Two often repeated statements/ arguments on this board that now seem silly:

[Paulie4Pres]

3 hours ago, Snopek said:

Honest question. Since you don’t seem interested in even slight progress, what do you get out of coming to this board?

Curiosity. 

[Chicago White Sox]

8 hours ago, Paulie4Pres said:

I mean, who gives a s%*#? They are still objectively awful. They are still an embarrassment. They are still years away from even contending for this division. It was always going to be nearly impossible for this team to be historically bad AGAIN. So congratulations on being right? Lol.

I literally said I didn’t agree with the OP’s aggressiveness, but the quality of this board is beyond fucking garbage right now.  Competent discussion can not be had because people are so pissed off and just s%*# on everything regardless of merit.  My post wasn’t about being right, but rather calling a spade a spade.  If you enjoy what this place has become, then more power to you.  I know for me, when the Sox reach the point of providing zero joy whatsoever I take a break from the team and this site.  I basically stopped posting for a month because the team was so insufferable.  Wish others would do the same.  This place should never be a safe space free of criticism do the team, but it also shouldn’t be a total whine fest to the point where baseball discussion can’t be had.

[Paulie4Pres]

11 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I literally said I didn’t agree with the OP’s aggressiveness, but the quality of this board is beyond fucking garbage right now.  Competent discussion can not be had because people are so pissed off and just s%*# on everything regardless of merit.  My post wasn’t about being right, but rather calling a spade a spade.  If you enjoy what this place has become, then more power to you.  I know for me, when the Sox reach the point of providing zero joy whatsoever I take a break from the team and this site.  I basically stopped posting for a month because the team was so insufferable.  Wish others would do the same.  This place should never be a safe space free of criticism do the team, but it also shouldn’t be a total whine fest to the point where baseball discussion can’t be had.

I wasn't referring to you in my post. Just your explanation for the OP's post. This thread is just hilarious. 

[caulfield12]

Here's all the optimism in the world for the 29th and 30th teams in the majors...

29. White Sox (previously: 29)
When’s the last time the White Sox had as good of a week as they just had? They just split a series at home against a team (the Tigers) that came in with the best record in baseball. And then they won a series against the Royals, another playoff team from last year. They notched their 22nd win in their 64th game. Last year, it took them 83 games to make it that far. Progress!

30. Rockies (previously: 30)
Considering how famously friendly to triples his home field is, you might not have expected rookie Ryan Ritter to be the first player in Rockies history to hit a triple in his first big league at-bat. But that just made it that much more exciting when he did it. He’s the sort of young player the Rockies need: Someone who isn’t too distressed with the state of the team right now. “We're all optimistic,” Ritter said. “We’ve got a lot of good things going on up here and down there. So we’ve got to keep going every day, and one day, something's going to click.” Here is your reminder that the Rockies actually pulled off a sweep this week!

 

source:  mlb.com

[Chicago White Sox]

7 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Tauchmann's OPS dropped 100 points in a week and he's a career dead average hitter who will be 35 in an October. I have no idea why people are crowing so hard about that signing. Congrats, you got a month of pixie dust from a veteran on a team careening towards 110 losses.

Because I watched Hahn dumpster dive for a decade plus and fail to get any kind of meaningful production on the positional side.  The reality here is our scouting department has gone through significant changes and we have also embedded analytics into our core operations finally.  As Sox fans who have every right to doubt Chris Getz because of his lack of a resume, we must look for wins on the margins to assess whether we think what he’s doing is working or not because this s%*# isn’t getting fixed over night.  By no means does this one move mean anything in isolation, but if we eventually see enough of them there may be some reason for optimism.  I wouldn’t consider that “crowing”, but rather intelligent White Sox fans looking for some signs of progress after witnessing the past regime (including Getz in some capacity) run this org into the ground.

[WhiteSox2023]

17 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Because I watched Hahn dumpster dive for a decade plus and fail to get any kind of meaningful production on the positional side.  The reality here is our scouting department has gone through significant changes and we have also embedded analytics into our core operations finally.  As Sox fans who have every right to doubt Chris Getz because of his lack of a resume, we must look for wins on the margins to assess whether we think what he’s doing is working or not because this s%*# isn’t getting fixed over night.  By no means does this one move mean anything in isolation, but if we eventually see enough of them there may be some reason for optimism.  I wouldn’t consider that “crowing”, but rather intelligent White Sox fans looking for some signs of progress after witnessing the past regime (including Getz in some capacity) run this org into the ground.

