Alex Gordon Thread

[Bob Sacamano]

Unfortuantely with the reports out there, that AV you suggest is not going to be enough to to sign him. If we were offering that he would just go back to the Royals, but according to Heyman AGs camp told them as of now they are out because they were offering basically the same contract you just suggested. If the money is close he'll go back to KC, the only way he leaves is if he gets more money, closer to the $20 mil/year or if he gets that 5th year.

 

He's 32, has a world series ring, and sacrificed a few years of free agency with a cheap contract once. He's going wherever the best offer is. I don't think it'll take 9 figures. I'm thinking 4 years and around 60-70 mill.

Edited December 24, 2015 by soxfan2014

[Vance Law]

He's 32, has a world series ring, and sacrificed a few years of free agency with a cheap contract once. He's going wherever the best offer is. I don't think it'll take 9 figures. I'm thinking 4 years and around 60-70 mill.

 

That is simply absurd.

[Frank_Thomas]

That is simply absurd.

 

I agree thank you

[southsider2k5]

They are going to eat it next year anyway. Meet Scott Boras. I'd rather take a player away from them and get the ship to start sinking.

 

Sure, but if that doesn't work, putting the screws to KC's budget is also nice.

[bear_brian]

I get the feeling that it will take a minimum of $18M AAV to sign Gordon, and probably (although not as certain about this) a 5-year deal.

[caulfield12]

All "reports" I've seen had the AG group seeking 5 years at an AAV of $20K per and the Royals "allegedly" offering 4 years at an AAV of $12-13M. Of course, all agents and clubs use the press for leverage and obfuscation.

 

However, if the above reports are true or nearly so, then letting Gordon choose between 4/$72M and 5/$80M is quite a bit better than anything the Royals have on the table.

 

Personally, my belief is that with all the younger talent coming up for the Royals who need to be signed the next 1-2 years, they've got a line in the sand pegged for Gordon. At or below that line, they'll welcome back their native son with open arms. Above that line, they'll feel the need to be disciplined for the priorities that Hosmer, Perez, and Moustakas have over AG because of age, position, or both.

 

I think the Royals ceiling is likely $15-16M AAV. I haven't seen anything that suggests they've offered nearly that high (which is why his agent is likely working hard to create the reality or illusion of a market). I think a White Sox offer of 4/$72M or 5/$80M is likely $10M or more better than what the Royals would offer. That's likely enough to get him to move to the Dark Side. And if necessary, I'd bump it up to 4/$76M or 5/$85M.

 

KC is in the proverbial pickle. Gordon is ripe for the plucking. Get 'er done, Rick.

 

With Boras representing Hosmer and Moustakas, they're gone.

 

Cain is probably about a 30-40% chance to stay, but then you're also having to replace Wade Davis, Volquez, Escobar...that's six core members right there hitting FA simultaneously.

 

It's why keeping Gordon after 2017 isn't logical...not when they can spread that money across 2-3 younger guys and not have to deal with the declining last three years of a five year deal when they're going to be forced to rebuild/retool.

 

Right now, Perez, Soria, Herrera, Ventura and Duffy are the main ones under control into 2018-19.

Edited December 24, 2015 by caulfield12

[Bob Sacamano]

That is simply absurd.

 

Who is driving up the price? The reported KC offer was 4/52. Certainly not them.

[sin city sox fan]

All I want for Christmas is an Alex Gordon White Sox jersey

(unless Santa wants to really nice and deliver a Mike Trout or Bryce Harper White Sox jersey!)

[YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES!]

FWIW, this is what Dan Hayes said about 45 minutes ago on Twitter regarding the outfielder situation. Take it as you wish.

 

@The_Xsport I never said it doesn't make sense. They'd be much better off. I don't think they're going to do it though. My guess is 1/2

@The_Xsport they want to start out w/ current group going every day & if it isn't working they'll try to add a bat after season begins. 2/2

Edited December 24, 2015 by ChiSoxFanMike

[Jake]

I'm guessing Gordon gets at least 4/$80M or 5/$100M and it may be more like 4/$90M. 30 year old, s***ty Melky Cabrera got $14M AAV for 3 years last year for pete's sake. Gordon will get longer and way more AAV.

[Baron]

My response to that is bleh.

 

[flavum]

FWIW, this is what Dan Hayes said about 45 minutes ago on Twitter regarding the outfielder situation. Take it as you wish.

 

@The_Xsport I never said it doesn't make sense. They'd be much better off. I don't think they're going to do it though. My guess is 1/2

@The_Xsport they want to start out w/ current group going every day & if it isn't working they'll try to add a bat after season begins. 2/2

 

Yeah, I don't believe that's going on for a second.

