SCCWS

QUOTE (Charlie Haeger's Knuckles @ Jun 29, 2015 -> 08:15 PM) I am surprised there hasn't been a "....if AJ was on the team...." thread yet. Catchers make good managers.

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Jun 29, 2015 -> 06:44 PM) We gave up Phegley (along with Semien, Bassit, Ravelo) for Shark. And Phegley has been better than every White Sox position player including Abreu (according to Fangraphs). But now you are getting a 2 month rental. That lowers the value considerably. Besides his hitting, last I saw Phegley had the 2nd best % in throwing out base-stealers in AL. How ironic the Sox desperately need a catcher and they dumped him.

Remember Avi spent 7 years in the minors and had over 2,400 PA. So he may be 24 in age but he spent a lot of time in the minors.

QUOTE (harkness @ Jun 29, 2015 -> 05:11 PM) Hearing that the players "have a high regard for the manager" is usually a sign that the manager is losing. I never hear about players "having a high regard " for... Bill Belicheck, Phil Jackson, Mike K... not even going to spell his name from Duke, Tony Larussa... not saying players don't say anything good about them, but its neither here nor there... I could go on forever but Robin being a nice guy... which he really is a nice guy... means nothing, nor does it matter if the players hold him in high regard. Pretty much when you are losing you better know that the players to blame themselves but also look at the coaches around them and make some conclusions. It's a simple question to answer: What has Robin done to make things better? Hahn tried and failed which is why I don't blame him as much in some respects. KW im on the fence about to fall to the wrong side also. Hahn tried and failed but you don't blame him as much??? Not sure how you are separating the fact that it looks like both Robin and Hahn failed their jobs. Hahn loaded the roster with players w/o any regard for defense. His plan was to start the season w Flowers, Johnson, Avi, Gillaspie, Abreu and Melky????That is 6 below average defenders and I guess he didn't think that Alexei may have been slipping. Did he think Robin was going to take them and turn them into better fielders??? Hahn gave Robin garbage and he found a way to make it even worse.

Heard last night on a Boston Roundtable with some of their media that Swihart will probably be the young catcher they offer for starting pitching in offseason. I would do Q for Swihart, Bradley Jr. + a lower prospect. But I am concerned getting Bradley could be a problem if he hits in Boston now that he got called up.

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Jun 29, 2015 -> 02:03 AM) Some interesting thoughts in here. If most every player managed some semblance of normal to good, this team could have contended. Obviously that didn't happen with most of the position players cratering, Shark's struggles, Danks being Danks. Good news is that the pitching is pretty much set for the foreseeable years (unless there's a rash of injuries) with Erik Johnson and Fulmer likely moving into the rotation within the next year, plus guys like Nate Jones, Crain, Montas and Danish who'll filter into the bullpen or potentially rotation if things break well. If we end up with a surplus of rotation guys a couple of years from now, flip one (maybe Quintana) for a position in need. I think we can assume Abreu, Eaton, Avi, and Melky are here next year. You'd hope you could get some approximation of an average second baseman out of Micah, Sanchez, or Saladino. I'd like to see them shop LaRoche in July. Should be able to get something worthwhile with his year and a half remaining. Open up the DH spot and have Avi, Melky, Abreu cycle through there. Bring up Trayce, play him around the outfield and see if we have anything there. Obviously move Shark. Hopefully get a young starting catcher or 3B and plug him in for the rest of the season. Dump Alexei, Bonifacio to whoever you can. In the offseason there will be money to spend filling maybe a couple of black holes (3B or SS). In 2017 there's more money available with Danks gone and hopefully Tim Anderson is ready. By then we'll know whether or not Avi is our right fielder and if anyone is our second baseman. Doubt you get a catcher for Shark. I think you get a solid prospect like an OF or 2B. Q would bring a Catcher+ in offseason.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 08:20 PM) I'm sorry but these are grown men playing baseball and getting a hell of alot of money then most of us will ever see and there should be no excuses. They get to play a game that alot of kids dream to play in their lives. I'm sure we all aren't fully happy with our jobs or bosses but we put our big boy pants and go to work cause we need a paycheck and I'm sure anyone one of us would like to take their place in a heart beat. It is not the same. As you state, we need a paycheck. Most of them will get one regardless of how they perform. If you have a few bad months, you probably won't survive in your job. Many of them since the age of 22 or so have been doing very well financially. So it is a very different lifestyle than the average person has. Then again, when we screw up at work, it hopefully does not get the same publicity as when they screw up. Imagine if you screw up at work tomorrow and your wife and kids get berated by the neighbors in your driveway on Tuesday.

