bmags Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 11 hours ago, Eminor3rd said: But like in what bizarro, non-Euclidean universe could any semi-literate person come to the conclusion that the White Sox could afford to trade starting pitching from their MLB roster going into 2024? Like, I know I've been beating the ever-loving s*** out of the "Sox don't have enough pitching depth" drum since, it feels like maybe since I was born at this point, but there are literally two starting pitchers on the 40-man right now other than Cease. The rotation would actually be ACE Mike Clevinger, Touki Toussant, and 3 bullpen games per week. And Clevinger is gone anyway because he has a mutual option. Well, the pitching team they are putting together would be one that has shown success shopping in the short term, medium FA market and finding success. Regardless of what happens, this year's FA focus should be testing the competence of that group with a number of mid-market pitchers. Ideally they find their version of Alex Cobbs, Gausmans, Desclafanis, Alex Woods, etc. But the white sox in 2024 are going to be bad, in every universe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 The Sox have an opportunity to put together an interesting team for 2024. They won't compete for a playoff spot, but we could see a team that is fun to watch and has some potential future cornerstones. Whether or not they make the right moves remains to be seen. There were some good hires as assistants to Getz that could possibly pull his puppet strings. But let's remember JR is the master puppet string puller here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 17 minutes ago, hogan873 said: The Sox have an opportunity to put together an interesting team for 2024. They won't compete for a playoff spot, but we could see a team that is fun to watch and has some potential future cornerstones. Whether or not they make the right moves remains to be seen. There were some good hires as assistants to Getz that could possibly pull his puppet strings. But let's remember JR is the master puppet string puller here. I have a hard time believing this. I see next years offense being about as bad as it can be, and poor offenses are rarely fun to watch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, Dick Allen said: This is exactly right. 8 years in a row the Royals haven't been above .500. And that's with this guy in his prime years. Merrifeild in his prime years and Benintendi as well. If this stuff is true, MLB needs to step in. I mean I'd be all for Salvy as manager. He's obviously got a clue. But he's old, slow and another guy who gets hurt. Whit is just another guy. Pass on him. At least Massey is younger with some southside pride. He's no star but could hold the fort at 2B til the Sox get their act together. From the Royals side ... Royals should ask for that one stud we have in the minors is his name Montgomery (?) and also Eloy or Cease, one of the two, take a chance on Eloy/Cease if we are dumb enough to go for Salvy. Make them throw in Massey and if Sox have to they can throw in one of our hack relievers. BTW, Sox were so dumb years ago to not keep Semien. He woulda been a huge part of our infield and with he and Abreu and the old Timmy the Sox might have had something. Also maybe it would make Moncada play harder with Semien, Abreu and the old TA his infield partners. Sox can't judge talent. Semien is/was GOOD. Edited October 13, 2023 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScootsMcGoots Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 29 minutes ago, greg775 said: I mean I'd be all for Salvy as manager. He's obviously got a clue. But he's old, slow and another guy who gets hurt. Whit is just another guy. Pass on him. At least Massey is younger with some southside pride. He's no star but could hold the fort at 2B til the Sox get their act together. From the Royals side ... Royals should ask for that one stud we have in the minors is his name Montgomery (?) and also Eloy or Cease, one of the two, take a chance on Eloy/Cease if we are dumb enough to go for Salvy. Make them throw in Massey and if Sox have to they can throw in one of our hack relievers. BTW, Sox were so dumb years ago to not keep Semien. He woulda been a huge part of our infield and with he and Abreu and the old Timmy the Sox might have had something. Also maybe it would make Moncada play harder with Semien, Abreu and the old TA his infield partners. Sox can't judge talent. Semien is/was GOOD. If they would have just been able to hold on to Semien and Tatis, a lot of problems wouldnt be problems. Sometimes the best moves are the ones that aren't made. