Moncada

[soxfan49]

Before or after August 20 when Moncada is hurt again?

[Balta1701]

25 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

Before or after August 20 when Moncada is hurt again?

This is the White Sox. They had both Grandal and seemingly Moncada play through bad backs last year. They had Robert swing one handed for a month. They regularly play short handed for a week at a time. You have to give us a standard. Hurting more than now? Hurting and in effective? Injured but the team won’t IL him? Or actually on the IL?

[South Side Hit Men]

Moncada stated today he is still hurt, is not 100%, but can better play through it than when he was initially placed on the IL.

Bottom line is he likely needs surgery or several months of rest, but the Sox are going to Sox through the remaining 10 meaningless weeks and then do what they should have done in May.

[baseball_gal_aly]

2 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Moncada stated today he is still hurt, is not 100%, but can better play through it than when he was initially placed on the IL.

Bottom line is he likely needs surgery or several months of rest, but the Sox are going to Sox through the remaining 10 meaningless weeks and then do what they should have done in May.

I have a feeling they're going to give it rest, and see if he comes to ST able to do something but I expect him to get surgery in May 2024 and his Sox career will end quietly. 

[Bob Sacamano]

2 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Moncada stated today he is still hurt, is not 100%, but can better play through it than when he was initially placed on the IL.

Bottom line is he likely needs surgery or several months of rest, but the Sox are going to Sox through the remaining 10 meaningless weeks and then do what they should have done in May.

Honestly at this point, what’s the point? Just 60-day IL him and see him at Spring Training.

[South Side Hit Men]

57 minutes ago, baseballgalaly said:

I have a feeling they're going to give it rest, and see if he comes to ST able to do something but I expect him to get surgery in May 2024 and his Sox career will end quietly. 

 

39 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Honestly at this point, what’s the point? Just 60-day IL him and see him at Spring Training.

Moncada should have gotten a second and or third opinion to determine whether back surgery is a preferable option. If he had it before or has it now, and recovers, he can have a good year for his FA contract.

I wouldn't trust the Sox with my health. Hell, I might not trust them with my next Churros.

[Stinky Stanky]

1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

 

Moncada should have gotten a second and or third opinion to determine whether back surgery is a preferable option. If he had it before or has it now, and recovers, he can have a good year for his FA contract.

I wouldn't trust the Sox with my health. Hell, I might not trust them with my next Churros.

Are we sure a second opinion wasn’t done?

 

[Balta1701]

8 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

 

Moncada should have gotten a second and or third opinion to determine whether back surgery is a preferable option. If he had it before or has it now, and recovers, he can have a good year for his FA contract.

I wouldn't trust the Sox with my health. Hell, I might not trust them with my next Churros.

I think we have seen and heard enough around baseball to expect that back surgery is a last ditch option with a good chance of ending your career if it is done, with a risk of long term quality of life issues as well. Bringing him back now if there is still pain is questionable, but you try everything else before you do surgery on that body part.

[Kyyle23]

59 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I think we have seen and heard enough around baseball to expect that back surgery is a last ditch option with a good chance of ending your career if it is done, with a risk of long term quality of life issues as well. Bringing him back now if there is still pain is questionable, but you try everything else before you do surgery on that body part.

Yea we all watched the same thing with Crede, and there was no get better with surgery.  The back is just too much moving parts/muscles/tendons/cartilage 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

I think we have seen and heard enough around baseball to expect that back surgery is a last ditch option with a good chance of ending your career if it is done, with a risk of long term quality of life issues as well. Bringing him back now if there is still pain is questionable, but you try everything else before you do surgery on that body part.

There are minor back surgeries (micro-surgery) that are less invasive and require much less recovery time. But it depends on the problem.

[oldsox]

Back in 2008, I believe, two players had similar back injuries.  One was Todd Helton, who disdained surgery and was out a long time.  The other guy was a shortstop who played for Braves and Dodgers, can't remember his name.  Very good player.  He chose surgery and was back in about 2 months.  

[South Side Hit Men]

5 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

I think we have seen and heard enough around baseball to expect that back surgery is a last ditch option with a good chance of ending your career if it is done, with a risk of long term quality of life issues as well. Bringing him back now if there is still pain is questionable, but you try everything else before you do surgery on that body part.

Just said what I said about a second opinion because Yoan stated he feels better but he’s not at 100%. 

Why is he out there now?

Will it get better with more rest, does playing not exacerbate the issue (seemed to get worse in May before they finally pulled the plug)?

Has a quality independent doctor assessed the situation on Yoan’s behalf?

Doesn’t sound like we will get any of these answered based on limited reporting around the White Sox and what has been disclosed to date. The Sox can pound sand, but just hope Yoan gets the best advice.

