2 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I like to imagine the Sox had made the minor trade  for cash considerations after the Cardinals DFA'd   Cuban OF Adolis Garcia  like the Rangers did . The Cards DFA'd him on Dec. 18, 2019 and TX. traded for him on Dec.21

Adolis Garcia  signed an IFA contract in 2017 with the Cards for $2.5M

Randy Arozarena was another Cuban Cards OF prospect  signed in 2016 for $1.25M . The Rays traded for him but gave up a top pitching prospect for him because they were loaded with young talent in the minors especially pitchers. Unlike Garcia, Arozarena had a big AAA season but the Ray's traded  recent draft choice and top 50 prospect Matt Liberatore who had a nice season in A ball. Jan.9, 2020 was the trade that involved more players than I mentioned.

Seems like a Rays type of deal. Give up good A level talent for MLB ready talent.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/01/rays-acquire-jose-martinez-randy-arozarena-from-cardinals.html

 

They have made some mistakes, though.  Cronenworth is the type of player like Wendle/Zobrist/Keppinger whose value they typically maximize for 3-4 years before trading at peak value before salary commitment strains the budget in arbitration.

On 5/4/2021 at 5:27 PM, chw42 said:

Adolis Garcia of TEX

He's either Luis Robert without the  defense or Eloy Jimenez without a hit tool.

Shameless bump.....since this post he's hit 4 dongs, knocked in 12, a SB, and OPS of 1.429.  

1 hour ago, poppysox said:

I think your take on this is basically where I am at.  Charlie Blackmon is the only name I hear mentioned that has some interest on my part.  I don't want to give up anything of significance because the outfield problem abates significantly when Engel returns.

Doesn't Blackmon have 2 more years on his deal after 2021 for big bucks You can't take that on with his declining play. And I used to love his game.

11 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I like to imagine the Sox had made the minor trade  for cash considerations after the Cardinals DFA'd   Cuban OF Adolis Garcia  like the Rangers did . The Cards DFA'd him on Dec. 18, 2019 and TX. traded for him on Dec.21

Adolis Garcia  signed an IFA contract in 2017 with the Cards for $2.5M

Randy Arozarena was another Cuban Cards OF prospect  signed in 2016 for $1.25M . The Rays traded for him but gave up a top pitching prospect for him because they were loaded with young talent in the minors especially pitchers. Unlike Garcia, Arozarena had a big AAA season but the Ray's traded  recent draft choice and top 50 prospect Matt Liberatore who had a nice season in A ball. Jan.9, 2020 was the trade that involved more players than I mentioned.

Seems like a Rays type of deal. Give up good A level talent for MLB ready talent.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/01/rays-acquire-jose-martinez-randy-arozarena-from-cardinals.html

These are the type of trades the Sox should be making anytime. No reason whatsoever to take on aging guys with high contracts like Blackmon or even to give up too much talent for a prototypical 3 outcome player like Gallo.

 

The Sox have actually done a pretty decent job in this space.

Evan Marshall was a MiLB free agent signing.

Jose Ruiz was a waiver claim.

Yermin was a MiLB rule 5 pick.

That is 3 of the 25 man roster who came in as under the  radar signings.

Expand it out to the 40 man roster...

Jimmy Cordero was a waiver claim

That is without talking about how many #1 White Sox draft picks are on this roster, how many low draft picks are in key spaces on this team, or how many of the minor leaguers we traded for have turned into major parts of this team.

Sox are in first and nobody is running away with this Division. To make a panic move now is insane. Engel will be back in a couple weeks and solve a lot of issues. Vaughn is  not a disaster in left and is starting to get dialed in at the plate. They will most likely have Robert back for the last month of the season and just maybe Eloy as well. 

Agreed with brijames. Zero reason to trade for an OF yet. Mendick looks OK in limited play time. Just gut it out with Leury until Engel gets back. The true question is what to do if Mendick keeps playing well and Eaton keeps sucking. I guess they will option Mendick once again to make room for Engel? It sucks, but there isnt much room on the roster. We may see Eaton as the odd man out when Robert and Eloy return. 

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by ron883

1 minute ago, ron883 said:

Agreed with brijames. Zero reason to trade for an OF yet. Mendick looks OK in limited play time. Just gut it out with Leury until Engel gets back. The true question is what to do if Mendick keeps playing well and Eaton keeps sucking. I guess they will option Mendick once again to make room for Engel? It sucks, but there isnt much room on the roster. We may see Eaton as the odd man out when Robert and Eloy return. 

Lamb leaves when Engel gets back 

1 minute ago, Harry Chappas said:

Lamb leaves when Engel gets back 

Totally forgot about Lamb. Good point. Get him TF off this team. Engel's return better be the death of his roster spot on the Sox. 

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by ron883

2 hours ago, manbearpuig said:

Yeah, probably Gallo. And then when everyone comes back, you move Eaton to a bench role (if he's not on IL).