James McCann still blows away Tauchman and Slater but yeah, Hahn mostly signed veteran bums that never had that magical season.

[Chicago White Sox]

11 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

James McCann still blows away Tauchman and Slater but yeah, Hahn mostly signed veteran bums that never had that magical season.

Forgot about McCann…the rare Hahn hit.  SoxMachine had a great article that walked through all his free agent signings over the years and it was insane how bad he was as GM.  Dude talked a good game but couldn’t evaluate talent or build an actual org and then lost the power struggle to La Russa which was the final nail in the coffin for him.

[chitownsportsfan]

33 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Because I watched Hahn dumpster dive for a decade plus and fail to get any kind of meaningful production on the positional side.  The reality here is our scouting department has gone through significant changes and we have also embedded analytics into our core operations finally.  As Sox fans who have every right to doubt Chris Getz because of his lack of a resume, we must look for wins on the margins to assess whether we think what he’s doing is working or not because this s%*# isn’t getting fixed over night.  By no means does this one move mean anything in isolation, but if we eventually see enough of them there may be some reason for optimism.  I wouldn’t consider that “crowing”, but rather intelligent White Sox fans looking for some signs of progress after witnessing the past regime (including Getz in some capacity) run this org into the ground.

there's like a dozen counter examples to tauchmann it's not even worth listing all of them. we have like 5 position player WAR. I mean the bar is low but come on.

[Chicago White Sox]

32 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

there's like a dozen counter examples to tauchmann it's not even worth listing all of them. we have like 5 position player WAR. I mean the bar is low but come on.

What examples are you referring to?

[The Beast]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I literally said I didn’t agree with the OP’s aggressiveness, but the quality of this board is beyond fucking garbage right now.  Competent discussion can not be had because people are so pissed off and just s%*# on everything regardless of merit.  My post wasn’t about being right, but rather calling a spade a spade.  If you enjoy what this place has become, then more power to you.  I know for me, when the Sox reach the point of providing zero joy whatsoever I take a break from the team and this site.  I basically stopped posting for a month because the team was so insufferable.  Wish others would do the same.  This place should never be a safe space free of criticism do the team, but it also shouldn’t be a total whine fest to the point where baseball discussion can’t be had.

I think the anger should be used towards Brooks Boyer about the TV deal and the fact that some of us would need to spend an extra $120 per year to see the White Sox on Comcast after some already spent money on the antenna.

[caulfield12]

Carlos Rodon in 2021 pretty much provided the same value in fWAR for the team (especially in fWAR/$$$) compared to ALL the Getz moves over his last two years.

Luckily/fortunately, he has Shane Smith (thanks to McKinven's recommendation) this year, and Meidroth/Vargas.  Getz can also claim Fedde's 2024 first half as well/Vargas.

 

That was 5.0 fWAR for Rodon alone.   You can say that we had "home court advantage," but any GM in the majors could have signed him for a "quite reasonable" price.

James McCann was worth 3.3 fWAR as well over his two years w/ the Sox.

You'd be hard pressed to find 8.3 fWAR from Chris Getz "dumpster dives" the last two off seasons combined...at the cost of $50-60 million.

Edited June 10 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

10 minutes ago, The Beast said:

I think the anger should be used towards Brooks Boyer about the TV deal and the fact that some of us would need to spend an extra $120 per year to see the White Sox on Comcast after some already spent money on the antenna.

White Sox fans simply got USED in the leverage game between the two sides.

A real owner like Ishbia in Phoenix would figure out a way to reimburse all those who bought antennas in order to continue following a 41-121 team.

[chitownsportsfan]

15 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

What examples are you referring to?

Maldy, Palacios, Clevinger, DeLoach, Rojas, Julks, Amaya, Capra, Pillar, Grossman, etc.

[Snopek]

2 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Maldy, Palacios, Clevinger, DeLoach, Rojas, Julks, Amaya, Capra, Pillar, Grossman, etc.

Dang. It’s barely been a year and I’m already Remembering Some Guys.

[greg775]

On 6/7/2025 at 2:26 PM, southsider2k5 said:

They still aren't. 