 

There are a bunch of teams talking to Gordon, Upton, Cespedes, and a few guys just under that level. The Sox are going to come away with somebody, and Avisail Garcia will probably be traded in the next six weeks.

[CyAcosta41]

With Boras representing Hosmer and Moustakas, they're gone.

 

Cain is probably about a 30-40% chance to stay, but then you're also having to replace Wade Davis, Volquez, Escobar...that's six core members right there hitting FA simultaneously.

 

It's why keeping Gordon after 2017 isn't logical...not when they can spread that money across 2-3 younger guys and not have to deal with the declining last three years of a five year deal when they're going to be forced to rebuild/retool.

 

Right now, Perez, Soria, Herrera, Ventura and Duffy are the main ones under control into 2018-19.

 

Good info. Thanks.

 

Without stirring up the too frequent crap you take about the "Royals fan" thing, your specific info simply buttresses what the industry wide feeling seems to be about the Royals. They love Gordon; they'll pony-up (to a point); but there's only so far they're going to go, given his age, and given their overall situation. Put simply, they have bigger fish to fry.

 

That's why there is something of a unique opportunity here. The Sox (or another team) can swoop in, better the in-house offer by a significant margin, while still getting an excellent all-around player at something close to the market-price for his WAR. Yes, they'll pay a premium above the Royals price. Makes sense that he'll need to be pried away from his comfort zone. Fine. Pay it. He'll still be a relative bargain (even if you have to go 5 years -- if it makes you feel better, think of it internally as the first 4 years of the 5 year deal at the higher 4 year price, invest the savings, and the 5th year price for a diminished performer somehow is less offensive to our delicate sensibilities).

 

I say go for it. Market inefficiency there to be exploited. And it's all the better because Gordon's overall basket of skills is better for what THIS team, OUR team, needs. Maybe not the high ceiling in one or two categories that Upton or Cespedes might provide, but strong scores in so many areas.

 

I'm here many years as Cy Acosta and have only posted ~150 times (lurked from 2002/2003 with no account as well). Don't post that often because (a) I prefer reading other's opinions, and (b) I generally only offer my opinion if it's something I feel strongly about. I'm not going to keep flogging this horse, you know. It's personal opinion, armchair GM'ing. If I were Hahn, I'd do X. Well, allowing for the factor that RH certainly has access to a lot of hard info that I'm not privy to that might better inform his subjective opinion, I know that if I were Sox GM, I'm all about locking-up the all-around player Gordon -- reaping the benefit of his defense, left-handedness, all-around strong offensive game, fire on the field, supposed quality in the clubhouse -- then pocketing the savings over an Upton or Cespedes signing for more moves later this year or next year.

Edited December 24, 2015 by CyAcosta41

[bear_brian]

Good info. Thanks.

 

Without stirring up the too frequent crap you take about the "Royals fan" thing, your specific info simply buttresses what the industry wide feeling seems to be about the Royals. They love Gordon; they'll pony-up (to a point); but there's only so far they're going to go, given his age, and given their overall situation. Put simply, they have bigger fish to fry.

 

That's why there is something of a unique opportunity here. The Sox (or someone) can swoop in, better the in-house offer by a significant margin, while still getting an excellent all-around player at something close to the market-price for his WAR. Yes, they'll pay a premium above the Royals price. Fine. Pay it. He'll still be a relative bargain (even if you have to go 5 years -- if it makes you feel better, think of it internally as the first 4 years of the 5 year deal at the higher 4 year price, invest the savings, and the 5th year price for a diminished performer somehow is less offensive to our delicate sensibilities).

 

I say go for it. Market inefficiency there to be exploited. And it's all the better because Gordon's overall basket of skills is better for what THIS team, OUR team, needs. Maybe not the high ceiling in one or two categories that Upton or Cespedes might provide, but strong scores in so many areas.

 

I'm here many years as Cy Acosta and have only posted ~150 times (lurked from 2002/2003 with no account as well). Don't post that often because (a) I prefer reading other's opinions, and (b) I generally only offer my opinion if it's something I feel strongly about. I'm not going to keep flogging this horse, you know. It's personal opinion, armchair GM'ing. If I were Hahn, I'd do X. Well, allowing for the factor that RH certainly has access to a lot of hard info that I'm not privy to that might better inform his subjective opinion, I know that if I were Sox GM, I'm all about locking-up the all-around player Gordon -- reaping the benefit of his defense, left-handedness, all-around strong offensive game, fire on the field, supposed quality in the clubhouse -- then pocketing the savings over an Upton or Cespedes signing for more moves later this year or next year.

