witesoxfan

I believe it was DK who mentioned that the players may have liked Manuel and moving him might be a bad thing. But has anyone considered that that may also be a bad thing? I mean, maybe they like him because he allows them to be lazy, not hustle, lolligag around, and just flat out play like s***. Get his ass out of town before it gets any worse. I'd take almost anyone over Manuel.

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Roman, get a clue about how the body works before you post this inane garbage. Esteban, prior to this season, had only surpassed 190 innings one time(I believe). He has thrown 210-220 this year. If you throw an extraordinary amount of innings, you're going to get very tired very quickly. For example, if you are lifting weights, and you can normally bench 150 5 times for 3 reps, you will be able to do that all the time. However, you add 15 pounds to that, you do it 6 times per rep, and you do 4 reps, your arms are going to either fall off, or you won't be able to complete it with the same results you did with your first 150-5-3. Bring in the baseball analogy here, and you'll see that Elo's arm was used to throwing 175 or so innings a year, but he could get up to 190 as well. When he was asked to do 40-50 more innings then his arm was used to, his arm because very tired and he experienced a dead arm period. You wondered why I and almost everyone else on these boards knew that KC was going to falter come September? There's your reason right there.

If you read carefully, most of us want ONE OF Konerko and Thomas gone to save MONEY. Both are very slow, RH power hitters who ground into a ton of DPs and have little range defensively(and Thomas can't turn the 3-6-3 or throw to 3rd to save his life). Spiezio actually CAN throw from 1st to 3rd if need be, he can turn the 3-6-3, and he also have a great glove in the field(not sure if it's the best in the league, but it's pretty damn close....he and Mientkiewicz are about equal at the very least)

I'll say sometime between a Tuesday and about February 15th. How does that sound?

I thought of a few reasons why our record has been so poor this year....and I came up with a few, and they are all solid reasons as to why we didn't win(BTW, Jim Thome is not included....sorry Greg ) Losses to Detroit. Cut our losses in half, you can add 4 more wins to the win column. Another was run support. We too often scored in bunches. We'd score 10 runs 1 game and 2 runs the other.....very reminiscent of last year. It's a huge, huge reason why Esteban does not and probably will not reach 20 wins this year and why he will not win the Cy Young. Buehrle was also hit by that as well. And Garland and Colon were also victims of that. But it was mainly Loaiza. We win half of those games where those the staff got no run support, and that's easily another 4-10 wins. I believe we lost 1-0 4 or 5 times this year, and Loaiza lost 1-0 3 times(twice to Detroit). I can understand 2 times or so, but that is un-frickin-believable. Another was our 3-7 stretch before the ASB. We got 7-3 or even 5-5 during that stretch and we could have actually had a shot. And the last reason I came up with was the fact that we won 2 out of the last 7 games against Minny. We win 2 of those games and we are still mathematically in this race, and if those 4 wins came in the Chicago series and we had no idea what was going to happen in the series in Minnesota, we would actually have had a chance of getting in. We were very fortunate our season was not WAY worse then it was. We were probably the luckiest team in the majors this year. We were hit by very, very, very few injuries(Koch had his elbow f***ed up all year, but that was from Oakland....Wunsch was on the DL for a bit, Wright was, and I believe Sandy was on it at one point as well....or maybe that was Miguel....I can't remember), AND we had a non-roster invitee come in and compete for the Cy Young award, lead the league in wins, ERA, and qualtiy starts(which I think Loaiza still leads in) for most of the year, and we ripped the Expos off royally in getting Bartolo Colon(we gave up El Cañon(aka El Heartattack, Antonio Osuna), Rocky Biddle, Delvis Lantigua, and Jeff Liefer, and we were then fortunate enough to get Robby Alomar and Carl Everett for a few minor leaguers. The fact that this team didn't win almost makes me want to cry. This was THE most talented team on the planet. They just didn't mix well. You can't get a bunch of sluggers together and win a pennant nowadays, unless you have the desire to win. I think you know what I'm getting at.

Most likely, yes. As long as he got 30-90.

