2014 Draft class

[The Ultimate Champion]

Rather have Pentecost over Nola too.

[The Ultimate Champion]

Why does no one consider it going the other way, that in 2 years the White Sox have a successful contributor in the middle/upper half of their order and the high schooler drafted by the Cubs/Twins is having TJS?

We can get a successful contributor with the 2nd round pick. There are no guarantees on any of them, so go big here.

Edited June 5, 2014 by The Ultimate Champion

[DirtySox]

New BA Mock. Has Sox taking Kolek, but they are deciding between him and Nola.

 

http://www.baseballamerica.com/draft/mock-...ooks-like-no-1/

 

3. WHITE SOX: The White Sox are believed to be deciding between Texas prep righty Tyler Kolek and Nola, who would be a fast-moving righthanded complement to ace Chris Sale. Past Sox selections indicate a preference for college arms such as Nola, but Kolek is the kind of player who breaks molds.

Projected Pick: RHP Tyler Kolek

[Balta1701]

We can get a successful contributor with the 2nd round pick. There are no guarantees on any of them, so go big here.

But what happens if the Cubs's or Twins's 2nd round pick becomes a star? How terrible would that be!

[flavum]

Why does no one consider it going the other way, that in 2 years the White Sox have a successful contributor in the middle/upper half of their order and the high schooler drafted by the Cubs/Twins is having TJS?

 

No one? Of course that could happen.

 

As long as it isn't Hawk talking Jerry out of allowing the rest of the front office from taking the guy they really want (maybe Kolek), then there really isn't a "wrong" pick.

 

Crap Shoot.

[NorthSideSox72]

Going to create some PHT threads later, but for now, combining the discussion threads in here. Sorry for the dust while I rearrange.

 

[southsider2k5]

As long as they don't start trying to sell or spin it as a "bargain" at #3.

 

For the 19th pick and his MLB results so far, Michael Wacha qualifies in every sense of the word. I think it would be pretty unrealistic to expect Nola to be even better than Wacha, and especially so quickly.

 

Everyone will say the same thing. "The top player we had on our draft board", and if they sign underslot, they also give us "flexibility".

[southsider2k5]

Nola is the kind of talent you can acquire out of another organization at the AA/AAA level in a trade. We could get a similar or better player out of Alexei and probably another piece. What a massive waste it would be to use the #3 to get the type of talent you already have the pieces for. 1 of Aiken, Kolek, Rodon will be there for sure, and if Jackson goes to MIA then 2 will be there. There is zero reason to take Nola, that's just punting the pick. Upside, upside, upside all day, and "ceiling of #2" when it's all said and done probably means "#3/#4."

 

God damn it Sox don't f*** this thing up. We're not going to be picking this high again for a while, maybe not in a very long time.

 

#2/#3 pitchers are easy to acquire? What?

 

And trading a top level SS to get a pitcher isn't "easy", that is pretty big commitment.

[GGajewski18]

Why no talk of Rodon? If it goes Aiken, Jackson, Coop liked Rodon second

[southsider2k5]

Nola is the kind of talent you can acquire out of another organization at the AA/AAA level in a trade. We could get a similar or better player out of Alexei and probably another piece. What a massive waste it would be to use the #3 to get the type of talent you already have the pieces for. 1 of Aiken, Kolek, Rodon will be there for sure, and if Jackson goes to MIA then 2 will be there. There is zero reason to take Nola, that's just punting the pick. Upside, upside, upside all day, and "ceiling of #2" when it's all said and done probably means "#3/#4."

 

God damn it Sox don't f*** this thing up. We're not going to be picking this high again for a while, maybe not in a very long time.

 

In 2014 having a cheap, cost-controlled, mid-rotation starter is a huge deal for a team. That saves them eight figures+ per year versus if they actually had to go out and bring one in off of the free agent market.

[Soxfest]

Nola at #3 would be a reach.

