Adolfo out for 2019

[Jack Parkman]

9 minutes ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

With a .376 OBP and an .826 OPS.  And that's with him getting off to a slow start.

People would still be throwing out massive amounts of hyperbole. 

[Lip Man 1]

From Rick Hahn today:

“This is an unfortunate side effect sometimes of Tommy John, in terms of the scar tissue build up as well as issues that develop with the nerve,” said Hahn of Adolfo, who had Tommy John in ’18. “Both of these are highly fixable, so we remain very optimistic on his full recovery and returning to us without restriction.”

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

7 hours ago, bmags said:

brutal. 

Shouldn't that say out for the remainder of 2019 ?

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Watch Adolfo turn in to Jose Martinez at some point. Martinez was in the system for 7 years, never made it past AA, then we let him go and he bounces around a couple of times for other teams in AA and AAA and then finally makes the majors in his late 20s and becomes a highly productive offensive player. Now a career .313 hitter with a 139 wRC+ in 311 career games.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

7 hours ago, ptatc said:

I would disagree. However, I'm a little biased working i the field.

You mean as opposed to the person you quoted who just says crap to get a reaction without any knowledge of Herm, his staff or no medical knowledge whatsoever.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

5 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

This is kind of a bad take. 

Among many of the hot takes, yeesh, this place is becoming a cesspool.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

8 hours ago, fathom said:

Is this where I question what the hell the training staff is doing?

Did you ever have any kind of injury ? Did you blame everyone but yourself ?

[Moan4Yoan]

1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Did you ever have any kind of injury ? Did you blame everyone but yourself ?

When you get to this number in the past two seasons, there might be a common theme.

Edited May 14, 2019 by Harper2Sox

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

18 minutes ago, Harper2Sox said:

When you get to this number in the past two seasons, there might be a common theme.

The common theme is they play a grueling sport. This isn't some 9-5 job where the bosses have all kinds of rules on how to do your job safely. It's a sport that involves running, jumping, throwing ,diving,crashing into walls, sliding, getting hit with pitches, and collisions with other players. There are no safety rules. What exactly is a training staff supposed to do to prevent injuries ? He tried to come back from TJ . That is not always a sure thing when you try to compete at a high level. The kid is only 22, to hear how he is disparaged as a non prospect is utter nonsense. Are Burger, Kopech and Dunning non prospects ? Kopech and Dunning will have to go through the same thing as Burdi and Adolfo , We can only hope they fare better because the training staff will follow the same things for recovering as every team does. Was Robert a non prospect when he couldn't stay healthy ? Robert is only a year younger than Adolfo.

Maybe baseball players should play with all kinds of padding like football players do.

Edited May 14, 2019 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[ptatc]

2 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

You mean as opposed to the person you quoted who just says crap to get a reaction without any knowledge of Herm, his staff or no medical knowledge whatsoever.

he does have a medical background. his experiences have just been greatly different than mine.

[ptatc]

3 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

From Rick Hahn today:

“This is an unfortunate side effect sometimes of Tommy John, in terms of the scar tissue build up as well as issues that develop with the nerve,” said Hahn of Adolfo, who had Tommy John in ’18. “Both of these are highly fixable, so we remain very optimistic on his full recovery and returning to us without restriction.”

Yep it's a scope debridement of scar tissue. usually they do an ulnar nerve transposition when they do a UCL reconstruction and the nerve is no longer an issue. Either they didnt do one or there was massive scarring.

These aren't common issues but they do happen. He is just lucky!

[poppysox]

10 hours ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

With a .376 OBP and an .826 OPS.  And that's with him getting off to a slow start.

He still looks better playing for 15 million instead of 30.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

7 hours ago, Harper2Sox said:

When you get to this number in the past two seasons, there might be a common theme.

No, there's really not.

95% of pitching arm abuse takes place before professional baseball - that number might be closer to 99% actually. All you can do is be consistent as an organization. 

Most arm injuries are not preventative.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

12 hours ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

With a .376 OBP and an .826 OPS.  And that's with him getting off to a slow start.

The problem with Harper is he doesn't produce much value outside of his bat and his bat has been incredibly streaky. IF Bryce Harper never returns to the peak for him showed 3 years ago his contract will not be worth the money. A guy middling between an 820-920 ops every year with no other value added is not worth 30 million a year. Harper needs to be one of the 5-10 best hitters in baseball year in and year out.

At this point his one peak season feels more like an outlier than his peak value.

[Wanne]

13 hours ago, SoxAce said:

Hmm....  let's see... and this is just based off my memory. 

Broken leg (surgery)

Fractured hamate bone (surgery)

UCL tear (surgery)

Now elbow again (surgery)

 

I can't remember if he fucked his shoulder up too and needed surgery on that, but you get the picture. 

Aaaah...I forgot about the broken leg. Well shit...not much more to break...it's all good from here lol.  Still too young...and way too talented to give up on IMO.

[ptatc]

36 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

No, there's really not.

95% of pitching arm abuse takes place before professional baseball - that number might be closer to 99% actually. All you can do is be consistent as an organization. 

Most arm injuries are not preventative.

most arm injuries can be prevented and most are. This run may seem like a lot of injuries but it always amazes me how the majority of pitchers don't  need some type of surgery.

Most pitchers are in the training room constantly having something done. If they only pitched when everything felt good, we wouldn't play many games.

