Jose Abreu Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 34 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said: This may be true but the strikeouts are very alarming and with this pitching staff those errors especially on "easy" plays are causing them trouble because often they can't pitch around them. No one is arguing about his potential but also keep in mind this was the #1 prospect in all of baseball, consensus across the board, to see him struggling like this gets your attention. This wasn't a 17th round draft pick or a minor league free agent. This was supposedly the top guy. Now add in the Sox issues with developing everyday players (non-pitchers) for the last 15 years and fair or not fans start to think, "they're screwing up another kid...again." I understand where you're coming from. I just think there should be a lot of room for patience given that he's a switch hitter (as they usually develop slower) and Cuban (I'm sure he's still acclimating to American life and MLB). I'm confident that he'll be a great player in a couple years 37 minutes ago, fathom said: Started off the year great defensively. The last month has been a total disaster. Making a tough play is nice, but you can't be botching the most routine of grounders 2-3 times a week. It's demoralizing for pitchers, and we've seen quite a few of his errors lead to big innings. Yeah he's gotten a little worse but has still been good defensively overall. The easy plays need to be made, I agree, and I think he'll figure those out. He has all the defensive tools to do so 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two-Gun Pete Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 4 hours ago, fathom said: 200 strikeouts in first 568 plate appearances. That's not good This. Why was he brought up in such a rush last season, again? Does anyone else like seeing this? 2 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said: No one is arguing about his potential but also keep in mind this was the #1 prospect in all of baseball, consensus across the board, to see him struggling like this gets your attention. This wasn't a 17th round draft pick or a minor league free agent. This was supposedly the top guy. Now add in the Sox issues with developing everyday players (non-pitchers) for the last 15 years and fair or not fans start to think, "they're screwing up another kid...again." And this. The bumbling, incompetent front office's running joke of position player development has certainly gotten my attention. Them turning the consensus #1 prospect into a middling .702 OPS hitter inspires exactly ZERO confidence in the bozos in the player development department. What'll happen next, Jimenez is called up & he becomes Viciedo, part 2? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 Sorry to be so blunt... well not really... but Moncada was raw when we traded for him. Anyone dissatisfied with his performance so far is guilty of setting their own expectations up for utter failure. I really don't care what other teams young players are doing because it's irrelevant to Moncada. Baseball is not like staples, there is no easy button. But hey, keep whining if it suits you. The pampers are in the closet next to the blanket and pacifier. Don't forget your cock shaped pillow to cry yourself to sleep on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 I’d be a little worried I were Todd Steverson right now. Moncada is a cornerstone to the rebuild and if this coaching staff can’t tap into his talent (which we’ve seen plenty of) I would fully expect changes and the hitting coach may be the easiest sacrificial lamb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 Neither Moncada or Anderson are reliable fielders and their offense is mediocre. I don't see much improvement. Get used to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 4 hours ago, BlackSox13 said: Sorry to be so blunt... well not really... but Moncada was raw when we traded for him. Anyone dissatisfied with his performance so far is guilty of setting their own expectations up for utter failure. I really don't care what other teams young players are doing because it's irrelevant to Moncada. Baseball is not like staples, there is no easy button. But hey, keep whining if it suits you. The pampers are in the closet next to the blanket and pacifier. Don't forget your cock shaped pillow to cry yourself to sleep on. I agree. I think the problem was being rated the #1 prospect. I think being a Red Sox prospect also raised his value in the eyes of "prospect raters". If we believe the "rumors" he wasn't even the Red Sox top prospect since they supposedly made him available but not Benintendi. Anderson was also raw and we see how he has developed. Streaky with good skills but erratic also. I think Moncada will be about the same and become an above average 2nd baseman. Anything beyond that is gravy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 49 minutes ago, pcq said: Neither Moncada or Anderson are reliable fielders and their offense is mediocre. I don't see much improvement. Get used to it. What a terrible post, but par for the course I guess. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footlongcomiskeydog Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 5 hours ago, BlackSox13 said: Sorry to be so blunt... well not really... but Moncada was raw when we traded for him. Anyone dissatisfied with his performance so far is guilty of setting their own expectations up for utter failure. I really don't care what other teams young players are doing because it's irrelevant to Moncada. Baseball is not like staples, there is no easy button. But hey, keep whining if it suits you. The pampers are in the closet next to the blanket and pacifier. Don't forget your cock shaped pillow to cry yourself to sleep on. I sort of care that other teams young prospects are doing well. How do the Sox expect to beat the Yankees in two years if Torres, Andujar, and Frazier all become studs and Moncada is still "developing"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 1 minute ago, tlongo81@gmail.com said: I sort of care that other teams young prospects are doing well. How do the Sox expect to beat the Yankees in two years if Torres, Andujar, and Frazier all become studs and Moncada is still "developing"? You really need to give all of this more time before you jump to any conclusions. The league hasn’t adjusted to Torres & Andujar yet, whereas they have for Moncada. Two years from now Moncada could be the stud and the other two could be just good players. I get you and many others have a need for instant gratification, but Moncada is going to require some time for him to work through his issues. If you can’t endure that growing process, do us all a favor and take some time off from White Sox baseball. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said: You really need to give all of this more time before you jump to any conclusions. The league hasn’t adjusted to Torres & Andujar yet, whereas they have for Moncada. Two years from now Moncada could be the stud and the other two could be just good players. I get you and many others have a need for instant gratification, but Moncada is going to require some time for him to work through his issues. If you can’t endure that growing process, do us all a favor and take some time off from White Sox baseball. If the players he mentioned were on our team, all he'd do is complain about how bad they are defensively. If people think Moncada is bad at second, I recommend you watch a Yankees game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 2 hours ago, tlongo81@gmail.com said: I sort of care that other teams young prospects are doing well. How do the Sox expect to beat the Yankees in two years if Torres, Andujar, and Frazier all become studs and Moncada is still "developing"? White Sox prospects and how they develop is what's relevant. I can care less about another teams prospects unless their names are involved in trade talks with the White Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 3 hours ago, pcq said: Neither Moncada or Anderson are reliable fielders and their offense is mediocre. I don't see much improvement. Get used to it. Lol, then you haven't followed Tim Anderson's progression since he was drafted. With the exception of last year when Tim's close friend passed away, he's made improvements in every season since being drafted. With all do respect to TA, he was an absolute error machine when he was first drafted and that was at the minor league level. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 (edited) We cannot have both sides of the argument -- either Moncada is a player with trememdous potential who (for whatever reason) is inexplicably falling apart; or practically everyone aside from Boston overvalued him. Which is it? We can never forget he was the centerpiece of the Chris Sale trade. No matter how we try to make excuses, he was not expected to be performing this poorly 570 abs into his career. Is it just too much to expect immediate success? It'd be a huge morale boost for the entire rebuild to atleast point to ONE example. I honestly fear what these forums become if Kopech and Jimenez struggle immediately. At some point, of all the pieces need to begin fitting together. No more Giolito projects or acceptance of our highly touted players floundering around. Edited June 30, 2018 by Flash Tizzle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nokona Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 He still has over 1 WAR this season and has played poorly this month and the first month of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two-Gun Pete Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, BlackSox13 said: but Moncada was raw when we traded for him. Anyone dissatisfied with his performance so far is guilty of setting their own expectations up for utter failure. I really don't care what other teams young players are doing because it's irrelevant to Moncada. If the bolded is/was true, then why not give him enough reps in AAA, so that when he arrives in Chicago, he's less "raw?" What purpose did it serve to bring up a guy who clearly was not done developing, and clearly had things to learn in MiLB, as evidenced by his numbers [particularly his splits in MiLB]? Insofar as "expectations," excuse me if I hate thinking to myself "Boy, I'd rather see Adam Engel as a RHH than Yoan Moncada." [And yes, I caught myself thinking that the other day as I watched Moncada utterly fail as a RHH.] Excuse us if we as fans can't even expect the Number-Fucking-One Prospect to become better than a 20 WRC+ as a RHH. [Honestly, look @ his splits and vomit sometime, when you have a need to vomit.] If this Org can't take The Number-Fucking-One Prospect, and make him into a well-above-average player, what's the point? In other words, how can we expect them to turn lesser prospects into actual MLB players? Edited June 30, 2018 by Two-Gun Pete 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Flash Tizzle said: We cannot have both sides of the argument -- either Moncada is a player with trememdous potential who (for whatever reason) is inexplicably falling apart; or practically everyone aside from Boston overvalued him. Which is it? We can never forget he was the centerpiece of the Chris Sale trade. No matter how we try to make excuses, he was not expected to be performing this poorly 570 abs into his career. Is it just too much to expect immediate success? It'd be a huge morale boost for the entire rebuild to atleast point to ONE example. I honestly fear what these forums become if Kopech and Jimenez struggle immediately. At some point, of all the pieces need to begin fitting together. No more Giolito projects or acceptance of our highly touted players floundering around. Those saying he's a total bust are being ridiculous. Those saying he's fine and he's a former number 1 prospect are being a tiny bit simplistic. Let's not forget his prospect ranking was beginning to fade in some circles due to exactly the struggles we're seeing now. He has two drastic holes in his game that need to be fixed (strikeouts and hitting LHP). The concerning thing is the defensive blunders have seemingly come out of nowhere, and the organization seems to be questioning his focus on the field. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 Has any updated his strike out looking total? Once this gets fixed, Yo is poised to explode. The kids average exit velocity is 4 full mph over the league average. He needs to swing the bat and everything will fix itself. The coaches have been preaching this to him, he just needs to realize it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 23 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Has any updated his strike out looking total? Once this gets fixed, Yo is poised to explode. The kids average exit velocity is 4 full mph over the league average. He needs to swing the bat and everything will fix itself. The coaches have been preaching this to him, he just needs to realize it. Believe it's 40 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, Two-Gun Pete said: If the bolded is/was true, then why not give him enough reps in AAA, so that when he arrives in Chicago, he's less "raw?" What purpose did it serve to bring up a guy who clearly was not done developing, and clearly had things to learn in MiLB, as evidenced by his numbers [particularly his splits in MiLB]? Insofar as "expectations," excuse me if I hate thinking to myself "Boy, I'd rather see Adam Engel as a RHH than Yoan Moncada." [And yes, I caught myself thinking that the other day as I watched Moncada utterly fail as a RHH.] Excuse us if we as fans can't even expect the Number-Fucking-One Prospect to become better than a 20 WRC+ as a RHH. [Honestly, look @ his splits and vomit sometime, when you have a need to vomit.] If this Org can't take The Number-Fucking-One Prospect, and make him into a well-above-average player, what's the point? In other words, how can we expect them to turn lesser prospects into actual MLB players? LMFAO. You mad brah? Might want to direct your questions to the Sox front office since it was them that decided to bring Moncada up. I do agree that IMHO it was a bit soon but he's here and there's no other choice but to be patient with him. All the b****ing whining and complaining won't make any difference whatsoever. His tools and the flashes of brilliance are more than enough for me to know he'll eventually get it figured out. Edited June 30, 2018 by BlackSox13 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 45 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: LMFAO. You mad brah? Might want to direct your questions to the Sox front office since it was them that decided to bring Moncada up. I do agree that IMHO it was a bit soon but he's here and there's no other choice but to be patient with him. All the b****ing whining and complaining won't make any difference whatsoever. His tools and the flashes of brilliance are more than enough for me to know he'll eventually get it figured out. It really isn't that he isn't ready at the point. It is all in approach and mentality. Seeing less strikes at AAA isn't going to fix that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 37 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: It really isn't that he isn't ready at the point. It is all in approach and mentality. Seeing less strikes at AAA isn't going to fix that. Agreed. He will s still learning and at the highest level. Pitchers have made adjustments in their approach to him and now he's learning that he needs to adjust to their adjustments. Pitchers know he's a patient hitter and prone to swinging at breaking balls low or off the outside part of the plate when he has two strikes on him. So pitchers have been pounding first and even second pitch strikes with fastballs to get ahead. I believe this is why Abreu told Yoan to swing earlier in the count, which he has been doing more of. He's already come a long way since his debut with Boston. He was seriously over matched and not ready at that time but now he's at least holding his own. He is really is progressing, just not at the clip we had hoped but like I said the tools are there and they are loud. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 I'm only slightly concerned about Moncada because he's not flirting with Mendoza. It could be much worse. Go ask Twins fans how they feel about Buxton and that will make you feel much better. Look up Buxton's numbers for his career and 2015, 16 and 18 and you'll suddenly look at this in a new light. Buxton was also the consensus #1 heading into 2015. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 another day, another issue Ricky has with him. In no way am I advocating this, but sending him down to AAA as a wake up call seems like something that Ricky would advocate https://mobile.twitter.com/CST_soxvan/status/1013291159710502912 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxBlanco Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 6 hours ago, fathom said: another day, another issue Ricky has with him. In no way am I advocating this, but sending him down to AAA as a wake up call seems like something that Ricky would advocate https://mobile.twitter.com/CST_soxvan/status/1013291159710502912 Anybody have a video of that play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkness99 Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Hope this kid can figure it out...right now he is a walking mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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