PolishPrince34 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 In the next labor negotiations which will start this offseason their is already talk about getting rid of Type B compensation. Type A/B Compensation for free agents will be changed because do you think anyone in the league agrees that you should get a supplemental first round pick for Jason Frasor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Lost in the discussion could be a way of finding enough cash to sign Mark Buerhle after this year. The savings of both E-Jax and Teahen for the rest of this year, plus next for Teahen, even after factoring Frasor's option, could help. It'll take more. But it's a start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 06:53 AM) I'm somewhat surprised that so many people think "but Jackson is worth so much!" is a reason why this can't be true. Guess it kinda reminds me of the people who were mad that we didn't get more for Vasquez, as though teams really wanted him Its amazing when he pitches he sucks but if he's getting traded he so valuable. If Edwin Jackson for 2 months is worth as much as a lot of people claim, they really shouldn't be complaining about losing Daniel Hudson for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 06:59 AM) Its amazing when he pitches he sucks but if he's getting traded he so valuable. If Edwin Jackson for 2 months is worth as much as a lot of people claim, they really shouldn't be complaining about losing Daniel Hudson for him. That's what I don't understand. If this trade were to go down, and the Sox don't send any cash for Teahen, I don't mind the deal. And as far as talking about Hudson, he's not part of tis proposed deal because he's not part of the Sox organization. Can't live in the past, even though hindsight is 20/20. KW has to work with what he has, and we as fans have to accept that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Even for a team like the Yankees, Jackson would be worth at most 2 wins this season over throwing some other scrap out there. He's not cliff lee-ing some team to the series. Teams are too smart about player evaluations to give away guys who could be worth 20 wins over the next 5 years for 2 wins this year. Well, most teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Dye Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 What it boils down to - this can be analyzed in a longer term or shorter term fashion. You can call this s***ty GMing if you look at it over a multiyear period, with Hudson involved. Â But when you look at what we need to get better right now, then it's fine...because we need to spend to get better (sadly) and I'd rather lose Teahen than most of the other '12 salaries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 I wouldn't terribly mind if this deal didn't happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (beck72 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 06:40 AM) It actually makes the Hudson trade less awful. It would mean 1 1/2 yrs of Jackson [which he did better than expected], 1 1/2 yrs of Frasor [a solid bet to do well], one less year of Teahen, and then a possible pick as Type B after 2012 for Hudson. It's still a bad trade in hindsight. Yet it's probably less awful if this does go through. Â 5+ years of Hudson. 5+. It was an awful deal anyway you try and slice it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lasttriptotulsa Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (beck72 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 06:59 AM) Lost in the discussion could be a way of finding enough cash to sign Mark Buerhle after this year. The savings of both E-Jax and Teahen for the rest of this year, plus next for Teahen, even after factoring Frasor's option, could help. It'll take more. But it's a start. Â We will for sure have Jackson and Pierre off the books next year even if this deal doesn't go down. I'm not sure on their exact salaries but I think Jackson and Pierre are about $8,000,000 each. Combine that with Buehrle's 14,000,000 and that's $30,000,000 off the books right there. Plus, I feel CQ will be traded. If they can shed Teahen's contract, that's just icing on the cake, but I don't think this current rumored trade is the best way to do it. Their should be money in there to re-sign Buehrle cause I don't think he will try to break the bank. Â I can't imagine JR letting Buehrle walk. Even if KW doesn't want to re-sign Buehrle (I have no idea his thoughts), I see JR doing like he did with Frank Thomas around 2002, when Frank and JR sat down and hashed out a deal without KW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 01:13 PM) 5+ years of Hudson. 5+. It was an awful deal anyway you try and slice it. I said less awful. The 1 1/2 yrs Jackson gave have been decent. He's given the sox a chance to win each time out. And Frasor also could be good for the next 1 1/2 yrs, ala what Crain has done so far this year. It doesn't make the Hudson deal a wash-far from it. But overall, this proposed JAckson deal has some merit and benefit for the sox. Building the bullpen, also helps the SP. Plus, subtracting Teahen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 06:53 AM) I'm somewhat surprised that so many people think "but Jackson is worth so much!" is a reason why this can't be true. Guess it kinda reminds me of the people who were mad that we didn't get more for Vasquez, as though teams really wanted him I was making fun of foolish posters telling me Jackson was worth more than Colby f***ing Rasmus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 01:19 PM) We will for sure have Jackson and Pierre off the books next year even if this deal doesn't go down. I'm not sure on their exact salaries but I think Jackson and Pierre are about $8,000,000 each. Combine that with Buehrle's 14,000,000 and that's $30,000,000 off the books right there. Plus, I feel CQ will be traded. If they can shed Teahen's contract, that's just icing on the cake, but I don't think this current rumored trade is the best way to do it. Their should be money in there to re-sign Buehrle cause I don't think he will try to break the bank. I can't imagine JR letting Buehrle walk. Even if KW doesn't want to re-sign Buehrle (I have no idea his thoughts), I see JR doing like he did with Frank Thomas around 2002, when Frank and JR sat down and hashed out a deal without KW. Seeing what PK has done this year, I too think getting a deal done for Mark is on for the offseason.  