Kyyle23 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 1 minute ago, fathom said: Couldn't that be a physical issue out of the stretch? He is a mental midget on the mound. You know this shit isn’t physical Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 29 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: He is a mental midget on the mound. You know this shit isn’t physical In the parts I saw yesterday, his velocity was down 2 mph quite often from the stretch. With someone who has bad fastball metrics to begin with, that could make a huge difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, fathom said: In the parts I saw yesterday, his velocity was down 2 mph quite often from the stretch. With someone who has bad fastball metrics to begin with, that could make a huge difference. Dude, you need to stop citing mph every fucking game. Look at his high leverage numbers. Look at his numbers with 2 outs. Look at his numbers with a runner on third 2 outs. He totally cracks and it isn’t because his mph varies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 23 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: Dude, you need to stop citing mph every fucking game. Look at his high leverage numbers. Look at his numbers with 2 outs. Look at his numbers with a runner on third 2 outs. He totally cracks and it isn’t because his mph varies. Did he become a headcase over the offseason, as he was incredible in those spots last year in a small sample size. I don't know if he's trying to be too quick out of the stretch (which isn't helping, as he's allowed 13 steals this year), but it looks like he's short-arming out of the stretch. It's causing lower velocity, bad command and hanging breaking balls (i.e..2nd homer to Castellanos) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 Way too much time and energy on a mediocre pitcher who is pretty much mop-up quality at this point . There are too many other deserving talents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, pcq said: Way too much time and energy on a mediocre pitcher who is pretty much mop-up quality at this point . There are too many other deserving talents. Which of these talents are ready? Stephens is probably the closest to being ready and he hasn't been in Charlotte that long. Kopech is struggling, Adams just got to Charlotte, Hansen just had his first start of the season for Birmingham, Cease is still in Winston-Salem. Who is Giolito holding back? Donn Roach? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: Which of these talents are ready? Stephens is probably the closest to being ready and he hasn't been in Charlotte that long. Kopech is struggling, Adams just got to Charlotte, Hansen just had his first start of the season for Birmingham, Cease is still in Winston-Salem. Who is Giolito holding back? Donn Roach? Yeah some of the players in the minors have seemingly become way too overrated on here (Stephens, Adams, Henzman) Some of the same people saying Giolito was never a big part of the rebuild probably were proclaiming him a future ace after spring training 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 1 hour ago, fathom said: Did he become a headcase over the offseason, as he was incredible in those spots last year in a small sample size. I don't know if he's trying to be too quick out of the stretch (which isn't helping, as he's allowed 13 steals this year), but it looks like he's short-arming out of the stretch. It's causing lower velocity, bad command and hanging breaking balls (i.e..2nd homer to Castellanos) Your obsession with velocity is just annoying, especially from somebody who watches so much baseball. I'm presuming that's what he was getting at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said: Your obsession with velocity is just annoying, especially from somebody who watches so much baseball. I'm presuming that's what he was getting at. The guy I talk about velocity the most is Lopez, who had question marks about his ability to maintain velocity as a starter due to his size. He's done a solid job of maintaining, but you still see games where he loses 3-4 mph from the first to sixth inning. That is not very common amongst starters. On the other hand, you have Rodon who starts games 91-92 and ramps up to 94-96. Problem is over last couple of years, he's been absolutely shelled when his velocity is low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 8 minutes ago, fathom said: The guy I talk about velocity the most is Lopez, who had question marks about his ability to maintain velocity as a starter due to his size. He's done a solid job of maintaining, but you still see games where he loses 3-4 mph from the first to sixth inning. That is not very common amongst starters. On the other hand, you have Rodon who starts games 91-92 and ramps up to 94-96. Problem is over last couple of years, he's been absolutely shelled when his velocity is low. You talk about velocity with everybody. Just about every pitcher loses velocity as the game progresses until they learn how to pitch and save something for when they need to get tough outs the 3rd and 4th time through the lineup. Obviously there exceptions, and those exceptions are the guys with freaky stuff. There aren't many. Giolito has a lot of issues right now, but I think velocity is one of the lesser ones. He clearly doesn't trust his delivery and motion. He's all over the place with his release point, which is making him hang pitches. He has trouble locating pitches in the zone so he ends up throwing a lot of meatballs. When he tries to avoid bats, he misses badly. His issues are mostly mental imo. He's in his own head way too much. He's had too many people messing with his motion and it wouldn't surprise me if he has OCD. He's almost like a golfer that's so obsessed with the mechanics of his swing that he forgets the very basics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 6 hours ago, Tony said: Like....all of this is wrong. 1. Machado isn’t signing an extension with any team before free agency. 2. Trading any of the players you mentioned for 2 months of a player on a 60 win team is...not the best. 3. The Cubs have nothing to do with anything. Stop Listen know-it-all. Who are you to talk to me or any other poster like that? You know nothing more than anyone else here. You just have another opinion. If Machado is treated fairly and offered what he is worth, he will sign before free agency. The likely outcome now is the Machado will be traded to a contender like the Cubs this year. The Cubs will then do precisely what is suggested - try to sign Machado to a long term deal before he hits free agency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Tony said: You’re right. It’s my opinion you are 100% wrong. If you want to post on a public message board be prepared for someone to disagree with you, especially when you propose a 60 win team trade multiple assets for a two month rental who has come out and said its highly unlikely at best he would even consider signing an in-season extension with any team. But keep on keepin on, buttercup. How do you know this is a 60 win team? Clearly no team with