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 MLB scout: Colson Montgomery is the best position player drafted by the Sox since Frank Thomas Greg: Trade him for Salvador Perez. f*** analytics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 7 minutes ago, Quin said: MLB scout: Colson Montgomery is the best position player drafted by the Sox since Frank Thomas Greg: Trade him for Salvador Perez. f*** analytics. Huh? Greg said he would not be a good addition though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted October 13, 2023 Author Share Posted October 13, 2023 29 minutes ago, greg775 said: I mean I'd be all for Salvy as manager. He's obviously got a clue. But he's old, slow and another guy who gets hurt. Whit is just another guy. Pass on him. At least Massey is younger with some southside pride. He's no star but could hold the fort at 2B til the Sox get their act together. From the Royals side ... Royals should ask for that one stud we have in the minors is his name Montgomery (?) and also Eloy or Cease, one of the two, take a chance on Eloy/Cease if we are dumb enough to go for Salvy. Make them throw in Massey and if Sox have to they can throw in one of our hack relievers. BTW, Sox were so dumb years ago to not keep Semien. He woulda been a huge part of our infield and with he and Abreu and the old Timmy the Sox might have had something. Also maybe it would make Moncada play harder with Semien, Abreu and the old TA his infield partners. Sox can't judge talent. Semien is/was GOOD. Wonder if this 2021-2023 White Sox teams could have won a World Series, post rumored Eloy + Yermin for Pablo Lopez 2021-2022 offseason trade. Total Payroll $192.7M 21.7 Hitting bWAR & 20.0 Pitching bWAR Starting Lineup $113.4M RF F. Tatis Jr. 5.5 2023 bWAR $7.0M SS 2B M. Semien 7.4 $26.0M 1B J. Abreu -0.1 $19.5M CF L. Robert Jr. 5.1 $9.5M 3B Y. Moncada 0.6 $17.0M DH 3B J. Burger 2.5 $0.7M LF DH N. Castellanos 1.6 $20.0M C R. McGuire -0.2 $1.2M 2B LF T. Anderson -2.0 $12.5M Bench $5.5M: C S. Zavala -0.3 $0.7M; 1B LF A. Vaughn 1.0 $0.8M; INF E. Andrus 0.6 $3.0M ; OF B. Hamilton 0.0 $1.0M Rotation $46.8M: Z. Wheeler 4.2 $24.5M; P. Lopez 3.3 $5.4M; L. Giolito 1.6 $10.4M; D. Cease 2.4 $5.7M; D. Dunning 3.0 $0.8M Bullpen $27.0M: R. Lopez 2.1 $3.6M; G. Santos 1.2 $0.7M; T. Toussaint 1.0 $0.7M; T. Banks 0.8 $0.7M; M. Kopech 0.7 $2.1M; B. Shaw 0.6 $0.7M; G. Crochet 0.2 $0.7M; L. Hendriks -0.1 $14.0M; A. Bummer -1.0 $3.8M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said: Huh? Greg said he would not be a good addition though Hi Bob, I meant and prolly wrote it poorly that the Royals should demand Montgomery and one of Cease/Eloy if they figure the Sox are that desperate to get Salvy. If our manager wants Salvy this badly, KC should demand Monty and somebody else that's allegedly good. Obviously I don't want Salvy or Whit. I'd take Massey though. Edited October 13, 2023 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Fireworks Man Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 On 10/12/2023 at 8:53 AM, T R U said: If they could have landed Harper and Wheeler I think it changes the fortunes of this franchise massively. Harper especially. But then they wouldn't have had the money to extend Moncada, silly. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Fireworks Man Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 On 10/12/2023 at 9:59 AM, Lip Man 1 said: https://soxmachine.com/2023/10/white-sox-rumors-salvador-perez-whit-merrifield-a-little-too-obvious/ If they acquire Perez and Merrifield, it better be for a package containing Moncada and Benintendi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 7 hours ago, bmags said: I have a hard time believing this. I see next years offense being about as bad as it can be, and poor offenses are rarely fun to watch. Imagine if Robert gets injured again and it's one of the worst MLB offenses ever unless TA Eloy and Moncada can stay motivated to fight for their contract lives all season... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 Anderson 2B, Benintendi LF, Robert CF, Eloy DH, Montgomery SS, Vaughn 1B, Moncada 3B, Salvy C, Canha RF BN: Merrifield, Colas, Andrus, Lee 2/$25M Canha Sox acquire Perez + $20M for nothing in top 10. Merrifield 2/$20M Giolito 1/$15M, team option for $18M Clevinger excerises player option at 1/$12M Frankie Montas 2/$27M Andrus 1/$3M Insert a couple relievers in 1 year deals between $6-10M. Montgomery takes Elvis spot by mid May. Sox spend $200-210M or so. Does that team win 81 games? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 33 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Anderson 2B, Benintendi LF, Robert CF, Eloy DH, Montgomery SS, Vaughn 1B, Moncada 3B, Salvy C, Canha RF BN: Merrifield, Colas, Andrus, Lee 2/$25M Canha Sox acquire Perez + $20M for nothing in top 10. Merrifield 2/$20M Giolito 1/$15M, team option for $18M Clevinger excerises player option at 1/$12M Frankie Montas 2/$27M Andrus 1/$3M Insert a couple relievers in 1 year deals between $6-10M. Montgomery takes Elvis spot by mid May. Sox spend $200-210M or so. Does that team win 81 games? Probably not 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 2 hours ago, caulfield12 said: Imagine if Robert gets injured again and it's one of the worst MLB offenses ever unless TA Eloy and Moncada can stay motivated to fight for their contract lives all season... Contract season is a big motivator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 4 hours ago, ChiSox59 said: Anderson 2B, Benintendi LF, Robert CF, Eloy DH, Montgomery SS, Vaughn 1B, Moncada 3B, Salvy C, Canha RF BN: Merrifield, Colas, Andrus, Lee 2/$25M Canha Sox acquire Perez + $20M for nothing in top 10. Merrifield 2/$20M Giolito 1/$15M, team option for $18M Clevinger excerises player option at 1/$12M Frankie Montas 2/$27M Andrus 1/$3M Insert a couple relievers in 1 year deals between $6-10M. Montgomery takes Elvis spot by mid May. Sox spend $200-210M or so. Does that team win 81 games? We’re so fucked. