July 20, 20223 yr 26 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: Yea there is no shame in saying you think Vaughn will be a lesser offensive player than Soto. Also, Soto is a better defender. Fwiw, Vaughn and Soto have the two worst OOAA in the OF this season. I didn’t know Soto was a very poor defender tbh, but the stats say he has been this season. I would trade Vaughn + Sosa/Rodriguez + Mena/Vera for Soto, tho. I love AV but that solves a considerable issue with this roster. That’d be my top offer tho. Dude is controlled for 2 seasons at what will surely be monster AAVs via arb. Edited July 20, 20223 yr by ChiSox59
July 20, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said: Fwiw, Vaughn and Soto have the two worst OOAA in the OF this season. I didn’t know Soto was a very poor defender tbh, but the stats say he has been this season. Has he always been bad? I thought he was pretty good when he came up but admittedly my exposure to him was playoffs
July 20, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, Kyyle23 said: Has he always been bad? I thought he was pretty good when he came up but admittedly my exposure to him was playoffs Not really sure. Don’t watch much Nats baseball. I’m confident saying he’s a a better OF than AV, but I was shocked to see him graded out as one of the worst OF in the game this season.
July 20, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Fwiw, Vaughn and Soto have the two worst OOAA in the OF this season. I didn’t know Soto was a very poor defender tbh, but the stats say he has been this season. I would trade Vaughn + Sosa/Rodriguez + Mena/Veras for Soto, tho. I love AV but that solves a considerable issue with this roster. That’d be my top offer tho. Dude is controlled for 2 seasons at what will surely be monster AAVs via arb. That's an offer that I think would be easily beaten by other teams. Its fun to play this game, but the White Sox will never make this trade and its because of money, not assets.
July 20, 20223 yr 42 minutes ago, vilehoopster said: Starting next year, I would bet that if you look and compare stats over the next ten years (again starting with the 2023 season on thru 2032) I would bet big bucks that Vaughn has a higher OPS, more RBIs, and a clearly better BA. I am confident that Vaughn is going to be that good. As one of AV's biggest fans, I would take that bet a million times.
July 20, 20223 yr 7 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: As one of AV's biggest fans, I would take that bet a million times. Especially when the odds are likely that starting next year Soto isn't batting third for the worst team in baseball, hes batting third in the Yankees, Dodgers, or Padres lineup. The counting stats will be absurd.
July 20, 20223 yr 51 minutes ago, vilehoopster said: Starting next year, I would bet that if you look and compare stats over the next ten years (again starting with the 2023 season on thru 2032) I would bet big bucks that Vaughn has a higher OPS, more RBIs, and a clearly better BA. I am confident that Vaughn is going to be that good. I'm in. How much?
July 20, 20223 yr On 7/19/2022 at 7:03 AM, CentralChamps21 said: Discussing Cease or Vaughn as part of a package for Soto is pointless. Sox are trying to win now. Trading away your best starting pitcher doesn't make any sense, nor does trading Vaughn. Only big name that makes sense is Eloy because he's an OF. Aside from that you'd have to put together a package full of guys like Burger, Sheets, Foster, Crochet, Martin, Sosa and even then I don't know if that's worth it. This one makes the most sense to me. At the All-Star game the announcers said there's a very real chance Soto is traded. They said Washington wants near MLB ready talent . I would suspect that means AA and AAA talent where the Sox prospects are the weakest or guys in their 1st 2 years of playing with 4 or more years of eligibility left. How many of these types they want or should get is highly speculative.
July 20, 20223 yr 22 minutes ago, T R U said: That's an offer that I think would be easily beaten by other teams. Its fun to play this game, but the White Sox will never make this trade and its because of money, not assets. Perhaps. But as we saw with Sale, there is a point of diminishing returns. Soto is stud, but he has just 2 years of control left at large AAVs. My take: he'll get a lot less in return than people are proposing. 1 blue chip prospect or good young MLB player (Vaughn in this case), 1 top 40-100 type (Sosa), 1 other solid prospect outside top 100s (Mena/Vera) but in most orgs top 10, and then a filler piece. In other words, its going to look a lot like the Sale return. JMO.