Signing meaningless old players who block the kids for a few more wins in 2025 doesn't do this franchise any good in the long run.  This is all about development. Everything else is slight of hand.

Yeah but a lot of our fans don't want to 'rush' anybody ever. Those fans have to be thrilled Tauchman is getting at bats.

[caulfield12]

26 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

We are all biased in one way or another. You see still terrible and  we see things are looking up. Those are both biases based on how we choose to enjoy our lives or sports or  choosing to see half empty or half full. 

If you notice that most people ,management and coaches all have positive attitudes about players and belief in the process  during this rebuild. It's just so very strange that this positive group of coaches get quoted as saying something about trying to improve how Luis Robert  works and you jump all over it as  there's those assholes putting down their players again. How often do you actually get excited about the prospects like they do or many fans do ? You don't because being hopeful makes you feel like a sucker. 

If I recall ,during the last rebuild you were as gung ho as anyone about it. I remember you posting something like our prospects were so good the Sox wouldn't need any expensive free agents. 

The only real difference is the failure of the last rebuild and subsequent actions of the owner to strip mine the franchise in the estate planning phase of his life has left you hurt and bitter. This shapes your biases . Last rebuild we trusted them . No way you trust them now. You got your feelings hurt and you're protecting your heart now. You can't admit to progress or enjoyment because they'll just hurt you again. 

Some of us just don't care about all that. Life goes on , new players , new coaches, new staff, new DR academy, new owner coming. So it's a mess til then. I still like baseball . I still want the franchise to do well. They're my team . Are they still your team ? If not, go find a new one who won't break your heart so much. It's a very odd way to show you love something by choosing to belittle it and the people who show their love for it.  It'll be ok . One day you'll be cheering for them again and your heart will grow 3 sizes just like the Grinch. 

It's way too early to be so definitive.

Schultz and Smith have struggled and Taylor now looks like a reliever.

There's such a thin margin of error...and Braden/Bonemer/Teel expected to approach the impact of Moncada Eloy Vaughn Madrigal and Robert.

Then you have Rodon Cease Gio Crochet Lopez Dunning against a bunch of 4/5 guys, S.Smith and "potential."

Also, the Sox payroll didn't come anywhere close to 29th previously...so you have to believe they will go from roughly $67-72 million when Robert is traded to double that in order to even field a competitive payroll like Detroit at #18 and StL #16 in the $145-147 million range.

Meanwhile, the best, most competitive teams this year are all in the $200 millions and up...with the Cubs and Astros considered "cheaper" teams.

And you're nowhere close to a stadium deal nor a solution to the player's union/ownership issues for 2027.

Rooting for your owner to "pass on" as quickly as possible isn't a great place to be as a fan either.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

21 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

It's way too early to be so definitive.

Schultz and Smith have struggled and Taylor now looks like a reliever.

There's such a thin margin of error...and Braden/Bonemer/Teel expected to approach the impact of Moncada Eloy Vaughn Madrigal and Robert.

Then you have Rodon Cease Gio Crochet Lopez Dunning against a bunch of 4/5 guys, S.Smith and "potential."

Also, the Sox payroll didn't come anywhere close to 29th previously...so you have to believe they will go from roughly $67-72 million when Robert is traded to double that in order to even field a competitive payroll like Detroit at #18 and StL #16 in the $145-147 million range.

Meanwhile, the best, most competitive teams this year are all in the $200 millions and up...with the Cubs and Astros considered "cheaper" teams.

And you're nowhere close to a stadium deal nor a solution to the player's union/ownership issues for 2027.

Rooting for your owner to "pass on" as quickly as possible isn't a great place to be as a fan either.

I didn't say the rebuild will succeed. I just said I'm enjoying watching them get better because it's exciting new blood and not tired old blood. I said nothing at all definitive about the current team except I'm enjoying the difference between last year and this year . 

I don't have to involve myself about where they end up playing.Not my problem. I may not live long enough to see them win another World Series so I'll just enjoy the sport and the new blood .

Edited June 10 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[almagest]

17 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Forgot about McCann…the rare Hahn hit.  SoxMachine had a great article that walked through all his free agent signings over the years and it was insane how bad he was as GM.  Dude talked a good game but couldn’t evaluate talent or build an actual org and then lost the power struggle to La Russa which was the final nail in the coffin for him.