Not sure if anything I'm going to say was suggested, but I'm gonna say it none the less. Supposedly, with last year being the last years of both Richie Sexson's and Geoff Jenkins contracts, the Brewers have put them on the trade block. What I'm about to suggest may be crazy, but it may just work. What I think I'd atleast try to do is do an "Our-problem for your-problem" type of deal, only this time, both would benefit because we'd be trading good players. The problem for both teams is that a lot of money is guaranteed to the players they are giving up in the trades. IIRC, Jenkins is due to make about $13 mill this year, and Konerko is due $8 mill per over the next two years. What I think could be interesting is to see if we couldn't trade Koney and a minor leaguer for Jenkins straight up. That not only takes care of Koney's salary for 2005, but also makes our lineup a little less RH. But we'd then have a lineup that includes two guys making double digit millions of dollars. What I suggest we'd do then is kind of drastic, but I'm not the first to suggest it. We then trade Maggs for some very good talent(possibly to a team that has some good relievers, a decent player or two in the majors, and a few good prospects). The thought that instantly comes to mind is LA....great relievers, great starting pitching staff, and they have that Izturis kid who can really play some rock solid defense. Now I realize that getting a starting pitcher from them wouldn't be a great idea, but getting Mota and Shuey/Quantrill wouldn't hurt. I personally think they'd take a Maggs for Mota, Shuey/Quantrill, and Izturis deal and wouldn't even think about it.....and maybe we could sneak a prospect or two from them as well(as long as Barry-Berry doesn't occur). That then leaves us without a 1Bman, which then brings me to my next thought....bring Daubach back. Sure he's slow, but he did put up some pretty good numbers in Boston, and though he is streaky, you know what kind of numbers you will get from him....probably .260 25 80 type seasons....though I believe he has driven in 100 runs like 2 or 3 times. Does not free up a ton of money and we aren't in the rebuilding process, but does give us another $6 mill or so to use to bring back Robbie at the very least. And Javy Vazquez will also be available because the players voted not to split the games in between Montreal and San Juan, so maybe we could do a little highway robbery and get him to replace Bartolo. Just a few thoughts, mainly just rambling.

Well I'll pose the question.... Who would you rather see in a White Sox uniform next year, Carl Everett AND Bartolo Colon, or Magglio Ordonez?

He said in an interview that he was going to start somewhere next year. Who the hell is going to sign him to start for them at SS?

I'll gladly help Jerry..... ....pack his f***ing bags. :fyou Please do let the door hit you in the ass on the way out and go catch up on old times with Terry Bevington, whom you have three things in common. 1 - You both managed the White Sox 2 - You are both douchebags 3 - You both managed the White Sox like douchebags

Welcome aboard Jeff. I not only know you'll enjoy it here(as I'm sure Cotts and Bull will tell you[mind the "F-YOU COTTS" threads ]), but I hope for you and Bull to get up to the majors ASAP.

Exactly. What Frank said and what Frank meant are two totally different things. Here's what he said: "We've had a great season." Here's what he meant: "I've had a great season."

I agree. For starters....carrying the ball over 40 times should be against the rules. Anyways, Ricky, have fun with your ACL in the near future....it will probably tear and you'll be doing a jam session on ESPN taking Jamal Anderson's spot. Also....Ricky didn't even have that great of a game. 42 carries and like 152 yards? That's like 3.5 yards a carry. I'd say the Bills defense pretty much shut him down. It's not their fault that he got the ball 42 times. And finally....the fact that the Bills have like 11 or 12 penalties and the Dolphins had 3 is terrible. If you tell me a team ran the ball 45 times in an NFL game and there was not ONE holding call, I am going to call you a f***ing douchebag. :fyou the Dolphins. Have fun in Buffalo come December. I'm sure they'll just be in love with those 10* days with 3 inches of snow and more constantly coming down.

I was just going to mention the fact that batting averages were way lower then than they are now. How many people do you suppose that are my age on here knew that the one year in the AL during the 60s only ONE player hit over .300? Hawk had a pretty good career. Probably a Reggie Sanders or Danny Tartabull type player...an all around solid-player.

And as far as I'm concerned, his first and LAST as a member of the Chicago White Sox.