This is why when people make the comment that "how did they not know he was hurt", it's silly. This is why the handling of pitchers soreness and injuries is so difficult. 

Overhand throwing just isn't a motion that our arm especially the shoulder is really designed to do.

although I do agree that much if the stress on the arm is early on, but we are getting better at it.

Edited May 14, 2019 by ptatc

[ptatc]

40 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

No, there's really not.

95% of pitching arm abuse takes place before professional baseball - that number might be closer to 99% actually. All you can do is be consistent as an organization. 

Most arm injuries are not preventative.

part of the issue is also that the medical profession hasn't quite figured out how to deal with the "new" pitcher. in the past elbow issues were linked to poor mechanics on off speed pitches. Now with the new emphasis on velocity and not pacing, the % of fastball use is linked to elbow injuries.  It's a difficult situation especially with the success rate of UCL reconstruction,  the mindset is "I'll be back in a year."

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

21 minutes ago, ptatc said:

most arm injuries can be prevented and most are. This run may seem like a lot of injuries but it always amazes me how the majority of pitchers don't  need some type of surgery.

Most pitchers are in the training room constantly having something done. If they only pitched when everything felt good, we wouldn't play many games.

This is why when people make the comment that "how did they not know he was hurt", it's silly. This is why the handling of pitchers soreness and injuries is so difficult. 

Overhand throwing just isn't a motion that our arm especially the shoulder is really designed to do.

although I do agree that much if the stress on the arm is early on, but we are getting better at it.

The problem is high school and college coaches are paid to win - not develop. Many coaches will win at the cost of a kids health. The only way to protect the kids is to put in wear and tear rules for coaches. If no one holds them accountable nothing will change. It's ironic and absurd that MLB and MiLB teams baby arms more than high school and college coaches. I cant even count how many times a starter went over 130 pitches in a game in my college career. 

[Balta1701]

56 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The problem with Harper is he doesn't produce much value outside of his bat and his bat has been incredibly streaky. IF Bryce Harper never returns to the peak for him showed 3 years ago his contract will not be worth the money. A guy middling between an 820-920 ops every year with no other value added is not worth 30 million a year. Harper needs to be one of the 5-10 best hitters in baseball year in and year out.

At this point his one peak season feels more like an outlier than his peak value.

A .910 OPS last year would have been one of the 10 best hitters in baseball. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

14 minutes ago, ptatc said:

part of the issue is also that the medical profession hasn't quite figured out how to deal with the "new" pitcher. in the past elbow issues were linked to poor mechanics on off speed pitches. Now with the new emphasis on velocity and not pacing, the % of fastball use is linked to elbow injuries.  It's a difficult situation especially with the success rate of UCL reconstruction,  the mindset is "I'll be back in a year."

Yes, it's funny how we had thought for so long that it was the snap of the elbow with off speed stuff that greatly increased stress on the arm.. turns out velocity is more correlated to arm injuries than any off speed stuff. 

Also, while we feel that arm injuries have greatly increased the last two decades, it's actually likely that it did not. The difference is that arms used to be kept in the minors longer, there wasnt in depth prospect analysis, and most pitchers (by the time they reached the big leagues) had already shown an ability to stay healthy for an extended period of time. The ones who couldnt were simply out of baseball before anyone saw or heard of them.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

A .910 OPS last year would have been one of the 10 best hitters in baseball. 

His wRC+ last year was 17th in baseball - right with Khris Davis and Nelson Cruz. He needs to be better than that to warrant his pay.

[ptatc]

24 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The problem is high school and college coaches are paid to win - not develop. Many coaches will win at the cost of a kids health. The only way to protect the kids is to put in wear and tear rules for coaches. If no one holds them accountable nothing will change. It's ironic and absurd that MLB and MiLB teams baby arms more than high school and college coaches. I cant even count how many times a starter went over 130 pitches in a game in my college career. 

no doubt. we are getting better at educated them but I needs to get better.

[ptatc]

23 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yes, it's funny how we had thought for so long that it was the snap of the elbow with off speed stuff that greatly increased stress on the arm.. turns out velocity is more correlated to arm injuries than any off speed stuff. 

Also, while we feel that arm injuries have greatly increased the last two decades, it's actually likely that it did not. The difference is that arms used to be kept in the minors longer, there wasnt in depth prospect analysis, and most pitchers (by the time they reached the big leagues) had already shown an ability to stay healthy for an extended period of time. The ones who couldnt were simply out of baseball before anyone saw or heard of them.

the off speed stuff was more the cause in the past.  its only the change in the current pitching philosophy of throw as hard as you can for as long as you can that changed it. Up until very recently pitchers were taught to pace themselves for 7 to 9 innings and only throw your best velocity when you need it. Its changed in today's game.

[Lip Man 1]

10 hours ago, Harper2Sox said:

When you get to this number in the past two seasons, there might be a common theme.

Actually it is the past three seasons if you include the big league team.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

6 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The problem with Harper is he doesn't produce much value outside of his bat and his bat has been incredibly streaky. IF Bryce Harper never returns to the peak for him showed 3 years ago his contract will not be worth the money. A guy middling between an 820-920 ops every year with no other value added is not worth 30 million a year. Harper needs to be one of the 5-10 best hitters in baseball year in and year out.

At this point his one peak season feels more like an outlier than his peak value.

Harper produces a lot of value for a franchise off the field in regards to marketing and public relations.