I do believe that the decision to sign Grandall and let McCann walk will ultimately come back to bite the Sox in the ass.  Decisions like this, not to mention the hiring of an outdated manager,  lead me to believe that the ineptitude of the front office will prevent this team from reaching the promised land.

lol mccann has such a cult following here its hilarious.

Yasmani has been really bad in 21 and definitely 100% deserves some criticism for sure.  I've been big supporter of his against the meatball takes, but he's been just flat bad in 21.  He was fine last year.  I do honestly think part of the problem is Sox fans expected a different hitter than Grandal really is.  What he did last year is exactly what he's done his whole career, which has made him widely considered one of the best 2-3 catchers in the game, pretty much unanimously.  

McCann is a really solid  defensive catcher that has has produced about 2-3 months of good offensive in his 7+ year career.  Career wRC+ of 85.  Rag on Yasmani all you want (and like I said, he deserves some flack so far in 21), but he has a career wRC+ of 117.  Offensively, they aren't really comparable at all.  Defensively, I would agree that Yaz has been pretty disappointing so far in a Sox uni - I certainly expected more.  

At the end of the day, McCann is in New York and is looking like the offensive producer he's been for 95% of his career.  I like the guy - but he isn't some savior.  

McCann and his 75 OPS+ and 79 wRC+ this season would put this offense over the top, surely

Definitely a necessary thread. 

I wish I was paid millions to suck at my job. I’m only paid thousands! 

16 minutes ago, YoYoIsMyHero said:

McCann and his 75 OPS+ and 79 wRC+ this season would put this offense over the top, surely

yeah, as bad as Yaz numbers are, McCann is super underwhelming as well. 

Grandal is arguably the worst free agent signing in the history of this franchise. I can’t believe people would take him over James McCann. 

3 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

yeah, as bad as Yaz numbers are, McCann is super underwhelming as well. 

The Mets have a very happy pitching staff. The White Sox not so much.  

4 minutes ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:

Grandal is arguably the worst free agent signing in the history of this franchise. I can’t believe people would take him over James McCann. 

When you factor in the "biggest contract in franchise history" factor, it could be argued.

I would try really hard to dump Grandal off on the Yankees while they may perhaps be a bit desperate.

Take back Gary Sanchez who sucks and cut him and some other salary because they are up against the luxury tax.  But dump the remaining contract if possible.

With Zacks improvement, a Collins-Lucroy tandem would be much better behind the plate.  And offensively I wouldn't be worried about that so much, the main concern is why TLR is putting Leury out there so much and sitting Vaughn so much.

7 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

The Mets have a very happy pitching staff. The White Sox not so much.  

You talk to Stroman last night?

3 minutes ago, manbearpuig said:

When you factor in the "biggest contract in franchise history" factor, it could be argued.

There will never be any deal worse than Dunn.  

I have been all aboard this anti-Grandal train since before the signing but there is no way Yasmani is ever as useless and shitty as Dunn.  The bat will improve and he is just fine as a backup 1B/DH/C when he heals up a bit.  He would be a useful player for a team that is not loaded up with like 50 DHs.

13 minutes ago, manbearpuig said:

When you factor in the "biggest contract in franchise history" factor, it could be argued.

I’d do anything to get rid of Grandal’s contract. Hell, trade him to Baltimore for Chris Davis. At least Davis’ contract ends sooner.

47 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

lol mccann has such a cult following here its hilarious.

Yasmani has been really bad in 21 and definitely 100% deserves some criticism for sure.  I've been big supporter of his against the meatball takes, but he's been just flat bad in 21.  He was fine last year.  I do honestly think part of the problem is Sox fans expected a different hitter than Grandal really is.  What he did last year is exactly what he's done his whole career, which has made him widely considered one of the best 2-3 catchers in the game, pretty much unanimously.  

McCann is a really solid  defensive catcher that has has produced about 2-3 months of good offensive in his 7+ year career.  Career wRC+ of 85.  Rag on Yasmani all you want (and like I said, he deserves some flack so far in 21), but he has a career wRC+ of 117.  Offensively, they aren't really comparable at all.  Defensively, I would agree that Yaz has been pretty disappointing so far in a Sox uni - I certainly expected more.  

At the end of the day, McCann is in New York and is looking like the offensive producer he's been for 95% of his career.  I like the guy - but he isn't some savior.  

Idk man I think Grandal's .108 BABIP is gonna sustain

Grandal has been bad with a 74 wrc+ but McCann wasn't much better with a 79.