I did a quick positive vs negative WAR from trades and free agents for Hahn and he was remarkably close to 0.0 WAR factoring in every move I looked at. It was by no means exhaustive and I'm sure I missed a few players, but that level of incompetence is almost laudable.

[WestEddy]

20 minutes ago, almagest said:

I did a quick positive vs negative WAR from trades and free agents for Hahn and he was remarkably close to 0.0 WAR factoring in every move I looked at. It was by no means exhaustive and I'm sure I missed a few players, but that level of incompetence is almost laudable.

Dec/2018 - the Astros signed Michael Brantley for about 3/48
Feb/2019 - Machado signed with the Padres
Mar/2019 - Harper signed with the Phillies

The Sox fucked around all that time pretending to go after Machado and Harper. They traded for Yonder Alonso, signed Jon Jay, and had an OF of Eloy, Engel and filled RF with Ryan Cordell and Leury. They really didn't have a steady DH.  

Off-seasons like that seemed to have no focus, whatsoever. 

[almagest]

43 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Dec/2018 - the Astros signed Michael Brantley for about 3/48
Feb/2019 - Machado signed with the Padres
Mar/2019 - Harper signed with the Phillies

The Sox fucked around all that time pretending to go after Machado and Harper. They traded for Yonder Alonso, signed Jon Jay, and had an OF of Eloy, Engel and filled RF with Ryan Cordell and Leury. They really didn't have a steady DH.  

Off-seasons like that seemed to have no focus, whatsoever. 

I don't know why they bothered pretending they had a shot for Machado or Harper. They know how Reinsdorf operates. Shame on us for buying into that hype, too. I was so sure they were going to sign Machado, even though I thought Harper was a much better fit.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 6/9/2025 at 8:27 AM, kitekrazy said:

Which is?  I don't know

Same place it is every year you don't win the World Series,Superbowl, Stanley Cup etc. It ends in a loss that makes you sad or pisses you off. Microcosm of life man.

Kicks you the conjones a lot but enjoyable moments along the way . Some think it sucks , some think it's precious. Some filled with despair and anxiety , some hopeful and thankful.

[WhiteSox2023]

1 hour ago, WestEddy said:

Dec/2018 - the Astros signed Michael Brantley for about 3/48
Feb/2019 - Machado signed with the Padres
Mar/2019 - Harper signed with the Phillies

The Sox fucked around all that time pretending to go after Machado and Harper. They traded for Yonder Alonso, signed Jon Jay, and had an OF of Eloy, Engel and filled RF with Ryan Cordell and Leury. They really didn't have a steady DH.  

Off-seasons like that seemed to have no focus, whatsoever. 

Horrible memories, lol.  Was there truly anyone that didn’t think the Sox would wind up with Machado after they acquired Alonso and Jay?  The majority wanted Harper but Sox fans were just so excited about adding a star player that people didn’t really care which one the Sox winded up with.

Edited June 10 by WhiteSox2023

[PaleAleSox]

8 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Horrible memories, lol.  Was there truly anyone that didn’t think the Sox would wind up with Machado after they acquired Alonso and Jay?  The majority wanted Harper but Sox fans were just so excited about adding a star player that people didn’t really care which one the Sox winded up with.

It was the fucking grey and black glove he had made where I thought he was coming. 

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, almagest said:

I don't know why they bothered pretending they had a shot for Machado or Harper. They know how Reinsdorf operates. Shame on us for buying into that hype, too. I was so sure they were going to sign Machado, even though I thought Harper was a much better fit.

And the most fun part is the person who prevented these moves and forced the worst move is still in change until 2029.  

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 6/9/2025 at 8:47 AM, chitownsportsfan said:

It was also maybe 3-4 voices out of the few dozen regulars that post here. I just read the preseason prediction thread, most people were going with around 50-60. Maybe two said we had any chance to be worse than last year. 

The team is still really bad. We've gone from historically bad to just really bad. Wake me up when we have a team capable of winning 90 games and competing for a division title. We're still 30 WAR away from that.

You're already awake .You make more game threads and White Sox winners threads than anyone. You know you enjoy a win when the kids contribute and even wins when  there is competency shown in multiple areas. Youre not a Sith or a Jedi . , but you're closer to being a Jedi than a Sith.