LDF

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 9, 2014 -> 02:51 PM) Are they still interested even after acquiring McCarthy? better yet, now with McCarthy, are they willing to make anymore trades.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 9, 2014 -> 02:50 PM) I wonder which route Toronto is going to take. The expensive long term route with Hill or Prado, or somewhat cheaper and better defensively Beckham. tor like sea does not have the bank to look at the expense, they, tor like stl, have liked beckham. I remember mentioning this several months ago. however to get the trade done with tor I wonder if we offer cash for a bigger rtn in prospects. secondly sweetening the deal with another player.... but then again maybe not.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Jul 9, 2014 -> 02:47 PM) This. Right now, the most important thing the Sox can do is develop young players. If Flowers' defensive skill as a catcher his helping the pitching staff develop, then you let him continue doing that the rest of the season. In 2015, Nieto can go to AAA, Flowers can become the backup catcher and somebody else gets the starting role. the catching position is a premium position and find a player to man is hard. teams with catching prospects are prob asking for a lot, too much for the sox to pay. getting one thru fa is maybe the route to go, however the org may have to suffer with what they have. acquire thru trades, and draft until the sox can find one.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jul 9, 2014 -> 02:09 PM) Also, have to fully disagree with caufield here. First, the system looks better now than it did just a few months ago, purely on some key guys improving. And that is reflected in the fact that after very slow starts, all four full-season affiliates are starting the second half as contenders in their divisions (if not in 1st place). That's even with injuries to guys like Anderson, Hawkins and Montas. Plenty of interesting bats showing well lately. As for Angel Sanchez being the 2nd best pitching prospect in the minors, I'm going to have to go with... LOL. The system does seriously lack pitching talent depth, no doubt about that. But I could easily list 10 arms more interesting to me than Sanchez right now. let me add, I went and look at the past "2013 top 20 prospect" in the future sox ranking, compared it to what the sox have now, it is a vast improvement. the sox add some good to very good draft picks, pick up some good int prospects, and the system is looking vey good. the majors look surprisingly very good with the addition of Jose A. now with the trading season approaching, and if a good deal is there, I wouldn't be surprise if the sox doesn't get better.

all that was said was quite right, the premise is / was how to respond to whomever the JR was continuing to in invest money or something to that effect. the only way JR puts more money into the sox org is to buy out a partner and to strengthen his position. both clubs, as it stands now, without knowing the true financial, are in great shape. can you imagine if JR had let say, the yanks bankroll or the dodgers, would JR still handle the club the same way?

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 8, 2014 -> 04:11 AM) Except the Red Sox suck, are flat and in last place now in the AL East. And that was Dunn's first HR/RBI since the Giants series. Finally, Buchholz had a 6+ ERA coming into the game. whomever thinks that the red sox will trade to be a buyer is sadly mistaken. they are already rumored in trying to trade to be sellers.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 8, 2014 -> 03:59 AM) How in the world are Carroll and Hector capable of this? These type of games, and Viciedo's performance on this road trip are times you think the Sox actually have a good managerial and coaching staff. WTF is with this team? Is it a good team or horses***? It never can completely make up its mind. You remember the pathetic sweep at Minnie, pathetic sweep at home against KC and performance vs. the Angels. with games like today, it gets the fans in a believing mode of we can do it..... or at least make the wildcard.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 8, 2014 -> 04:55 AM) Viciedo doesn't have the dramatic splits vs. RHP/LHP as in years past. You're basically saying he's worth less than Jeff Keppinger, Scott Downs and about the same as Paulino. Not buying it. We've been able to find useful pieces in Guerra, Carroll, Putnam and Noesi without giving up a thing for them. We developed Petrick and Webb internally. Why would we give up our 3rd best power hitter and an everyday position player for that? If this was a case of Joe Borchard for Matt Thornton, sure. Or Guerrier for Damaso Marte. if DV can be traded for a 3 / 4 type of pitcher either in low A or a pit that is 24 / 25 and the team does not have a spot for him.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Jul 8, 2014 -> 04:41 AM) Good post. I couldn't agree more. Not to mention it can open up additional $$ to use on other areas of weakness. the big question here is IF rodon signs with the soxs.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 8, 2014 -> 03:39 AM) I don't think he legally could even do that. It'd be explicitly against the financial interests of the other Bulls shareholders. is that a corgi you have a your pict????

first in the world of investment, there so many loop holes to exploit to keep investors investing, with some much tax breaks. in addition, the tax law are soooo complex you need a great tax acct / lawyer to keep everything smooth. 1. JR with a group of investors own the bulls and sox. 2. is it legal or not to use your money for the investment to invest in another company? 3. there must be some disclosure that make sure these owners are in uppity up. 4. now here is where it gets tricky, if the bulls are make huge cash, take your share and re-invest it in a not so profitable venture or to strengthen your position. you will need to do something with that profit or face stiff taxes. 5. if you re-invest you not only miss the tax levy, but you will get a tax break. 6. the league, whichever league you are talking about will not let you failed unless you are a complete idiot. 7. owning the company for so long, most of the overhead and initial invest is even now and now the worth of the franchise is huge. lastly, is it legal or illegal for an owner to reinvest his own money to strengthen his position? but then again what the hell do I know..... nada

QUOTE (almagest @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 08:17 PM) New posters must post a thread with their outlandish trade propositions and unrealistic complete lineup and starting rotation overhauls. This is a good starting point for ideas. mine will be JR will invite Scott B over for dinner and drinks and discuss world politics.

