disagree?

Is that supposed to be funny?

Sorry, I don't understand the point of your post.

 

Good lord Lillian. I am just going to be blunt, WE KNOW THAT WE NEED A GOOD MIDDLE OF THE ORDER BAT YOU DONT HAVE TO REITERATE IT IN EVERY POST THAT YOU MENTION DUNN.

 

If one fell from the sky and landed in a White Sox uniform, we would all be happy. But I am not holding my breath.

[Lillian]

Good lord Lillian. I am just going to be blunt, WE KNOW THAT WE NEED A GOOD MIDDLE OF THE ORDER BAT YOU DONT HAVE TO REITERATE IT IN EVERY POST THAT YOU MENTION DUNN.

 

If one fell from the sky and landed in a White Sox uniform, we would all be happy. But I am not holding my breath.

 

Thanks for the clarification. I know that it sounds like a "broken record", but that doesn't make it any less important.

 

My point is that Dunn has not been the answer, since his arrival. I don't care what he hits, and where he is placed in the lineup. He is not going to be the middle of the order left handed bat that is missing.

It has bothered me for a long time now that this organization has done nothing to address this problem. Sure Hahn talked about acquiring a left handed, middle of the

order bat, all during the off season, but he didn't do it.

 

All I was trying to point out in that post was that another fall out from this deficiency was likely to be teams pitching around Rios, as he is the

only dangerous bat currently in this lineup, save Konerko. Sorry, if belaboring the point, annoyed you.

 

We're probably all a little frustrated watching this horrible offense, especially when they are getting such good pitching.

 

[Dick Allen]

Just FYI because it gives context: league average BABIP is pretty much always around .300. So, you would expect nearly all hitters to be +/- 15 points from there in a given season.

Yes, but league average is well over a .179 batting average, which is what Adam is sporting in a White Sox uniform.

[caulfield12]

How does getting stuck with Andre Ethier through 2017 help things?

 

Trading a bad contract that expires in 2014 for another similar contract is one thing...but Ethier is going to be getting older and older, it's the kind of contract you would debate taking over (like Rios) if he was available as a waiver claim essentially for "free", but trading for an 820 OPS (average over the last three years) NL hitter who will be entering the downside of his career is a recipe for disaster.

 

Ethier is owed roughly twice as much as what we owe Dunn.

 

It's kind of the definition of insanity to make that trade...if Ethier's upside was a 900-1000 OPS, and he was a young hitter who could be a breakout superstar, then that's one thing. But this is the same recipe acquiring good but not great expensive/aging veterans that got the Kansas City Royals into so much trouble the past 20 years. Trying to "band aid" their way back into competition because their minor league system wasn't producing in certain areas.

 

[Lillian]

How does getting stuck with Andre Ethier through 2017 help things?

 

Trading a bad contract that expires in 2014 for another similar contract is one thing...but Ethier is going to be getting older and older, it's the kind of contract you would debate taking over (like Rios) if he was available as a waiver claim essentially for "free", but trading for an 820 OPS (average over the last three years) NL hitter who will be entering the downside of his career is a recipe for disaster.

 

Ethier is owed roughly twice as much as what we owe Dunn.

 

It's kind of the definition of insanity to make that trade...if Ethier's upside was a 900-1000 OPS, and he was a young hitter who could be a breakout superstar, then that's one thing. But this is the same recipe acquiring good but not great expensive/aging veterans that got the Kansas City Royals into so much trouble the past 20 years. Trying to "band aid" their way back into competition because their minor league system wasn't producing in certain areas.

 

I think that a lot of people under value Ethier. He is a really good hitter versus RHP. His stats are always diminished by his inability to hit lefties. That wouldn't be much of a problem in our division, as there aren't many good lefties in it.

He just turned 31 and probably has 3 or 4 good years left. The contract may look pretty bad in that last year, but he sure would solve the problem of a left handed bat.

The Sox are almost certainly going to have to look outside the organization, as there isn't a single potentially impact, left handed bat in the entire system. Therefore, it's not just a temporary problem.

Maybe the Dodgers would include a little salary relief, in exchange for bolstering their crippled starting staff.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Lillian

[caulfield12]

I think that a lot of people under value Ethier. He is a really good hitter versus RHP. His stats are always diminished by his inability to hit lefties. That wouldn't be much of a problem in our division, as there aren't many good lefties in it.

He just turned 31 and probably has 3 or 4 good years left. The contract may look pretty bad in that last year, but he sure would solve the problem of a left handed bat.

The Sox are almost certainly going to have to look outside the organization, as there isn't a single potentially impact, left handed bat in the entire system. Therefore, it's not just a temporary problem.

Maybe the Dodgers would include a little salary relief, in exchange for bolstering their crippled starting staff.

 

 

The problem is that we're 3-4 Andre Ethiers all across the line-up from being competitive, not just that one single addition.

 

When you rebuild the line-up to the point where that one acquisition puts you over the top, then fine. But you can't rebuild your roster that way, because the future payroll flexibility is completely hamstrung again (potentially) by yet another big contract.

 

 

[witesoxfan]

There is also literally no reason why Los Angeles would trade Ethier at this point.

[Lillian]

So, I guess we're just screwed.

 

[LittleHurt05]

I think that a lot of people under value Ethier. He is a really good hitter versus RHP. His stats are always diminished by his inability to hit lefties. That wouldn't be much of a problem in our division, as there aren't many good lefties in it.

He just turned 31 and probably has 3 or 4 good years left. The contract may look pretty bad in that last year, but he sure would solve the problem of a left handed bat.

The Sox are almost certainly going to have to look outside the organization, as there isn't a single potentially impact, left handed bat in the entire system. Therefore, it's not just a temporary problem.

Maybe the Dodgers would include a little salary relief, in exchange for bolstering their crippled starting staff.

 

Using that logic is how the Sox ended up in their current predicament.

[Lillian]

There is also literally no reason why Los Angeles would trade Ethier at this point.

 

I'm sorry. I'm confused. Caulfield says that Ethier's contract is horrible, and you say that the Dodgers would not trade him.

Which is it?

[Dick Allen]

So, I guess we're just screwed.

If the Sox have a shot, they will find something. I was really surprised Hahn didn't put his stamp on the team this past winter. He probably wishes he did now, but it's hard to make trades for significant players this early. Teams don't want their fanbases to think they are giving up on the season 20 games in.

[Balta1701]

I'm sorry. I'm confused. Caulfield says that Ethier's contract is horrible, and you say that the Dodgers would not trade him.

Which is it?

The Dodgers don't care about money right now. For any team that does, ever, that is a horrible contract. That may well be a horrible contract for the Dodgers in a year.

[Kyyle23]

I'm sorry. I'm confused. Caulfield says that Ethier's contract is horrible, and you say that the Dodgers would not trade him.

Which is it?

 

It can be both. And it is.