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 06:02 PM) Rather than the question being asked, I'd be more interested to know how all players fare upon switching from one league to the other. Not interested in what it kinda sorta seems like players do, but rather actual data on the topic. A little dated( 2011) but it shows both hitters and pitchers https://www.fanduel.com/insider/2011/08/02/...s-for-pitchers/

QUOTE (LDF @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 06:20 PM) just like Sale did last yr. for those who want to say, this is but 1 game. this is the problem that has been finally magnified for all to see. Hopefully the object is to showcase Shark and get his value up.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 03:43 PM) WHERE IS PUTNAM!!??! On a slow bus to Charlotte????

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 12:15 PM) The quick fix was last off season as Sox management saw that as a way to get back into contention right away. It has not worked well yet but it still might with some more tweaks. Any rebound will be more than trading one player or tearing this team apart, whichever is your pleasure. I think we keep most of what we have and fine tune. We have talent and it is proven talent for the most part. Look at 2015 as an anomaly so far. I think it is an anomaly as well. There is no reason in 2016 this team cannot get back to the 2014 success they achieved..........................

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 01:40 PM) Mark Cuban or Donald Trump? Which circus act do you prefer? We have a good and committed ownership Actually, with the change in relations with Cuba, I can foresee the Havana White Sox on the horizon. Attendance would be great and White Sox could have an advantage in signing Cuban born players. Alexei could be a player manager and Bill Lee could be the GM. Jerry are you listening????