 

Well said. I would still like Cespedes because of his power, but Gordon does indeed bring a lot to the table. And you cannot discount the fire and clubhouse presence with WS experience.

 

[southsider2k5]

FWIW, this is what Dan Hayes said about 45 minutes ago on Twitter regarding the outfielder situation. Take it as you wish.

 

@The_Xsport I never said it doesn't make sense. They'd be much better off. I don't think they're going to do it though. My guess is 1/2

@The_Xsport they want to start out w/ current group going every day & if it isn't working they'll try to add a bat after season begins. 2/2

 

The problem is at the break you won't have access to those players, and if you do, it will cost you players AND the contract, instead of just the contract.

[Dick Allen]

FWIW, this is what Dan Hayes said about 45 minutes ago on Twitter regarding the outfielder situation. Take it as you wish.

 

@The_Xsport I never said it doesn't make sense. They'd be much better off. I don't think they're going to do it though. My guess is 1/2

@The_Xsport they want to start out w/ current group going every day & if it isn't working they'll try to add a bat after season begins. 2/2

That ha been their MO in the past. The problems with that are if you need a bat in May you probably have lost games you might have won for the first month or 2 if you had the bat all along. And with 2 wild card teams the availability of productive hitters who will be available without giving up your top prospects is slim. It is time to try something new.

[peavy44]

All I want for Christmas is an Alex Gordon White Sox jersey

(unless Santa wants to really nice and deliver a Mike Trout or Bryce Harper White Sox jersey!)

 

 

I want Alex Gordon jersey for christmas too man.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

Sorry Hayes but that is a silly and stupid plan.

[caulfield12]

The problem is at the break you won't have access to those players, and if you do, it will cost you players AND the contract, instead of just the contract.

 

We didn't give up much for Youk, Myers and Liriano.

 

Just Escobar.

 

That said, the situation with Boston needing to move him with Middlebrookspushing for pt was a bit unique because Youkilis was so popular.

 

That said, with the double wild card, those moves are getting harder and harder to come by.

[southsider2k5]

We didn't give up much for Youk, Myers and Liriano.

 

Just Escobar.

 

That said, the situation with Boston needing to move him with Middlebrookspushing for pt was a bit unique because Youkilis was so popular.

 

That said, with the double wild card, those moves are getting harder and harder to come by.

 

And we got back what we gave up, not much.

[fathom]

Our Chuck and Merkin have been much more accurate than Hayes this offseason

[Bigsoxhurt35]

Ya Hosmer and Moustakas are gone. The royals are f***ed soon. That's why they need to keep gordon. You have like a 2 year window. I also have a feeling Perez is going to break down badly for them.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

The next time Hayes is right will be the first time this whole offseason.

IIRC he wasn't right last off-season on anything. He's like a little puppet out there to throw people off the scent.

[BlackSox13]

The problem is at the break you won't have access to those players, and if you do, it will cost you players AND the contract, instead of just the contract.

I'm thinking the same thing and its not like the Sox farm is stocked with enough talent to afford the hit of trading for a big bat mid-season. Seems to be alot of mis-direction going on in the media. Sox writers seem to be leaning towards the Sox not making a move while the national writers are saying the Sox are in on signing one of the free agents. Smoke and mirrors.

 

What Hayes says only makes sense if the Sox go for it with the team as is due to payroll constraints and feel they will get rebounds from certain players and should the team flop they become sellers at the deadline. I have a hard time buying into this train of thought and feel the Sox will get an OF bat. I haven't ruled out the possibility of the Sox getting that bat by means of a trade since the surplus of outfielders makes it a buyers market right now. I think it's cheaper to find a bat via trade now then it will be during the season.

[southsider2k5]

I'm thinking the same thing and its not like the Sox farm is stocked with enough talent to afford the hit of trading for a big bat mid-season. Seems to be alot of mis-direction going on in the media. Sox writers seem to be leaning towards the Sox not making a move while the national writers are saying the Sox are in on signing one of the free agents. Smoke and mirrors.

 

What Hayes says only makes sense if the Sox go for it with the team as is due to payroll constraints and feel they will get rebounds from certain players and should the team flop they become sellers at the deadline. I have a hard time buying into this train of thought and feel the Sox will get an OF bat. I haven't ruled out the possibility of the Sox getting that bat by means of a trade since the surplus of outfielders makes it a buyers market right now. I think it's cheaper to find a bat via trade now then it will be during the season.

 

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