Machado would ever struggle Also I'm sure Manny would love being benched for not running out a ball when his team is 30 games out of first place and he's trying to stay healthy for a 300 mil contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 41 minutes ago, tray said: Listen know-it-all. Who are you to talk to me or any other poster like that? You know nothing more than anyone else here. You just have another opinion. If Machado is treated fairly and offered what he is worth, he will sign before free agency. The likely outcome now is the Machado will be traded to a contender like the Cubs this year. The Cubs will then do precisely what is suggested - try to sign Machado to a long term deal before he hits free agency. This is a rough transition. In one spot you are talking about opinions, and in the next you are talking about something that is completely unsupported by anything as if it were a fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: This is a rough transition. In one spot you are talking about opinions, and in the next you are talking about something that is completely unsupported by anything as if it were a fact. I think Tray may have a point. I think Machado will most likely sign in FA with a team that will contend next year. That is not the White Sox and they should not waste any assets on him. But a team that really wants him for the long-term might get an advantage if they trade for him this year and he likes his time with them. However, it could also backfire if he goes somewhere this year and doesn't like the team, city, manager etc. If he goes to New York, LA . Boston or Cubs and he helps them win it all, he may be more likely to sign with them if they are competitive in FA market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 3 hours ago, fathom said: How do you know this is a 60 win team? Clearly no team with Machado would ever struggle Also I'm sure Manny would love being benched for not running out a ball when his team is 30 games out of first place and he's trying to stay healthy for a 300 mil contract. Why do you keep using this as a negative? It's the proper way to do things regardless of record or team. Maddon did the same with with Baez earlier in the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 54 minutes ago, ptatc said: Why do you keep using this as a negative? It's the proper way to do things regardless of record or team. Maddon did the same with with Baez earlier in the year. Manny doesn't exactly bust it out of the box. There were a few documented issues over past few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 10 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: Ugh. The rebuild is still a toddler. Of course there are still questions. At the stage the Cubs and Astros were will losing 100 games a year. I have never gotten the rush to be first to declare failures and enjoy that. Get off your phones and go enjoy your dads and/ or kids instead of being miserable about a game that is supposed to bring happiness and escape. Nothing screams the state of White Sox baseball these days than someone directing people away from Sox baseball rather than to it to attain “happiness” and “escape”. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 26 minutes ago, Fan O'Faust said: Nothing screams the state of White Sox baseball these days than someone directing people away from Sox baseball rather than to it to attain “happiness” and “escape”. And nothing screams bitter like a decades old grudge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 45 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: And nothing screams bitter like a decades old grudge. LOL - well, thank goodness you are happy and content with the results of the last four decades to help balance out that bitterness and grudginess of the more serious fans out there! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 2 hours ago, ptatc said: Why do you keep using this as a negative? It's the proper way to do things regardless of record or team. Maddon did the same with with Baez earlier in the year. If anyone else saw it, Russell grounded out to end the game. It was one of the laziest runs I've ever seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 2 hours ago, fathom said: Manny doesn't exactly bust it out of the box. There were a few documented issues over past few years. Thats supposed to justify it? The best players dont need to hustle or try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 (edited) 16 minutes ago, ptatc said: Thats supposed to justify it? The best players dont need to hustle or try? More like it's hard to believe Machado is all of a sudden going to change the way he plays leading up to a huge contract (especially with his history of lower body injuries). And don't get me wrong, I respect the superstars like Jeter who always hustled. I just believe if we all focused on star players around the majors, we would be surprised at how many loaf (for example, Lindor would have been benched all 4 games last week by Ricky) Edited June 18, 2018 by fathom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 59 minutes ago, Fan O'Faust said: LOL - well, thank goodness you are happy and content with the results of the last four decades to help balance out that bitterness and grudginess of the more serious fans out there! Thank goodness you have nothing better to be upset about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 11 hours ago, Tony said: But that’s not what he said. “If Machado is treated fairly and offered what he is worth, he will sign before free agency.” I absolutely think playing for a team for the Cubs for two months could get him familiar with the city, team, etc and help their pitch in free agency. But is Manny signing a 10 year deal with the Cubs in August? Why would he? Even if the Cubs offered a huge deal, aside from a freak injury in September or October, why would Machado and his reps not want to see what offers come in around December? Let three teams get in a bidding war. It only takes one team to go crazy with an offer that blows everyone else away. We agree. I think regardless he goes to FA. But if he has spent the last few months in a setting he likes, that team if compettive bid wise will have an advantage. I doubt he goes to the Sox becuase they are rebuilding and if he is leaving Baltimore I would assume he wants a"built" contender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, SCCWS said: We agree. I think regardless he goes to FA. But if he has spent the last few months in a setting he likes, that team if compettive bid wise will have an advantage. I doubt he goes to the Sox becuase they are rebuilding and if he is leaving Baltimore I would assume he wants a"built" contender. I think this is based upon nothing. How many free agents to be wind up signing with the teams that traded for them vs. how many went to the place where they were offered the most money? It's a nice concept and all, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of reality behind it. Edited June 18, 2018 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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