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jun 28, 2015 -> 09:19 AM) I really think this team can be legit contents by 2017, but it will take some bold moves between now and then. On the pitching side, sign Shark to a 5 year/$90M extension, trade Quintana & Putnam at the trade deadline (target two high-end hitting prospects for Q and the BPA for Zach), move Danks to the bullpen, & call-up Erik Johnson. Give one of Drabek, Guerra, & Beck an extended look the rest of the way. If you don't like what you see from those guys, then sign a reclamation project in the offseason. Either way, plan on Fulmer taking the #5 spot by 2017. On the offensive side, trade Alexei & LaRoche at the deadline for whatever you can get. Give playing time to Sanchez at SS, Micah Johnson at 2B, Garcia and/or Melky at DH, & Trayce Thompson in RF. For this example, assume you can get Schwarber & Baez for Quintana & Putnam. These guys would start at C & 3B the rest of the way. In the offseason, trade Garcia for prospects and open up the DH spot for Schwarber. Do whatever it takes to acquire the best available catching prospect that is major league ready. In this example, I'll assume that guy is Kevin Plawecki from the Mets. Let Sanchez, Saladino, or a free agent stop-gap hold down SS for 2016, but assume Anderson is ready by opening day 2017. Give Thompson a legit shot in RF in 2016. If he fails, sign or trade for a RF (Jay Bruce a potential option). 2017 Roster #1: Sale #2: Shark #3: Rodon #4: Johnson #5: Fulmer CL: Robertson SU: Jones SU: Duke MR: Webb MR: Phillips MR: Petricka LR: Beck 1. Eaton, CF 2. Johnson, 2B 3. Abreu, 1B 4. Schwarber, DH 5. Cabrera, LF 6. Baez, 3B 7. Thompson, RF 8. Plawecki, C 9. Anderson, SS Lineup too right-handed and there still would be some defensive concerns, but offensively it would have a lot of potential if Melky bounces back. Regardless, the pitching staff would have a chance of being very special. On top of that, the roster is very young and there would be money to spend to patch holes. While I think this particular scenario is unlikely (don't see us trading with the Cubs), I think something similar can be done if we extend Shark & capitalize on Quintana's value. Good post. But Q is too valuable an asset to trade at the deadline. You can explore it but I think you get more value trading him in offseason where there will be more suitors. There is no way I trade Q for a Schwarber/Baez type package. Worse you want to project Schwarber as a DH. You have to get a Catcher or SS + 1 or 2 very high prospects who are ML ready for a top 20 ML pitcher. For example from Boston I want one of the young catchers, Holt and Bradley Jr or Bogaerts and Bradley Jr. You have to walk away w a starter at a prime position ( SS-CF-C) and at least 1 other starter or two very high prospects that may need 1 year. Why would you want Danks in the bullpen??? What role would he play??? If he is your long reliever you are better off w a young player. I think w Danks you either leave him as your #5, trade him for nothing and eat some money, trade him for a prospect and eat more money, or release him and eat all the money and a lot of rolaids.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 27, 2015 -> 06:21 PM) No Danks always a plus. Not really. If the Sox have any hope of trading Danks at the deadline, a few decent starts between now and then would be helpful.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 26, 2015 -> 03:35 PM) Great post. It's results that matter and right now Hahn's grade is D. This team is by far the worst in the division and that's on him after all the deals last offseason. I do trust him though and hope he starts making some more trades and tries to re-do the mess he put the team in. I agree Hahn is absolutely responsible for some of the problems. He acquired Melky knowing that Avi was a below average RF based on last year. He also did nothing fixing 2nd base then promoted Johnson who was a defensive problem there. I don't blame him as much for Alexei and Eaton defensively as they have regressed more than should be expected. I think he did a good job improving the bullpen and the LaRoche and Shark moves are a wash.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Jun 26, 2015 -> 03:29 PM) There are no quick fixes. If it was easy everyone would do it. At this point they need to call a meeting with Jose, Eaton, Avi, Q, Robertson and Sale and ask them (well not Avi and Eaton, but they should be in the meeting imo) if they want to stick around for a 3 year rebuild. If they don't, ship them out. Team needs a full cleanse, including a couple years of top 3 picks. If you are going for a 3 yr rebuild, which I do not dispute, there is no sense keeping Robertson. Relief pitchers are too unpredictable to hope they will be needed in 3 years. Better to trade him now while he has some value. As Flowers becomes more and more of Sale's catcher, the more likely the Sox keep him as a back-up since I don't see them trading Sale.

