mac9001

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 29, 2017 -> 06:02 PM) Its not rushing. Kopech could easily be 100% ready this time next year (in fact, that's his exact trajectory) and Jimenez was considered by the Cubs MLB ready. They just didnt have a spot for him. Jimenez at the very least is forcing a AA callup (you could argue the Sox are wasting time and hurting his development leaving him in W-S much longer), and from there it's only one step to AAA. See what Boston did with Devers? It's not out of the ordinary to rocket a guy up to the majors who is playing well enough to justify such a quick ascension. That's exactly what it is, an exception derived from Boston's desperation to win now and unwillingness to give up value in the trade market. They're rushing the development of this kid because they're trying to win now. You're still not accepting the fact there's no one in the Sox front office that's going to be advocating pursing a win now strategy. Most of them will probably be fairly content finishing last as that's probably exactly what they expect and that's what Jerry, Kenny and Rick have all agreed to.

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 29, 2017 -> 05:38 PM) The Cubs thought Jimenez was MLB ready this spring. I trust their judgment. Kopech is on a perfect timetable to be a 2018 midseason callup. No, they did not. If they had they would not have assigned him to high A ball.

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 29, 2017 -> 05:14 PM) Yes if they do literally nothing to improve this team in the off-season they will be bad again. But do you know Rick Hahn to do nothing in the off-season? Do you really think the Sox will just sit on the sidelines? I don't know, and neither do you. When you look at whether they should choose to at least put an MLB quality team on the field the answer to me is clear. They can make this team decent without spending $200m on free agents or trading any of their prospects. It really wouldn't be too difficult. They built a pretty good pen out of a pair of cheap trades and some minor league free agents, why can't they do that again? Don't tell that they won't be any good, tell me why they shouldn't. How does it hurt to win a few games in 2018? You're clearly struggling to accept the reality of the current White Sox team. You can try to be competitive. But you don't get a lot of value spending FA money. If you spend 200 million this offense you might make the Sox a .500 team. I can say with a fair amount of certainty Rick Hahn will not be spending this offseason. He's not in denial, he see's what we have and it's not enough. It's not enough where spending significant amount of financial resources will yield a competitive on-field product. We're going to be bad, we will not spend this off-season and we're going to see a lot of growing pains. It's not going to be easy to watch, it will likely lead to a lot of frustration and disappointment. But at some point things will start to look up and we'll catch a break two. Then and only then will you see Rick Hahn commit to winning. For now, he's going to do what we're all doing. He's going to sit back and watch how things play out and hope for the best.

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 29, 2017 -> 04:57 PM) That is a choice they can make this offseason. There is more than enough available in free agency (at reasonable prices) and on the farm, assuming they are aggressive calling up Jimenez and Kopech, to field a team that can be competitive on a game-by-game basis. Probably not playoffs, but forward momentum towards 2019 (a season they absolutely must not spend wallowing in the basement). You're assuming Kopech or Jimenez can give you even replacement level production. There's a good chance Kopech will need at least a few more years to work out his command. I'd easily take the over on 6 walks per start if you call him up right now. Jimenez is in high-A ball. Let's see if he can hit his weight in the upper minors before even considering his time table. We also have no bullpen. You might need to spend 50-60 million on just the bullpen to bring it back to respectability. Kopech and Jimenez won't change the fact this is likely the worst team in baseball in 2018.

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 29, 2017 -> 04:42 PM) The So have like 10 top 100 prospects, 3 of which are top 10 caliber, and a top 3 pick in 2018 all but sewn up. There is no way the Astros compiled that kind of talent after one draft. But hey, if you want to run with the Astros comparison...do you think it's worth punting an entire season of baseball to get ourselves a Mark Appel? The Sox would probably love to be competitive next year. It's just highly unlikely given the weakness of our probable lineup and complete lack of bullpen (and probably not much of a rotation). You can go out and spend 50-60 million to try and to be semi-respectable, but you'll probably still fail. We're going to be bad, probably worst team in baseball bad. You can't buy your way out of it, we'll need to develop and graduate some decent MLB talent and we probably need at least 2 seasons until we even start thinking of being competitive.

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 29, 2017 -> 03:23 PM) How can you say this so assuredly? The Twins are no better now than the Sox will be next year and they are 1 game below .500. The Brewers began the year a cruel joke of a roster and here they are, it's almost August, battling for first with the "juggernaut" Cubs. If you are this pessimistic about Moncada and the arms then I don't see how you could support the trades made over the last 8 months. You are basically saying they gave away Chris Sale and Adam Eaton for nothing. You trade Abreu, Avi reverts, Moncada flops and we probably don't have a single legitimate major league hitter on the team next year. In terms of the distribution of what's likely to happen next year I'd be more comfortable being pessimistic than optomistic.