[Eminor3rd]

In 2014 having a cheap, cost-controlled, mid-rotation starter is a huge deal for a team. That saves them eight figures+ per year versus if they actually had to go out and bring one in off of the free agent market.

 

But you can do better at #3 overall.

[NorthSideSox72]

We now have both the pinned picks thread and a discussion thread, pinned in PHT, if you want to head over there. Might close this one so the discussion stays single-threaded. Advance warning on that.

 

And here is the Draft Tracker link, it is up but empty right now.

 

[caulfield12]

Well, it's easy in the sense that the White Sox "stole" Quintana from the Yankees for nothing.

 

And stole Contreras for next to nothing in a fading Loiaza.

 

 

I still think of Aiken and Nola as guys who MOST LIKELY will be 2/3 starters and Rodon and Kolek as potential aces. In this situation, you have to roll the dice on whichever of them you prefer.

 

The Astros believe Kolek could contribute as early as 2016, fwiw.

 

 

[harfman77]

Tweet from Rodons aunt apparently, though it was interesting the pick range she included:

 

Tonight's main #event is the #mlbDraft where our nephew @CarlosRodon16 is one of the top 3 picks!!!…

[bmags]

You know, this whole time, the sox continued to be in on Nola. I don't necessarily trust their scouts judgement, but I do think it's possible they actually believe he is the best pick at 3 if Rodon/Aiken are indeed gone.

[southsider2k5]

But you can do better at #3 overall.

 

You can probably get a higher ceiling, but you probably aren't getting a higher floor or lower bust potential.

[Buehrle>Wood]

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?sh...p;#entry2991644

 

Time to lock this thread up

[ptatc]

Why is Kolek falling?

Because the Sox will take a college pitcher at this position in the draft.

[The Ultimate Champion]

In 2014 having a cheap, cost-controlled, mid-rotation starter is a huge deal for a team. That saves them eight figures+ per year versus if they actually had to go out and bring one in off of the free agent market.

They just claimed Noesi off waivers for free, he has the chance to be a #3. Floyd had a way higher ceiling when the Sox got him (true ace ceiling) & Gio (another top young starter) out of one year of a depleted Freddy Garcia. Danks went for McCarthy who was also drafted in the later rounds, Hudson came as IIRC as a 5th rounder. Jose Quintana, MiLB FA. Garland for Karchner, who might we have gotten for Reed? Nestor Molina was a best but we easily could have gotten a similar type of pitcher out of Santos had we actually called around and did some scouting work before pulling the trigger on that one. And here's a blast from the past: we could have signed Ervin Santana, also a #3, for only money if we wanted to forfeit the second rounder. How the f*** are you going to value your second rounder so highly and then go take a guy like Nola at #3?

 

Etc.

 

These guys are out there all over the place. When you are in an extremely fortunate position, as the Sox are in currently, and you have the ability to take a guy who has the ability to be a world beater you f***ing do it.

 

If Aiken and Rodon are both gone then Kolek and Jackson will be there. No reason to take Nola over either of those guys. Also IMO no reason to take a Nola over a Pentecost or Gordon either.

 

So what, maybe you get another Borchard out of it and you miss. At least you took a shot. At least you tried to pay the game. Nola is a forfeit.

[southsider2k5]

They just claimed Noesi off waivers for free, he has the chance to be a #3. Floyd had a way higher ceiling when the Sox got him (true ace ceiling) & Gio (another top young starter) out of one year of a depleted Freddy Garcia. Danks went for McCarthy who was also drafted in the later rounds, Hudson came as IIRC as a 5th rounder. Jose Quintana, MiLB FA. Garland for Karchner, who might we have gotten for Reed? Nestor Molina was a best but we easily could have gotten a similar type of pitcher out of Santos had we actually called around and did some scouting work before pulling the trigger on that one. And here's a blast from the past: we could have signed Ervin Santana, also a #3, for only money if we wanted to forfeit the second rounder. How the f*** are you going to value your second rounder so highly and then go take a guy like Nola at #3?