You are not the only one who has thought this.....though for all I know, Everett probably was the one who said it.

Here's the major difference between Konerko and Ortiz. Ortiz is making about $1 million this year, while Konerko is making around $6.5 mill and will make around $8 mill per over the next two years. I'd take .250 20 70 from Ortiz over Konerko's .300 30 100, simply based on the financial part of it alone. And to suggest that his numbers would be any worse had he been in the White Sox lineup this year instead of the Red Sox lineup is just wrong. He would have added a LH bat in the middle of a very RH lineup...that would have made a world of difference. So was the 2000 White Sox offense one of the greatest of all time too? I personally would say....no. You know what I find so funny about that? The Marlins(IRod's team) have a GREAT manager. The Royals(Sweeney's team) have a GREAT MANAGER. And in 2001, the DBacks(RJ's team) were managed VERY WELL. I see some KEY words in there. And if you used them in describing the Chicago White Sox, you would be laughed at.

Were you wearing any Dolphins gear? Maybe the guy is a Jills or a J-E-T-S-suck-suck-suck fan???? Better luck next time. Maybe they will let you take the next test on the bus or some other form of public transportation. J/K Jills....lol...you crack me up every time. Now wait this weekend when the Bills f***ing dominate the Dolphins. When are the Bills going to start dominating?? You already made your obvious point once dips***.

Double that Williams number and you would have been close. What did the Bills have like 70 TOTAL offensive yards, not counting the garbage yards (as you put it) on that last drive? If that Dolphins defense is over-rated, the Bills offense is not much better than pee wee. Dolphins must have been rolling in the luck tonight. Crow eaten. The Bills flat out sucked tonight. Where was the offense, I'm not sure. I saw atleast 2 drops from Bills players, and that is unexcusable. The Bills also turned the ball over twice inside the redzone, or atleast in field goal range. They don't turn it over there(like dumbasses), and this is a much different game. BTW, that was a nice yard-per-carry average by Williams too. Anyone could run for 150 yards if they got the ball 42 times.

C - Olivo 1B - Thomas 2B - Alomar SS - Luis Castillo(yes, I realize he's a 2B, but I think he could very easily play SS....doesn't have a great arm, but does have great range) 3B - Crede LF - Shannon Stewart CF - Rowand RF - Guerrero DH - Everett (Obviously, in my scenario, we make some major trades....those include trading Maggs, Konerko, and Lee) A rotation of Colon, Buehrle, Loaiza, Garland, and Burkett, Suppan, or Wright...someone cheaper. Bullpen of Gordon, Marte, Sullivan, Hawkins, Wunsch, and Diaz(Koch and Schoe are traded as well) Bench of Daubach, Graffy, Alomar, Valentin, and Harris If I count right, that is a team whose salary is like just under $70 mill. That can be done, or so I hope.

I want more team speed and a deeper pitching staff. We have a #5 starter this year(a good #5 starter), we win the division in a landslide. We have a decent bullpen for the whole year, we win the division in a landslide. And we have a lineup that isn't as streaky as ours is(and teams that depend on the 3-run homer, like we did, are always streaky) and can beat you in more ways then one, and we win the division in a landslide. This team has a lot of talent. They just don't have the right talent to win. A more complete team will spark this team to a division championship. So, IMO, you keep 1 or 2 of Thomas, Ordonez, Konerko, and Lee, you make it a priority to resign Alomar and Everett, and you have yourselves a pretty good team, assuming you make the right signings. Signing Shannon Stewart from Minnesota would be huge for us....adds another dimension to the team and takes one away from Minnesota. Maybe make a trade for Dave Roberts in LA or Juan Pierre in Florida, etc. I know one move I'd love to make is to sign Luis Castillo....but I just wonder if he would work as a SS. If so, he'd be very good as well. I would also love to sign Hawkins away from Minnesota. That'd be a great move and would hurt the Twins as well.

By the way Witsoxfan, the SOX will finsih in third place, you told me otherwise two night ago. I don't think so.

We'll just agree to disagree then.

It's probably just a postgame extra type of thing where the media talks to Manuel. And then the person just used the word important to catch your eye and make you want to hear it. Apparently, it worked.