I doubt Gallo can play CF passably unless you mean in the sense that Vaughn can play LF passably. However the fact that Gallo has slowed down in sprint speed a lot and is likely to slow down even more , that speed in CF means a lot more than it does in LF.

1 minute ago, Harry Chappas said:

Lamb leaves when Engel gets back 

Roster cuts should be Lamb for Engel, followed by Hamilton for Eloy or Robert.

Mendick, Garcia, Engel/Eaton and Collins gives the team the most flexibility once everyone is back. If Yermin is still hitting, then Mendick is likely to go due to Leary’s ability to play all positions defensively, despite the much weaker bat.

48 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

They have made some mistakes, though.  Cronenworth is the type of player like Wendle/Zobrist/Keppinger whose value they typically maximize for 3-4 years before trading at peak value before salary commitment strains the budget in arbitration.

Every team makes mistakes. I could also ,while fantasizing the Sox had any interest in adding Adolis Garcia or Randy Azorarena to our Cuban connection , that they had selected Trent Grisham instead of Carson Fulmer in the draft. Grisham went the pick right after Fulmer. He was a HS  LH CF type when the Sox hadn't yet changed their thinking about adding higher upside young talent who play the middle of the field. I'm not sure they have yet changed their focus for more of these types. Between Garcia, Arozarena and Grisham that's a lot of OF talent they passed on between 2015 and 2020. All 3 were within their grasp either as IFA's /draft pick (not sure if they had the money due to restrictions ) but certainly later when all 3 were traded.

 

4 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Every team makes mistakes. I could also ,while fantasizing the Sox had any interest in adding Adolis Garcia or Randy Azorarena to our Cuban connection , that they had selected Trent Grisham instead of Carson Fulmer in the draft. Grisham went the pick right after Fulmer. He was a HS  LH CF type when the Sox hadn't yet changed their thinking about adding higher upside young talent who play the middle of the field. I'm not sure they have yet changed their focus for more of these types. Between Garcia, Arozarena and Grisham that's a lot of OF talent they passed on between 2015 and 2020. All 3 were within their grasp either as IFA's /draft pick (not sure if they had the money due to restrictions ) but certainly later when all 3 were traded.

 

Arozarena was part of the Liberatore deal, so it’s not like the Cardinals gave him away for nothing. Garcia was right there, but it’s tough to blame the Sox for not claiming him when no team did.

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

The Sox have actually done a pretty decent job in this space.

Evan Marshall was a MiLB free agent signing.

Jose Ruiz was a waiver claim.

Yermin was a MiLB rule 5 pick.

That is 3 of the 25 man roster who came in as under the  radar signings.

Expand it out to the 40 man roster...

Jimmy Cordero was a waiver claim

That is without talking about how many #1 White Sox draft picks are on this roster, how many low draft picks are in key spaces on this team, or how many of the minor leaguers we traded for have turned into major parts of this team.

I brought those OF's up more to emphasize that the Sox shouldn't be trading prospects for an aging good player like Blackmon who will costs prospects, money and is old or for Gallo who doesnt  have much time left before he becomes a free agent and has slowed down a lot and can no longer play CF due to that.

All these OF's are impact players, you named a few OK pitchers and a DH . Of course draft picks and the wonderful young players who were traded for in the Q, Sale and Eaton deals were all part of the rebuild process but that doesn't mean you can't continue to explore prospect for prospect trades or continue to build the scouting department to explore as many athletic position player talents as possible.

Garcia, Azorarena and Grisham all started in CF as prospects and Tatis was  a SS . Middle of the field guys not types like Burger, AJ. Reid, Palka , Skole, Collins, Mercedes, Sheets , Encarnacion (as an example of wasting money on another lumbering aging slow guy.)

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

14 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

Arozarena was part of the Liberatore deal, so it’s not like the Cardinals gave him away for nothing. Garcia was right there, but it’s tough to blame the Sox for not claiming him when no team did.

Yea I mentioned Liberatore and even gave the link for the full trade .  Garcia is Cuban and should've been on the Sox radar for a while since he was given a $2.5M bonus to sign with the Cards,. He was DFA'd and the Rangers traded for him. Gave up only cash.

Just saying the Sox are more likely to make trades that receive cash than ones that give it up. Can't always be in contention if you aren't always doing everything necessary to expand your level of minor league talent. The Dodgers, Cards, Padres and Rays and to a lesser extent Oakland seem to do this and realized middle of the field prospects are the ones to invest more heavily in. They are the more athletic types who can more easily convert to other positions.

 

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

35 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I brought those OF's up more to emphasize that the Sox shouldn't be trading prospects for an aging good player like Blackmon who will costs prospects, money and is old or for Gallo who doesnt  have much time left before he becomes a free agent and has slowed down a lot and can no longer play CF due to that.