 

Etc.

 

These guys are out there all over the place. When you are in an extremely fortunate position, as the Sox are in currently, and you have the ability to take a guy who has the ability to be a world beater you f***ing do it.

 

If Aiken and Rodon are both gone then Kolek and Jackson will be there. No reason to take Nola over either of those guys. Also IMO no reason to take a Nola over a Pentecost or Gordon either.

 

So what, maybe you get another Borchard out of it and you miss. At least you took a shot. At least you tried to pay the game. Nola is a forfeit.

 

You are proving my point. It took $14.1 million to get a mid rotation starter, or more, on this free agent market. Or you can get one under control for 6 years, the first 3-4 years which will cost you under $2 million. In terms of utilization of resources, it is a no brainer. There is also a pretty good chance it frees up another chunk of cash to bring in another higher rated prospect in your next couple of rounds of picks when you couldn't have afforded it before.

[The Ultimate Champion]

You can probably get a higher ceiling, but you probably aren't getting a higher floor or lower bust potential.

You take Kolek then, get a year out of him in the minors, then shop him around when a team like the Marlins make a Stanton available, etc. If you're really all that worried you can at least put yourself in position to acquire a massively valuable trade piece that most other teams cannot match.

 

You put Nola out there as a trade piece, other teams can match or beat that depending on fit/need. Nola will probably slot somewhere in the mid range of top-100 prospect lists mainly due to polish and floor, Kolek OTOH after one dominate year in the minors is going to put himself in the top-10, maybe top-3 or 5 depending on how dominant he is and what his secondary stuff looks like in the minors.

[harfman77]

But you can do better at #3 overall.

 

#3 Overall picks since 2000

 

2000 - Luis Montanez - SS - HS - Cubs - ML utility player

2001 - Dewon Brazelton - RHP - MTSU - TB - Marginal reliever

2002 - Christopher Gruler - RHP - HS - Reds - Never made it past A-

2003 - Kyle Sleeth - RHP - Wake Forest - Tigers - Never made it past AA

2004 - Phillip Humber - RHP - Rice - Mets - ML 5th starter

2005 - Jeff Clement - C - USC - Mariners - AAAA player

2006 - Evan Longoria - 3B - CSLB - TB - Perennial All-Star

2007 - Josh Vitters - 3B - HS - Cubs - Turbulent career, hitting .208 in AAA this season

2008 - Eric Hosmer - 1B - HS - Royals - Up and down, looks to be at least a ML regular going forward

2009 - Donovan Tate - CF - HS - Padres - Out of baseball

2010 - Manny Machado - SS - HS - Orioles - At least ML regular, probably perennial All-Star

2011 - Trevor Bauer - RHP - UCLA - Dbacks - In his third stint on a ML roster, though it likes he might stick this time

2012 - Mike Zunino - C - Florida - Mariners - ML regular

2013 - Jon Gray - RHP - Oklahoma - Rockies - On his way to a September call-up, career is still a ?

 

Theres been a lot more swings and misses than home runs at number 3. If you can save some money and get a guy like Nola who most consider to have a #2 ceiling with a #5 floor and then go after someone that slips like Spencer Adams or perhaps grab Mitch Keller in the 3rd with an overslot deal.

[caulfield12]

After a slow indoctrination in 2012, Nola emerged as a weekend starter after a dazzling eight-inning effort against Tulane 13 games into his freshman season when he limited the Green Wave to three hits and fired 25 consecutive strikes in one stretch.

 

He was just getting warmed up.

 

Eventually Nola climbed into the weekend rotation and finished with a 7-4 record, providing the foundation for one of the most dominant two-year stretches for a pitcher in LSU history.

 

As a sophomore Nola was 12-1, not suffering a loss until the College World Series. This season he was 11-1, the lone blemish coming when he allowed a pair of solo home runs in a 2-1 loss at Florida.