quote name='greg775' date='Jun 25, 2015 -> 06:11 PM' post='3187644'] I told you guys all our veteran "name" players will be sought after. Please Sox, dump LaRoche and Melky and Lexi and Robertson and Duke and Shark in a major "do-over" of the past offseason. I'm confident Hahn will get it right this time. Greg: That would create 6 holes besides the existing 3B, 2B, C problems. Considering none of the above, except maybe Robertson and even his stock is slowly sinking, are going to bring back multiple MLB prospects next year could be even worse.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 24, 2015 -> 03:54 PM) But hey, they finally got Ozzie to agree to officially return July 17th-19th for the 2005 Reunion weekend. One thing to look forward to over the remainder of the season. Rumor is so he can also be named interim manager.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 24, 2015 -> 06:55 PM) And even the Tigers were smart enough to realize with the losses of Scherzer and Verlander that they'd need to tighten up their defense. So they added Gose, Iglesias and worked with Castellanos on improving his defense. They at least had a plan and made some moves to improve a weak spot. I agree but that may be giving them too much credit. The Tigers knew they were losing Peralta to suspension so they desperately needed a SS. Hahn wanted an outfielder rather than Iglesias so they jumped in the Peavy trade and solved the replacement for Peralta. But I doubt they make that trade if Peralta didn't get caught. Their scouts certainly did a great job identifying how good Iglesias was. Their defense got better and we got Avi.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 07:32 PM) Why would Boston not pick up Clay's option for 2015 & 2016 (@ 13M each). Would think Boston isn't going to go full rebuild. Kelly might be available but he has an ERA over 5 and a WHIP of 1.43 and an ERA+ of 75. Only thing that looks decent is his FIP of 4.02. So with that in mind, if I'm Boston, why exactly am I selling him at his low point (he is under team control through 2019)? I am guessing Boston will be looking for pitching back for Buchholz. He is the last of the WS pitchers left and I think both sides may want a change. I hope Boston would put a package together for Q w a young catcher but I wouldn't want Buch. Kelly was rumored to be odd man out in their rotation and could be sent back to AAA. My guess that is why his name is coming up. They also have Allen Craig, Bradley and Castillo sitting in AAA for trade bait as well.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 05:12 PM) So...Shark wasn't the best pitcher on the market last year either. That feat belonged to Price and Lester. Didn't mean the A's didn't get a lot for Shark. Their are a heck of a lot of teams that could be buyers and not many that are sellers. In fact, Sox might be one of the only teams ready to move guys (who have value) right now, which could actually put them in a better position to maximize value (as teams might want to pounce earlier vs. waiting a bit longer till other "sellers" emerge). And w/Cueto and Shark, even small market teams can compete. You talk about a guy like Hamels and well...not many teams are going to get involved in that bidding (not with the money he is owed). Outside of who we are talking about (or other potential Sox starters), their isn't a whole lot of names out their right now and their are a lot of teams that would be interested in buying. Boston will be a seller and Buchholz and Kelly will be available.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 22, 2015 -> 10:58 PM) Settle down, a grounder and a homer. He's good. Amazing, but as bad as Danks was, the bullpen is worse. Minny must think this is T-Ball.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jun 21, 2015 -> 10:00 AM) What I'd ask for for Quintana: MLB ready C, MLB ready 3B, and an MLB ready starter. For Sale: that, plus say 2-4 other prospects. I would agree w you but would add some flexibility. For Q, I would want: 1. A MLB ready SS or C. 2. A MLB ready 3B, 2B or OF 3. A MLB ready starter 4-5th slot. If # 2 ended up being an OF then I would trade Avi or LaRoche for a MLB ready 3B or 2B. I would also trade Shark for a MLB back-end starter or a MLB 3B, 2B or OF. Hopefully that would upgrade 3B, 2B and add 1 starter. That would fill either SS or C but still leave one as a problem. Also would mean 1 starter from minors or Fulmer would be needed. Alexei, Conor and Gordon would be expendable as throw-ins or DFA. I would not trade Sale.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jun 20, 2015 -> 09:10 AM) But they'd be much worse defensively than the guys currently in those spots. I think the Sox can get something better than Semien in July. IF not, that comp pick is very valuable. What am I missing??? Phegley would be better defensively than Soto and is hitting 75 points higher. If they kept Semien he would be playing 2nd over the Micah experiment. We don't know how he would do there defensively. Regardless I understand the rationale behind the trade. It just backfired unless Shark negates some of it based on what they get for him.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jun 20, 2015 -> 09:08 AM) I'd hold Samardzija for 3-4 more starts. Looks like he's coming around. Some possible names from teams on the high end: Toronto I'd ask them for Jeff Hoffman because that would be a ridiculous return. Probably wouldn't be possible though. C Max Pentecost 3B Mitch Nay LHP Matt Smoral (Sox liked him around draft time) C Dan Jansen (Low Minors) DH Rowdy Tellez New York Yankees C Gary Sanchez 3B Eric Jagielo C Luis Torrens 3B Miguel Andujar Houston 3B Colin Moran 1B AJ Reed C Max Stassi Just to put into context. Peavy had 1 year + and he brought Avi and 2 good prospects. I would think Shark brings either an Avi type or a high rated prospect.