Grandal also is just a streaky hitter who will have those 1 for 25 weeks but usually he will heat up and end up with like a 110-115 wrc+ or so. 

I'm not going to argue that Grandal is having a great season... but what other option do we really have?

Collins does seem pretty solid behind the plate. But he has never proven he can hit at the major league level. Are we all of a sudden ready to let him take 400 at bats?

And I also have to believe there is something to all the stat-head love for Grandal. I saw one list from like a month ago that ranked Yasmani #31 in ALL OF BASEBALL. And if he can cut out the catcher's interference I still think he is a strong pitch framer. I thought he stole a few strikes for Lucas last night.

They’ve both been shit. Great thread tho. 

16 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

Idk man I think Grandal's .108 BABIP is gonna sustain

Not sure if serious or not, but honestly it might if he keeps hitting the ball right at the 2B playing short RF.  Honestly, he looks helpless at the plate right now.  Pretty disappointing, though I suspect he'll figure it out eventually and end up around where he always does. 

4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Not sure if serious or not, but honestly it might if he keeps hitting the ball right at the 2B playing short RF.  Honestly, he looks helpless at the plate right now.  Pretty disappointing, though I suspect he'll figure it out eventually and end up around where he always does. 

Was mostly joking. He definitely needs to cut it out with the hard grounders into the shift but he still isn't even top 4 on the team in ground ball rate.

For as bad as he looks at the plate, his xwOBA has never been higher and his wOBA has never been lower. His walk rate has never been higher and his strikeout rate has never been lower. His hard-hit rate and xSLG have never been higher. The only concerning batted ball metric is his launch angle being down a few degrees, which I'm sure will get ironed out over time. Way too small of a sample to stress about his results when the underlying metrics are so good, so I'm not worried

Grandal hardly played in spring training. You knew he would start slow. 

JAMES MCCANN SIGNED A $40 MILLION CONTRACT. HE IS GONE AND NOT COMING BACK. 

It always has amused me that the same people who called the Sox morons for signing him in the first place, when Kevan Smith is on the roster, call them morons for not paying a back up catcher $40 million.

It’s been well documented that I disliked the Grandal signing from the beginning. It’s not because of his bat either. It’s because I think his defense is terribly overrated and this team needs a strong defensive catcher, not a below average one. I could care less if he hits for a 115 wRC+ or whatever if his defense sucks. This team has enough hitting, need pitching and defense to win the big one. And call my CERA concern a “meatball” take or fluky or whatever but it’s become a consistent trend across the last two seasons that Sox pitchers pitch better to anyone other than Grandal. It’s not surprising either when you see him catch and call a game.

2 hours ago, YourWhatHurts said:

There will never be any deal worse than Dunn.  

I have been all aboard this anti-Grandal train since before the signing but there is no way Yasmani is ever as useless and shitty as Dunn.  The bat will improve and he is just fine as a backup 1B/DH/C when he heals up a bit.  He would be a useful player for a team that is not loaded up with like 50 DHs.

Yet he was a big part of the playoff run in 2012...it’s just that abysmally NY Times historic 2011 that overwhelms everything else.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/adam-dunn/319/stats?position=1B/OF

His last two seasons, he was still much better than a LaRoche, Encarnacion or Alonso.

 

In terms of the money and hype, probably.  That 2011 season, Guillen and Buehrle leaving and then the busts with Robertson (relative to salary)/Cabrera/LaRoche and Shark were what finally forced this team into rebuild mode.

Edited April 28, 20214 yr by caulfield12

3 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

JAMES MCCANN SIGNED A $40 MILLION CONTRACT. HE IS GONE AND NOT COMING BACK.

You underestimate this franchise's ability to trade for a bad contract a couple years from now.

Edited April 28, 20214 yr by WhiteSoxFan1993

I'm sad McCann left too but there was never any other option.  No team in their right mind is going to pay for two highly paid starting catchers.  And why would McCann want to stay here and share playing time with Grandal when he's clearly earned a full time starting role?

It sucks that we were blessed with two above average catchers last year.  Now we have 1 bad catcher.  Sad.

Edited April 28, 20214 yr by Green Line

2 hours ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

You underestimate this franchise's ability to trade for a bad contract a couple years from now.

It would make a lot of sense, if the Mets pay at least half (assuming he continues to struggle in that market) of his salary and Giolito continues to struggle with Grandal and/or Collins.

It's at least worth monitoring in 2022/23.