SCCWS

The FA market has ups and downs as we saw with Machado/Harper vs some pitchers last winter. Grandal turned down 4yr-$60 Mil last winter to take $16 this year. I think starting offers would be 3-$48Mil. I agree w some he is a luxury although we need a LH bat.

But assuming Kopech Robert and Madrigal are added to ML roster next year, when should a change be made? Those 3 plus Gio, Cease, Lopez, TA, Eloy and Yoan are the major components of the rebuild. There are other pieces like Vaughn and maybe Collins and then the major FA additions. I consider it a bad sign if the big 3 from the coaching staff all return next year.

I agree but in fairness Abreu has hit 16 of his 28 HR on the road.

Agree they would have to sign an "ace pitcher" .

With the way he has pitched this year, Gio will be an ace going into next year and be the Sox #1 starter.

He and McCann both have bounced back after the brief post All-Star slump. Must have been the partying at the AS game.

You must be using ESPN which is wrong. Going in to today, TA is 6th in AL and Moncada is 11th. LeMahieu is leading with .338

They are firmly 3rd in the division now. Did you mean 3rd in WC race?

I think that might do it or worse case they have to go 4 years. I think 6 is a good number for him.

I think Rendon fits in to the same category as Grandal. With McCann's August so far, unless he has a total collapse down the stretch, I think Hahn will not spend a huge amount on Grandal. Rendon is a stud offensively, but Hahn will go w Moncada and Madrigal. Unless you foresee someone moving to right, I don't see big bucks going to Rendon. I think Hahn will go for production from RF and will spend big bucks or trade to get that player. Hopefully as CWS said, a LH bat.

Walton gets really old really quickly doing a college basketball game. Who the hell thought he should do an MLB game.

In fairness, Renteria is ranked 18 of 32 in salary. That is pretty decent especially w his limited managerial experience coming in.

Beating the Astros in a game you use your "#5 starter" is a beautiful thing.

Supposedly a great framer but his SB%( which can be mis-leading ) is not as good as McCann. We will see where the market goes this off-season. The Mets offered him 4-60 and he turned it down. As Poppy notes it is a year later.

I understand your thinking on McCann and he would be an excellent backup with just his defense. Also cut Grandal 's catching duties and utilize his bat to prevent his drop off late in year. But if Grandal already turned down 4-60, as I said earlier I would guess you have to go 5-80 to get him.

If he turned that down last year, that may have to be the opening bid. Maybe more like 5 and 80

Moan: Two questions. What kind of deal would you see him getting? What happens if McCann has a good( .280+) 2nd half? Grandal is getting 18.2 MIL this year. Now that was a 1 yr Brewer all in move. He is 30 and he turned down 4 YR $60 last season when he took the $18.2 to become a FA. His BA drops off pretty consistently 2nd half each year but homers don't. He has struggled in numerous postseason appearances. He now averages 120 starts so he is is pretty healthy. Very good defensive catcher although this year McCann may be slightly better stat wise. He would bat mostly LH which is a lineup need. I would guess he takes best offer but that might be minimum 4 YR $60 Mil again.

or trade him at the deadline........................................

Also since he can play multiple positions, there is plenty of opportunity to get him AB w/o affecting the rebuild plan. I posted last year I thought he would be a good swap for Fulmer when both seemed lost but now he is even cheaper.

He has but he also has caught less the last two seasons. He really had one good season his rookie year in 2015. I assume injuries have affected him but it doesn't hurt to give him a shot. He is a switch-hitter but he has always been lousy as a RH.

Everyone is high on Grandal and low on McCann since his post All-Star drop. But check out Grandal's 2nd half stats the last few years. His production takes a sizable drop as well. Good thing is Grandal has post season experience . Bad thing is he has hit.107 for his career in 75+ABS. If you sign Grandal, I think you have to reduce his games played to see if he is breaking down late every year. Every team has a weak offensive spot which you hope is a real plus defender. Maybe we live w McCann( if he re-signs) and spend the money elsewhere.

He also has had limited protection in the lineup behind him as well during his White Sox years. He has certainly done a good job driving in RBI's this season. He has benefited by Leury and Yoan getting on in front of him.

So hopefully we are in at least the WC hunt next season. That way Jose can lead us down the home stretch.

Great stuff you dug out. I looked through some of the articles but the one that does the real in-depth on batting order was from 2009 w 2002 data. There is a lot more shifting now. As we agree and so did the article OBP is the key at the top. I saw one conclusion that each team based on their lineup needs to maximize data since it is not cookie-cutter. For example, JD Martinez led MLB in RBI's last year and got a higher % from the #3 spot than the #4. He is again this year. He is on a team w good hitters in front of him. Manny Machado also got a higher RBI % from the 3 than the 4 last year. But for most of the season he was on a shitty team. Yelich got a higher % from the 2 than the 3. So I think each player and the make-up of the rest of the lineup is subjective. I realize some managers also play lefty/righty. Regardless the articles do point out the importance of the #2 spot compared to previous opinions on the best type 2 hitter.

But you also said your best hitter should bat 1st to maximize plate appearances. Your best hitter may also be your best run producer. I still think your top OBP guy leads of or 2nd and then best run producer is 3rd or 4th. If 3 or 4 you do need a good bat behind him so he does not get pitched around too much.