QUOTE (woods of ypres @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 08:06 PM) I don't claim to be the master of the advanced stats, but: Since May 24th: 2.65 ERA/4.29 FIP/4.52 xFIP/4.42 SIERA and a .241 BABIP (career average is .287, btw) That ERA is misleading. I say sell while he has value. if the sox do not get Rodon, I think keeping Dank is a foregone conclusion.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 08:02 PM) Man this is brutal. I feel bad for all parties involved. man, here was the player I thought the sox will end up with.

QUOTE (venom4789 @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 05:03 PM) Boras is going to be burned by a team soon and i hope its the white sox. I understand its his job to get the most money possible for his players but the price he is asking is ridiculous. I would love the white sox to put their offer public and force boras to make a decision, Over slightly above slot and dont budge from there. There is no reason at all we should go way over slot and lose a draft pick because of it. With us able to get compensation if he chooses to go back to school its not like we are losing out, and there will be more pitchers available next draft. I get the feeling boras is telling rodon he will get paid a lot of money over slot and the white sox will cave. I wonder what rodon will do if we say this is our offer take it or go back to school. Will he really be willing to risk an injury to try to make more money next draft when in all honesty there really isnt more money to be made. I also wouldnt be suprised if this is the last boras client we work with either way the situation works out. 1. it will be not advisable to exactly say what the number are. other teams, players and agents will prob think it bad. 2. the sox, if talking to Borass, should not spill the beans no matter how tempting it might be. look at the flak det got for doing it. now I may be flamed for calling Rodon agent that and so what. other poster said worst and it is not a 10 yr thing to say..... ok.... so much for my little flame.... I blame the sox .... how many time are the sox going to play with Scott B, and get burned. the slot money is one thing, going over slot is another. Rodon camp have said they wanted more than the slot. second leading to this show - down, BorAss have said that he thought the slot was unfair and if I remember correctly he was to test the rules, or something to that effect. ok, the sox will pick a comp pick at #4 (1 pick later than before). then they have the other pick, assuming how the season is going may be top 15. Questions. with the #4 pick it has to be sign and delivered. does the second top 15 pick, need to be used as well what happen if that player doesn't sign. next question, what will happen to Rodon if he goes independent, will he be a free agent or does he go back to the draft?

QUOTE (scs787 @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 07:57 PM) I've noticed. Welcome aboard Venom. WELCOME !!! To the best sports msg board around.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 02:51 PM) First of all, I doubt the difference is $250-500K. I'm guessing the difference at this point is closer to $1-2 mill. If it were as small as the original numbers, they'd take a few hours and iron out their differences. Also, if I were Rick Hahn, I'd counter with "You are getting $6 milllion. If you think he's going to get significantly more than that next year, you're crazy." I say you are right if not more. i remember some numbers bouncing around 8 - 9 million. but with the way all info was being thrown around, i am prob wrong.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 02:39 PM) If I was Boras, I would just say two words. "Manny Ramirez (Scott Downs/Jeff Keppinger/Felipe Paulino). You're going to quibble over $250-500,000 over your future frontline starter, c'mon Rick Hahn. You went to Kellogg School and Harvard Law. You're not dumb. The White Sox need Carlos Rodon as much as he needs them. Besides, nobody's coming to games as it is, and you already have two of the top ten players in baseball. Plus, I know you're not going to spend $100+ million in free agency, Carlos is your best chance to have a winner again on the SouthSide." I would reply, Free Agents and going back to school for another yr and draft again.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 7, 2014 -> 12:02 AM) Which is why you think about making a trade early, to avoid getting to that point. and as I said, I am not oppose to trading, only if we can get back a decent not top value back. I am not asking for their top 2 or 3 prospects. I am asking for fair value. if the value is not there, screw the trade. I am otta of here for the night.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:58 PM) This has to be some kind of joke. It's why I take all the defensive metrics with a grain of salt until they figure out a way to improve them. I am still new to this metrics and all. but if you say you take the defensive metrics with a grain of salt, do you take the others metrics with a grain of salt as well?

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:57 PM) We control his rights for three more years, should we so choose to. We can certainly non-tender him, but Hahn had that option with DeAza and Beckham this past offseason and didn't go that route. and by next yr, a good argument can be made to non tender.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:56 PM) Or you can make the argument we should sign Chase Utley for $10 million and leave Viciedo in the mix...not trade Ramirez, add a veteran starter and figure out SOME WAY to replace Flowers. If Rodon's on the timetable everyone is suggesting, he's going to factor in next year...despite the lack of an announcement about his signing yet today (doubt we'll hear anything that takes away from ASG selections, maybe tmrw?) lets acquire more pieces to fix the puzzle, then let see what we have. I still say, by this time next yr, (ASG) the sox will know what the team needs to get to the next level.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:53 PM) with the numbers he's putting up this year? even with the numbers. imo we need 1 more yr of rebuilding to be done.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:49 PM) That's not how this works and you know that. He's going to get something near $5 million next offseason if he's offered. I am sorry, you are right, I was typing too fast and forgot I sentence. I have no problem to let him walk after his contract is up. again, I would like to revisit the trade options during the offseason, if we can not get a good rtn. sea needs this trade the sox can live without making the trade.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:47 PM) That's one reason why I'm hesitant to say "yes we absolutely need to move him". But just ask yourself this question. What are we likely to get better production out of next year, Micah Johnson/carlos Sanchez at 2b and a >$10 million FA signing or Viciedo + Beckham? As of right now, I'd say the former, and that means if I can get something for those guys and save another $1-2 million this year...it's at least worth serious consideration. however I have no problem putting DV at dh and let him hit.