[elrockinMT]

I am not sure what all the angst is about. It’s common for players to want to be out there on the field even when playing hurt. I don’t think that over Spring Training and 162 game schedule that players are at 100% very often 

[JoeC]

1 hour ago, oldsox said:

Back in 2008, I believe, two players had similar back injuries.  One was Todd Helton, who disdained surgery and was out a long time.  The other guy was a shortstop who played for Braves and Dodgers, can't remember his name.  Very good player.  He chose surgery and was back in about 2 months.  

Rafael Furcal?

[South Side Hit Men]

3 minutes ago, elrockinMT said:

I am not sure what all the angst is about. It’s common for players to want to be out there on the field even when playing hurt. I don’t think that over Spring Training and 162 game schedule that players are at 100% very often 

The angst comes from the fact this could be a persistent and possibly career ending injury if he can't recover and be effective, and the Sox' recent track record with assessing treating in season injuries.

It's not the Eloy has a mosquito bite, he's sitting out 26 games to recover across three different minor league facilities to find his favorite one and keep his rate stats high type injury.

[mmmmmbeeer]

6 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Yea we all watched the same thing with Crede, and there was no get better with surgery.  The back is just too much moving parts/muscles/tendons/cartilage 

Science has come a long way since Crede days.  Granted, it all depends on what the exact issue he's having with his back but there are options,  For instance, fusing was a common procedure but now, given certain conditions are met, they have an alternative to fusion available.  

A guy who works for me has a very bad back and is going through this stage now, trying to determine the correct treatment.  He was just telling me the other day how the older doctors he goes to offer him older options.  He's now seeing a much younger doctor who is up on all the new options and has had great success with his patients.

TL;DR - Back issues aren't necessarily the death knell to an athlete's career the way they were 15-20 years go.

[The Kids Can Play]

14 hours ago, Stinky Stanky said:

Are we sure a second opinion wasn’t done?

 

You're right we don't know if a second medical opinion was attained. However we do know the history of this Sox front office handling injuries is atrocious and negligent. I will never give this inept FO any credit or benefit of the doubt, they did everything possible for Moncada in terms of the best medical treatments and options out there including if surgery was needed and a possible option. 

[Kyyle23]

23 minutes ago, mmmmmbeeer said:

Science has come a long way since Crede days.  Granted, it all depends on what the exact issue he's having with his back but there are options,  For instance, fusing was a common procedure but now, given certain conditions are met, they have an alternative to fusion available.  

A guy who works for me has a very bad back and is going through this stage now, trying to determine the correct treatment.  He was just telling me the other day how the older doctors he goes to offer him older options.  He's now seeing a much younger doctor who is up on all the new options and has had great success with his patients.

TL;DR - Back issues aren't necessarily the death knell to an athlete's career the way they were 15-20 years go.

I mean, working Joes like me and you are hard pressed to compare our lives with a professional athlete.  I can’t think of many athletes that have had back/spinal/neck fusion surgery and came back fine.  In fact I can’t think of any really 

[The Mighty Mite]

Whatever the Sox owe this guy, just DFA him and eat his contract, maybe they can write it off. The least would be that we would have a young healthy guy who would play more than 33% of the time. I would bring up Sosa and stick him at second base the rest of the year and see what we have with him with Burger going back to third base where he belongs.

 

Edited July 26, 2023 by The Mighty Mite

[Balta1701]

5 minutes ago, The Mighty Mite said:

Whatever the Sox owe this guy, just DFA him and eat his contract, maybe they can write it off. The least would be that we would have a young healthy guy who would play more than 33% of the time. I would bring up Sosa and stick him at second base the rest of the year and see what we have with him with Burger going back to third base where he belongs.

 

It's currently over $35 million.

[The Mighty Mite]

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

It's currently over $35 million.

Wow, didn’t know it was that much but the Sox sure aren’t getting their money’s worth.

[Balta1701]

Just now, The Mighty Mite said:

Wow, didn’t know it was that much but the Sox sure aren’t getting their money’s worth.

Yeah, there's no reason to eat this much money right now. You may as well play him or IL him and try again next year. 

[The Mighty Mite]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

Yeah, there's no reason to eat this much money right now. You may as well play him or IL him and try again next year. 

To be honest I’ve never been a fan of his from the the day the Sox brought him up and they made that ridiculous video of him as he was going to be the savior and the main cog in the rebuild. If I had Bezos, Musk or Zuckerberg money I would pay off the 35 million in a heartbeat, actually I’d just buy the White Sox.

Edited July 26, 2023 by The Mighty Mite

[South Side Hit Men]

38 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Yeah, there's no reason to eat this much money right now. You may as well play him or IL him and try again next year. 

I strongly believe one or both of Tim and Yoan will have good to excellent seasons next year playing for their respective upcoming FA contracts. It could be their last good year, and I'm not advocating to extend either, but the Sox will get a solid haul next July is the best case scenario.

[Lip Man 1]

Worst case scenario for Moncada...he doesn't have to work another day in his life if he can't play baseball anymore.

We should all be so lucky.