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 23 hours ago, hogan873 said: The Sox have an opportunity to put together an interesting team for 2024. They won't compete for a playoff spot, but we could see a team that is fun to watch and has some potential future cornerstones. Whether or not they make the right moves remains to be seen. There were some good hires as assistants to Getz that could possibly pull his puppet strings. But let's remember JR is the master puppet string puller here. Glad to read this. One of the first posts suggesting things 'could' change quickly. Hopefully the Sox have a plan and will attack it right away once the WS ends. If this plan means acquiring Whit and Salvy right away, that to me is absurd. Maybe they think Sox just have to have these two 'winners' who in contrast to that belief lost a zillion games for pathetic teams in KC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baseball_gal_aly Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 8 hours ago, greg775 said: Glad to read this. One of the first posts suggesting things 'could' change quickly. Hopefully the Sox have a plan and will attack it right away once the WS ends. If this plan means acquiring Whit and Salvy right away, that to me is absurd. Maybe they think Sox just have to have these two 'winners' who in contrast to that belief lost a zillion games for pathetic teams in KC. Greg they're probably going to be worse in 2024 than they were this year. There is no easy way out of this. It will take years, probably half a decade. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 12 hours ago, baseball_gal_aly said: Greg they're probably going to be worse in 2024 than they were this year. There is no easy way out of this. It will take years, probably half a decade. Probably true. Mostly because of pitching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 (edited) On 10/13/2023 at 8:11 PM, ChiSox59 said: Anderson 2B, Benintendi LF, Robert CF, Eloy DH, Montgomery SS, Vaughn 1B, Moncada 3B, Salvy C, Canha RF BN: Merrifield, Colas, Andrus, Lee 2/$25M Canha Sox acquire Perez + $20M for nothing in top 10. Merrifield 2/$20M Giolito 1/$15M, team option for $18M Clevinger excerises player option at 1/$12M Frankie Montas 2/$27M Andrus 1/$3M Insert a couple relievers in 1 year deals between $6-10M. Montgomery takes Elvis spot by mid May. Sox spend $200-210M or so. Does that team win 81 games? Only if Giolito pitches like he did with us and not like he did with the Angels and Guardians and Montas actually returns to form. And provided the bullpen isn't a dumpster fire. That's a lot of ifs. Edited October 15, 2023 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 On 10/13/2023 at 8:11 PM, ChiSox59 said: Anderson 2B, Benintendi LF, Robert CF, Eloy DH, Montgomery SS, Vaughn 1B, Moncada 3B, Salvy C, Canha RF BN: Merrifield, Colas, Andrus, Lee 2/$25M Canha Sox acquire Perez + $20M for nothing in top 10. Merrifield 2/$20M Giolito 1/$15M, team option for $18M Clevinger excerises player option at 1/$12M Frankie Montas 2/$27M Andrus 1/$3M Insert a couple relievers in 1 year deals between $6-10M. Montgomery takes Elvis spot by mid May. Sox spend $200-210M or so. Does that team win 81 games? Not with the current manager. I wonder if the Sox can acquire some decent bullpen guys. If not it might be more valuable to go with openers and 3 inning max guys. Cease and Clevinger might be pretty nasty in the 3-inning role. Sox have got to get some guys who can pitch 3-4 effective innings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boopa1219 Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 My dream scenario is that the Rangers get desperate for a ring/another ring, and they trade the Sox Wyatt Langford in exchange for Cease and pieces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 33 minutes ago, Boopa1219 said: My dream scenario is that the Rangers get desperate for a ring/another ring, and they trade the Sox Wyatt Langford in exchange for Cease and pieces. Yeah, I'd do that, too. Throw in Benintendi. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 LOL. 0 shot the Rangers trade Wyatt Langford. That would be like the Orioles trading Jackson Holiday. Get that idea out of your heads now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted October 16, 2023 Author Share Posted October 16, 2023 There were 518 respondents to this MLB Trade Rumors Chat Poll Question (results at the 7:38 mark): Who Is First To Win A World Series? 56.2% Royals 291 Votes 43.8% White Sox 227 Votes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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