QUOTE (JPR @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 07:26 PM) Hey Tinley orland frankfort Palos hills palos park Mokena new Lenox homer glen Olympia fields we are talking millionaires...rest in peace but Bernie mac lived down there twista too. R Kelly. The drummer for styx...way more families with bundles of cash to blow. Tinley is the spot and the reason why it's been the #1 concert destination for a list bands for decades on end...nothing but money and disposable income down there. And it's still growing unlike the west suburbs. Will county has been on fire for years when it comes to population booms. Those stadiums in da burbs work flawlessly. Especially here in arizona and for our neighbors in Cali too. Not even close from a population density perspective and Will county is significantly less affluent than Dupage, Lake or the burbs of Cook County. It's also at a significant disadvantage from a public transportation standpoint. Population Density.

QUOTE (The Mighty Mite @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 07:14 PM) Agree, either downtown or a near Western suburb, somewhere like Hillside which would put it smack dab in the middle of the Metro area. The western burbs are probably the next best place. What gave Rosemont an advantage was public transportation. You could have built a CTA stop right next to the park, there's already a metra stop there, a Metra/CTA bus terminal near by and new highway connections to the western burbs. Plus, O'Hare and a ton of high end hotels to stay for anyone coming in from out of town.

Your average Cub fan is not a baseball fan. They're just looking for some decent entertainment. You offer an competitive entertainment experience and people will show up. This is all kind of a moot point as the land they had available is now being developed. But there's no doubt in my mind it presented the best location in Chicagoland for building a huge entertainment focused development anchored with baseball stadium. That entire area, the western burbs and most of Northern Chicago is being heavily developed. If i'm going to build a new stadium it's definitely not on the south side of Chicago. If the south side is the only option I start to seriously considering other cities such as Vegas.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 06:15 PM) The NW burbs are the opposite of centralized. It is one thing to say move downtown to the actual center of the metro area. It is another to move south as that is where their fan base is. Rosemont makes no sense at all. There's a reason someone just dropped 50 million to build a stadium for an unaffiliated minor league team and Rosemont offered free land to the Cubs to build a stadium. It's a perfect place to put a big entertainment spot. You have easy highway access, endless parking, airport, metra access, CTA link, tons of food/bar/entertainment/casion/shopping options and most importantly a population base with a ton of money.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 05:53 PM) It would take a generation at least to do that, and in the meantime you would lose your existing fan base. Judging by attendance and TV ratings it's not much of a fan base and you'll place the team in fairly centralized geographic area with a fairly affluent high income population base with decent access to public transportation. At some point they're going to start thinking about a new stadium and and for the Sox sake I hope they seriously consider getting out of the south side.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 05:50 PM) The south side baseball team to the NW suburbs? That would be awful. You'll build a whole new fan base, one that might actually support the team.

QUOTE (JPR @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 05:11 PM) Still think they should build a bigger ball park by the Tweeter Center in Tinley Park. I bet it would be sold out every night and they could add more seats to make the capacity 50,000+. The cell or whatever it's called till the next corporate contract comes up, is in a horrible location. And as you all know water is also wet unless its frozen and the sky is blue unless it's night. I really wish they'd build a new ball park in the Orland/Tinley area. $$$$$ Tinley Park is a pretty terrible place to build anything. 80% of Chicagoland would view Tinley Park as an inconvenient drive. The absolute best place to build a park was Rosemont. They're actually putting an unaffiliated minor league team there and I'm willing to bet they'll do fantastically well in terms of attendance.

I'm not entirely sold there's a huge benefit to having these guys with Coop for a couple months or that it will drastically change their future development regardless. I'd be fine letting them finish off their AAA season and call it a year. Give them both a chance to win a rotation spot in spring training. At this point I think I would save the additional option year and just start next year fresh.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 11:13 AM) Huge list of players to get at-bats for now... Hayes will probably get pushed out by Gillaspie/Delmonico/Asche. Feeling Tilson has little to no future due to his lack of power playing 81 games in Chicago. Then you've got Cordell, Willy Garcia, Liriano, Engel, Leury (who might have to move back to SS), Avi Garcia (upon return), Hanson, Sanchez, Saladino, obviously Matt Davidson until they find someone better. Maybe, just maybe, Eddie Alvarez or Peter. That's 14-16 players there alone. Plus, Abreu is ensconced somewhere in there, either at 1B or DH. How many of them will be on the next Sox playoff team, one wonders... If we're struggling to find atbats for any of these guys that's a good sign. I figure some will produce and they'll be rewarded with playing time and the rest are roster filler at Charlotte. All of these guys are lucky to have this opportunity and hopefully some of them will stick.