All these OF's are impact players, you named a few OK pitchers and a DH . Of course draft picks and the wonderful young players who were traded for in the Q, Sale and Eaton deals were all part of the rebuild process but that doesn't mean you can't continue to explore prospect for prospect trades or continue to build the scouting department to explore as many athletic position player talents as possible.

Garcia, Azorarena and Grisham all started in CF as prospects and Tatis was  a SS . Middle of the field guys not types like Burger, AJ. Reid, Palka , Skole, Collins, Mercedes, Sheets , Encarnacion (as an example of wasting money on another lumbering aging slow guy.)

There is zero chance this actually happened.

1 hour ago, ron883 said:

Totally forgot about Lamb. Good point. Get him TF off this team. Engel's return better be the death of his roster spot on the Sox. 

I don't necessarily disagree with you but I would think Hamilton goes when Engel returns. There is no reason to have them both on the same team.

Just now, raBBit said:

I don't necessarily disagree with you but I would think Hamilton goes when Engel returns. There is no reason to have them both on the same team.

Wouldn't Hamilton's utility come with taking over for Vaughn in LF late in games, which Tony is obsessed with doing even though Vaughn has been better than fine out there. I suppose Leury could do that too.  Obviously Engel is starting in CF In this hypothetical.   

I don't mind Hamilton as the last man on this roster as long as he isn't overused - that is, strictly used in pinch running and late inning defense.  

I was cool with the Lamb signing - always been a fan of his.  But he really has no purpose on this roster at this point other than Moncada's injury replacement.  

1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

Wouldn't Hamilton's utility come with taking over for Vaughn in LF late in games, which Tony is obsessed with doing even though Vaughn has been better than fine out there. I suppose Leury could do that too.  Obviously Engel is starting in CF In this hypothetical.   

 I don't mind Hamilton as the last man on this roster as long as he isn't overused - that is, strictly used in pinch running and late inning defense.  

 I was cool with the Lamb signing - always been a fan of his.  But he really has no purpose on this roster at this point other than Moncada's injury replacement.  

I guess I am kind of assuming Goodwin gets a shot soon too. Lamb is at least left-handed and the Sox clearly like him.  If you pencil in Vaughn in LF, Garcia/Goodwin/Engel in CF and Eaton in RF, it's kind of hard to have Hamilton on the bench with two of Garcia/Goodwin/Engel on the bench. Especially if the Sox trust Mendick in RF.

I like Hamilton as a guy/teammate. He's obviously quick and good outfielder but this guy is absolutely useless at the plate. He makes me yearn for Leury. 

23 minutes ago, raBBit said:

I don't necessarily disagree with you but I would think Hamilton goes when Engel returns. There is no reason to have them both on the same team.

I forgot about Hamilton too. Lordy, get both those guys off the team. 

1 hour ago, raBBit said:

I don't necessarily disagree with you but I would think Hamilton goes when Engel returns. There is no reason to have them both on the same team.

Hamilton could have a longer stay than expected as TA's wingman. 

Vaughn & Crochet for Kelenic.  

Who says no?  Everyone involved?

12 minutes ago, GREEDY said:

Vaughn & Crochet for Kelenic.  

Who says no?  Everyone involved?

You‘d fill a hole just to open up two more. Not to add that Kelenic is no sure thing to produce right away in the big leagues with the chance that he completely busts and never hits in MLB.

With Vaughn hitting, Engel returning, and Mendick being passable in the OF, you simply wait. The pitching is good enough to carry the team while Robert and Eloy are gone. Simple as that. 

2 hours ago, raBBit said:

I guess I am kind of assuming Goodwin gets a shot soon too. Lamb is at least left-handed and the Sox clearly like him.  If you pencil in Vaughn in LF, Garcia/Goodwin/Engel in CF and Eaton in RF, it's kind of hard to have Hamilton on the bench with two of Garcia/Goodwin/Engel on the bench. Especially if the Sox trust Mendick in RF.

I like Hamilton as a guy/teammate. He's obviously quick and good outfielder but this guy is absolutely useless at the plate. He makes me yearn for Leury. 

TLR exercises the same level of moderation with his fringey bench players as he does with his alcohol.  The trick for Hahn as his handler/babysitter/GM is to refrain from tempting him too much and try to get guys on the roster who will be at least somewhat useful even if he abuses them.  He's really cornering the market on light hitting fast OFers though and something is going to have to change here.  I mean we have Leury as the best guy but then there's Hamilton Goodwin Williams and Gonzalez all right there.  Maybe Hahn can get him to play Danny in the OF more and that would help.  But really you don't need any of these other shitty hitting OFers if Leury and Mendick are already here and both are playing the OF along with Vaughn.  

 

"TLR exercises the same level of moderation with his fringey bench players as he does with his alcohol."

A personal jab that does not lead to any useful discussion.

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by tray