July 20, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Perhaps. But as we saw with Sale, there is a point of diminishing returns. Soto is stud, but he has just 2 years of control left at large AAVs. My take: he'll get a lot less in return than people are proposing. 1 blue chip prospect or good young MLB player (Vaughn in this case), 1 top 40-100 type (Sosa), 1 other solid prospect outside top 100s (Mena/Vera) but in most orgs top 10, and then a filler piece. In other words, its going to look a lot like the Sale return. JMO. Well Sosa right now isn't top 40-100 type. That's Montgomery. The package of Vaughn, Montgomery, and Sosa/Mena/Vera is more in line with what you are proposing. I do agree with you though, the package will not be as crazy as some are making it seem due to that looming price tag.
July 20, 20223 yr 6 minutes ago, T R U said: Well Sosa right now isn't top 40-100 type. That's Montgomery. The package of Vaughn, Montgomery, and Sosa/Mena/Vera is more in line with what you are proposing. I do agree with you though, the package will not be as crazy as some are making it seem due to that looming price tag. Yeah, that's fair. I am not trading Montgomery though.
July 20, 20223 yr Just now, ChiSox59 said: Yeah, that's fair. I am not trading Montgomery though. You wouldn't trade Montgomery for Juan Soto?
July 20, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, bmags said: You wouldn't trade Montgomery for Juan Soto? Straight up? Sure. Along with AV, Sosa and one of our two best pitching prospects which the post was referring to? Probably not.
July 20, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, bmags said: You wouldn't trade Montgomery for Juan Soto? Taking money out of the equation, this trade would be perfect. Soto is an upgrade from Vaughn and Montgomery is still a prospect who is 2-3 years away. That's getting a superstar player without hurting the big league team and not gutting the farm. Almost seems impossible.
July 20, 20223 yr Just now, T R U said: Taking money out of the equation, this trade would be perfect. Soto is an upgrade from Vaughn and Montgomery is still a prospect who is 2-3 years away. That's getting a superstar player without hurting the big league team and not gutting the farm. Almost seems impossible. Trading Montgomery, Sosa, Mena/Veras AND AV is gutting the future, though. Soto is awesome. Solves a ton of problems. I just said I'd trade AV, Sosa, Mena/Veras for him. I'd draw the line at including Montgomery for a guy we'll pay around $60M for 2 seasons and then watch him walk, and now our future is gutted. Not sure why I entered this chat though. The Sox aren't trading for Soto.
July 20, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, vilehoopster said: Starting next year, I would bet that if you look and compare stats over the next ten years (again starting with the 2023 season on thru 2032) I would bet big bucks that Vaughn has a higher OPS, more RBIs, and a clearly better BA. I am confident that Vaughn is going to be that good. I would take that bet--I'm just about Vaughn's biggest fan but Soto is one of the 3-4 most exciting players in the game. BUT I think the two will be comparable *enough* that sending Vaughn -- plus multiple valuable prospects (likely the top tier of our farm) -- for Soto would be a bad trade.
July 20, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Straight up? Sure. Along with AV, Sosa and one of our two best pitching prospects which the post was referring to? Probably not. That makes sense. I'm obviously on record that sox need to get a price here at least and be aggressive, but I also agree that there really isn't a point to emptying out our farm if we are also sending out Vaughn. I still would explore trading Giolito, using that for Soto, and trying to get a Martin Perez type for the year. I actually love the 2023 pitching FA crop.
July 20, 20223 yr Yes yes the sox aren't trading for soto but if you sculpted the perfect player that turns all of our weaknesses into a strength you'd make Juan Soto available.
July 20, 20223 yr I think the only deal that would get the Nats to jump on a call from the Sox would be Vaughn, Montgomery, Crochet, + 2 other fillers.
July 20, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, Harry Chappas said: People need to realize it's not just prospects it's committing $500M. It is pre-allocating payroll that is certain to be paid to a specific resource yes.
July 20, 20223 yr Just now, Harry Chappas said: People need to realize it's not just prospects it's committing $500M. Why do people keep repeating this like it isn’t a known fact? Big boys play by big boy rules. If you are too scared to make that commitment then you shouldn’t be in the game of baseball
July 20, 20223 yr And on top of that I refuse to just pre-filter my brain on what the white sox should be doing to what JR will allow. Like why get prospects? JR won't actually invest in a premium player development and analytics dept. There's no point.
July 20, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said: People need to realize it's not just prospects it's committing $500M. The Sox aren't committing $500M tho. So its prospects for 2 seasons and 2 months of Soto, who then leaves.
July 20, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said: People need to realize it's not just prospects it's committing $500M. No, they don't. The Sox aren't paying $500M as their window is closing. I think a lot of people are talking about the price of 2.5 years of Soto with full knowledge he'll walk.
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.