From a purely development standpoint it seems like we're rushing this kid a bit. I'd have preferred to get him 30-40 AAA innings before starting his service clock. There's no shortage of AAAA bullpen arms in Charlotte to throw into the churn. But he's definitely the most interesting relief prospect we have (that's not undergoing TJ surgery).

Also, i'm surprised Bummer is getting the promotion. I would have figured Clark or Purke would be the next lefty up.

It's strange seeing people excited over this kid and so down on Cordell. I personally view Cordell more favorably, but I wonder if people would have felt this kid was an appropriate return for Swarzak?

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 21, 2017 -> 06:25 PM) On his way to W-S? One would hope, if I went 5-5 and they sat me the next day I would lose my s***.

Next in line for a promotion to AAA should probably be Jordan Guerrero. Given Stephens limited time in AA and the fact his peripherals are not conducive of his ERA it would be appropriate to keep him there longer.

I'd say whatever our win-loss record is at the end of this year, subtract another 5 for next season and potentially far worse. I'm not overly optimistic we'll see significant production from our current prospect stock next year. Which means if we have any quality production next year it'll be from guys like Sanchez, Garcia, Abreu and thus they'll likely have trade value and we'll likely trade them. You probably don't stop trading our current vets until the new stock of prospects start to show a noticeable level of mlb production (2019). Then consider filling out the roster with free agency in 2020.

Tyler had a 27% K-rate in AAA and averaged higher for most of his minor league career. My trading philosophy on prospects with high K-rates is get what you can when you can get it, there's a overwhelmingly high chance this kid will never be a productive major league hitter.

Zavala showing some serious power. Crushed a ball and with a low effort swing.

1 Moncada 2 Jimenez 3 Kopech 4 Robert 5 Rutherford 6 Lopez 7 Giolito 8 Dunning 9 Hansen 10 Cease 11 Collins 12 Adams 13 Burger 14 Guerrero 15 Stephens 16 Zavala 17 Clarkin 18 Sheets 19 Burdi 20 Delmonico 21 Fulmer 22 Adolfo 23 Fisher 24 Basabe 25 Flores 26 Call 27 Mendick 28 Skoug 29 Tilson 30 Cooper Guys I considered and those I think could easily be top 30 (up arrows) ^^^ Polo May ^^^ Bummer ^^^ Danish Alvarez Peter ^^^ Basto ^^^ Flete ^^^ Booker ^^^ Rose Michalczewski ^^^ Gonzalez Martinez Diaz Yrizarri Notes: Kopech - Command scares the hell out of me. He throws a lot of wasted pitches that no one would ever swing at. Giolito - Consistency is keeping him from being a true TOR prospect. I feel better about him figuring it out than Kopach improving his command. Collins - Shows any improvement in hit tool and could easily bump him up five spots. Adams - Opposite of Kopech, throws too many pitches around the plate. Stuff is better than k-rate would indicate, but might need adjustments to approach. Highest floor of any starter we have. Guerrero - If he was throwing 95-96 he would probably be our top pitching prospect. Gun doesn't show it but pitches like a true power pitcher, swinging strike rate higher than Kopech. Of all the games I've watched this year hitters looked most uncomfortable against Guerrero. Basabe - Slight improvement in hit tool can move him up 10 spots. But not overly optimistic as k-rate has shown no improvement. Zavala - If Collins was putting up his numbers he'd be in the top 5. Fulmer - Needs to show some semblance of command to justify continued prospect rank. Hansen - Controlling the running game will quickly become a major issue if he doesn't adjust. Adolfo - No improvement to K-rate despite decent numbers over last two months. Not sold unless that improves.

The fact they were able to get a legit top 30-40 prospect and a promising left is a fairly adequate return. But I definitely like the return better from the Yankee's side. They're getting a solid closer with a decent track record and one hell of an arm in Kahnle. I like Kahnle's chances of being a dominant reliever over the next few years better than Rutherford ever seeing the bigs. In a few years we'll be really lucky to pull off a trade like this.