I don't think this would be a salary dump only. Like I said, Frasor would help the bullpen. Yet the Teahen savings does make a difference.  And more deals could be made as well. If not by the deadline, Quentin in the off-season makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lasttriptotulsa Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (beck72 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 07:26 AM) Seeing what PK has done this year, I too think getting a deal done for Mark is on for the offseason. Â I don't think this would be a salary dump only. Like I said, Frasor would help the bullpen. Yet the Teahen savings does make a difference. Â And more deals could be made as well. If not by the deadline, Quentin in the off-season makes sense. Â Yea we have a ready-made replacement for CQ at about 1/8th the cost. I hate to see him go, but trading him just makes too much sense whether it's this year or in the off-season. Â I don't think Frasor is a lights-out reliever by any means, but I would imagine if they do make this trade, they will pick up his option. 3.75mil ain't too bad for what he will give you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 12:22 AM) Heath Bell makes about as much sense as Edwin Jackson. That team is what? 10 out in the wild card and they're interested in a soon-to-be free agent closer? Is it odd that Rosenthal's report almost lends credence to the Jackson rumor? It's for the draft picks. If the Jays think the draft picks they obtain for Bell are better than prospects they give up, it makes sense for them in that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 07:44 AM) It's for the draft picks. If the Jays think the draft picks they obtain for Bell are better than prospects they give up, it makes sense for them in that way. Â It still makes no sense. Give up good prospects closer to the Show for unknown draft picks who will undoubtedly be further away than the guys you're giving up? I've really started to hate the trade deadline the last few years. Twitter has given the entire world a license to be stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 07:22 AM) I was making fun of foolish posters telling me Jackson was worth more than Colby f***ing Rasmus. Â Or that Jackson was worth one of the Yankee top prospects. The guy is a #4 starter who's about to become a FA in two months. You're not getting anything that on the surface appears to be of any value. KW f***ed up. I think it's time people come to that realization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 08:47 AM) It still makes no sense. Give up good prospects closer to the Show for unknown draft picks who will undoubtedly be further away than the guys you're giving up? I've really started to hate the trade deadline the last few years. Twitter has given the entire world a license to be stupid. I've accused you plenty of times of overvaluing prospects/draftees. I think you're right on here...that kind of idea is way overvaluing draft picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 01:13 AM) This is so incredibly hypocritical it boggles my mind. You obviously dislike KW for some reason. Just say it. Because there's no sensible reason for you to be saying any of this. You can't pretend you know so much as a fan and then turn around and say, "Well, I'm not a GM!"Â "Boy, I really liked what KW did with this team. Should be a hell of a ballclub." Â "Oh wait, the guys are underachieving and a lot of them are having the worst years of their careers. KW sucks!" Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 This whole "story" surrounding a late-night trade rumor tweet reminds me of the Zack Greinke trade. Some random dude tweeted a Brewers beatwriter at 2am that he had a source saying that the Brewers traded for Greinke... only to have the Beat Writer publicly ridicule him. Next morning, the writer had egg on his face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (scenario @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 01:40 AM) fwiw, Frasor's contract has a 2012 club option at $3.75M Â Â That is where the value is in this trade. You get a pretty lights out bullpen through the end of next season and dump money in the mean time. The minor leaguer will probably be pretty midding but the Sox needed to move payroll with attendance down and you move two excess pieces that you wont really miss down the stretch. This is not the blow up the team move that people were expecting, that will likely not happen until Sunday, if at all, depending on how the standings look at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapzk Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 k0na Doug Seyller #WhiteSox Jackson and Teahen going to Toronto for frasor and a minor leaguer...de aza coming up from minors. 10 hours ago  ImDaBaron James Bond @k0na and how do you know this? 10 hours ago in reply to ↑  Doug Seyller @k0na Doug Seyller @ImDaBaron I'm sorry but I can not reveal my sources. Go Sox!  I am starting to feel this trade is a done deal now. We are just waiting for the announcement. This guy seems to have the inside track on the deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 kOna knows his stuff. He was on to Peavy before anyone knew that Peavy rejected the deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 QUOTE (kapzk @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 09:12 AM) k0na Doug Seyller #WhiteSox Jackson and Teahen going to Toronto for frasor and a minor leaguer...de aza coming up from minors. 10 hours ago  ImDaBaron James Bond @k0na and how do you know this? 10 hours ago in reply to ↑  Doug Seyller @k0na Doug Seyller @ImDaBaron I'm sorry but I can not reveal my sources. Go Sox!  I am starting to feel this trade is a done deal now. We are just waiting for the announcement. This guy seems to have the inside track on the deals.  Not the answer I was looking for when I asked him where he got this from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Uh oh: Â Ken_Rosenthal Ken Rosenthal Sources: #WhiteSox in serious talks on EJax, Teahen to #BlueJays for Frasor and prospect. Danks, Floyd also on market. #tradedeadline #MLB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapzk Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Over on the Jays board, they speak of 1B David Cooper who wasn't in the lineup last night and was filled in by Adam Loewen who is Las Vegas' regular RF. David Cooper is a pretty decent prospect by looking at his #s in AAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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