 

With the dust settling on his three-year run at LSU, Nola finished 30-6 (tied for fifth in career wins) with 345 strikeouts (third) and a 2.09 ERA (tied for fourth). Nola walked only 52 batters in 332 innings, logged seven complete games and was a part of 13 shutouts.

 

"I've never played with a pitcher as dominant as he has been," said LSU junior Tyler Moore, a fellow Baton Rouge native who has played with or against Nola for over 10 years. "There was never a time when he went out there that we didn't feel like we were going to win the game."

 

Which started with Nola's personality, approach and the way he was raised, Tigers' coach Paul Mainieri said.

 

Like his older brother Austin Nola, a four-year starter at shortstop for LSU (playing in AA ball for the Marlins), the kid brother never took anything for granted.

 

Always lauded as one of the hardest workers on the pitching staff, Nola set a follow-my-example tone from the time he stepped into the shoes as a leader last season.

 

"Those guys know I'm not a big rah-rah guy who's going to say a lot," Nola said. "If I have something to say to somebody, it's usually just me and him."

 

Don't mistake Nola's quiet nature and low-key, business-like style for not being competitive, though. Far from it.

 

Tigers pitching coach Alan Dunn has been with Nola from Day 1 at LSU. Dunn was hired following the 2011 season and arrived on campus full-time a few weeks after Nola enrolled.

 

From the beginning, the two clicked.

 

And Dunn, maybe better than anyone else, sees a different level of intensity from the talented right-hander.

 

"You'd better believe he's as competitive as he can be," Dunn said. "You can't be as good as he is and not want to win every pitch and every at-bat. He knows how to keep it in check, and that's one of the reasons he's been so good. He doesn't get too high or too low."

 

That also ties into Nola's readiness for whatever level he winds up at next and beyond.

 

Dunn spent 22 years as a pitching coach and roving instructor for major league franchises and has worked with pitchers on the rise at all levels.

 

When he talks about Nola, he ticks off the list of items the 6-foot-1 fireballer already possesses.

 

The raw skill -- "stuff" in the baseball vernacular -- has been there for years. Pitchability, or the skill of throwing any pitch he wants in any count has been mastered. Velocity, check. Curveball, check. Changeup, check.

 

Perhaps as much as anything else, coachability is also in place for Nola. The relationship between he and Dunn blossomed from the beginning because when Dunn suggested something, Nola absorbed it, was willing to try it and then talk about whether it worked well or not.

 

LSU pitching coach Alan Dunn (right) didn't make too many visits to the mound in Aaron Nola's three years, because the two were almost always on the same page.

 

The urban legend of Nola never once shaking off a pitch Dunn called?

 

"That is true," Dunn said with a smile. "But that's not because he was worried about upsetting me. It's because we think so much alike."

 

....

 

 

Former LSU star Ben McDonald, a No. 1 pick in the 1989 draft, agrees. He has watched Nola blossom into arguably the Tigers' best since he starred for them.

 

"Nola has been the best pitcher in college baseball the last two years," McDonald said. "His ability to command the strike zone has been unmatched. He will be talked about at LSU for many years to come. I think he will be a quick mover in pro ball and would not surprise me if he was in the big leagues next year."

 

Another scout said earlier this season that Nola was good enough to step into the back of a big league rotation. Right now.

 

That's not a notion Nola is ready to embrace. He won't run away from it either, though.

 

........

 

The thing that separates him from most is a humility that tempers that competitive drive Dunn has seen up close and personal.

 

"I've got a lot of work to do before I'm ready for anything past this level," Nola said. "When you get up there, the strike zone is a lot different -- a lot smaller. And everybody you face can hit and hurt you if you make a mistake."

 

http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2014/06/...ml#incart_river

[NorthSideSox72]

Thread closed, please go to the PHT thread for further discussion. Want to keep things single-threaded.