Jump to content
caulfield12

COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

Probably a good idea to continue to avoid indoor spaces

And yet Planet Fitness has opened in Illinois and my account will probably be charged. I want to go and lift but I can’t be positive that I can trust everyone else who is lifting shared weights to not have COVID-19. I wish they would let me freeze my membership instead of having me cancel it for the time being.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since the record for a safe vaccine is 48 months, and we have the entire world working on it, I have doubts about a vaccine that is developed in fewer than 30 months. It seems like a disaster waiting to happen in terms of safety. You don't want to compound the pandemic by disabling people in an attempt to solve it. 

If they can chop 18 months off the record, I'd buy that. Anything less and I'd be very skeptical about the validity of the protocols necessary to declare a vaccine safe. 

In any case, I'd want the science to be internationally scrutinized if it's released before 2025. 

I'm all for vaccinations but I'm very concerned about something getting rushed to market and causing major damage to human health. 

I don't think this is an unreasonable position to hold. 

Edited by Jack Parkman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Since the record for a safe vaccine is 48 months, and we have the entire world working on it, I have doubts about a vaccine that is developed in fewer than 30 months. It seems like a disaster waiting to happen in terms of safety. You don't want to compound the pandemic by disabling people in an attempt to solve it. 

If they can chop 18 months off the record, I'd buy that. Anything less and I'd be very skeptical about the validity of the protocols necessary to declare a vaccine safe. 

In any case, I'd want the science to be internationally scrutinized if it's released before 2025. 

I'm all for vaccinations but I'm very concerned about something getting rushed to market and causing major damage to human health. 

I don't think this is an unreasonable position to hold. 

I understand your concerns, but I would be shocked if it's not released by the end of 2021

  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

I understand your concerns, but I would be shocked if it's not released by the end of 2021

Now....if they're piggybacking off of the SARS vaccine that they've been working on for 15 years I can buy it a lot easier. I'd want to hear from experts all over the world that the science is solid and that there was no fuckery going on. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Now....if they're piggybacking off of the SARS vaccine that they've been working on for 15 years I can buy it a lot easier. I'd want to hear from experts all over the world that the science is solid and that there was no fuckery going on. 

Of course they're piggybacking on everything they possibly can. The groups at the more advanced levels are each trying different things, the Chinese version is a fully dead virus version, the other 2 are targeting the "Spike" proteins in various ways to teach the body how to attack those, and the reason those are somewhat understood is work on these things. It's also entirely possible that the first vaccine versions only offer partial protection, maybe limiting or reducing severe cases but not stopping it overall.

I will agree with you that I'm somewhat worried about f***ery going on as well, so we'll see how the results are presented. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Of course they're piggybacking on everything they possibly can. The groups at the more advanced levels are each trying different things, the Chinese version is a fully dead virus version, the other 2 are targeting the "Spike" proteins in various ways to teach the body how to attack those, and the reason those are somewhat understood is work on these things. It's also entirely possible that the first vaccine versions only offer partial protection, maybe limiting or reducing severe cases but not stopping it overall.

I will agree with you that I'm somewhat worried about f***ery going on as well, so we'll see how the results are presented. 

 

 

I'm genuinely worried about the scenario suggested in that tweet actually playing out. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

I'm genuinely worried about the scenario suggested in that tweet actually playing out. 

It's very realistic, unfortunately. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CDC says U.S. has 'way too much virus' to control pandemic as cases surge across country

The coronavirus is spreading too rapidly and too broadly for the U.S. to get it under control as some other countries have, Dr. Anne Schuchat, principal deputy director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, said Monday.

The U.S. stands in stark contrast to countries like South Korea, New Zealand and Singapore as it continues to report over 30,000 new infections per day.

"This is really the beginning," Schuchat said of the U.S.'s recent surge in new cases.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/29/cdc-says-us-has-way-too-much-virus-to-control-pandemic-as-cases-surge-across-country.html
 

Finally, the real expert and likely head of CDC in a new administration is speaking out after being hidden since the first couple of task force briefings.


 

https://www.sfgate.com/giants/article/Guy-Philips-I-can-t-breathe-Farhan-Zaidi-masks-MLB-15368883.php

“F—- that guy!”

Edited by caulfield12

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

That's about what Texas was like in May and the first 20 days of June when the Governor was telling everyone it was safe and under control. 

I've got some theories about masks that Im not going to share because guess what ... I'm learning to behave on here. I now know what's going to cause a major earthquake on here and won't go there. Let's hope the 4th is safe and fun despite COVID. This 2020 really truly sucks so far.

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seeing the discussion around California, Michigan, and now NJ and New York debating wheter to include indoor dining/bars as part of reopening has me dreading the next week.

It also is what annoys me about the trying to blame state and local actors equally with fed. That perspective will put blame on governors/locals for reopening if it leads to a surge.

It's pretty clear there are specific industries are in the age of covid a specific threat to public health and its the entertainment industry. They make up so much of the real estate and makeup of every town and city in america, and should n't just be told they can't operate and forced to fail, but compensating them with the mechanisms that local and state governments have at their disposal is extremely difficult. You want them to take out loans to support a bunch of individual owners in an industry that is notoriously difficult to keep afloat anyway?

If federal lawmakers stepped up and created a bailout for that industry that allowed them to stay closed and would be reimbursed and employees paid at some level there would be nowhere near the local and state pressures to reopen them. Notice how much easier it is for states and locals to keep schools closed - the funding is by and large set, so they are only discussing public health impacts, and despite much less of a public health issue as entertainment it is still up in the air whether they will reopen in many places. Not so with restaurants.

Illinois/Chicago should let outdoor dining continue, but this is so stupid to allow indoor dining/bars open from a public health standpoint. 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What is the market size of the Bars & Nightclubs industry in the US in 2020?
   

The market size, measured by revenue, of the Bars and Clubs is roughly $27 billion.

 

1 Million
Number of eating and drinking locations nationwide in 2017.
14.7 Million
(10 percent of the U.S. Workforce): Number of restaurant and foodservice jobs nationwide in 2017.
$799 Billion
(4 percent of the U.S. GDP): Projected sales for the restaurant and foodservice industry nationwide in 2017.
$2 Trillion
annual economic impact of the restaurant industry (just under 10% of GDP)
Edited by caulfield12

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good day.

New cases 724, tests 31,069 = 2.3% Pos rate.

The only good news recently is the consistent hitting of 30k tests. With expanding our opening, you'd want that to be 40k at least soon to catch more asymptomatic cases.

If you've explored more recently, I highly recommend getting tested after 5 days.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

Everyone is risking their lives going into work.  Them less-so since they work outside and are healthy individuals (most likely).. It's all a joke.

While true, it's not safe for all of us to be working either. Too bad we don't have a union that can stand up to unsafe working conditions. 

Complain about your CEO putting a monetary value on your life. 

Edited by Jack Parkman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, caulfield12 said:
What is the market size of the Bars & Nightclubs industry in the US in 2020?
   

The market size, measured by revenue, of the Bars and Clubs is roughly $27 billion.

 

1 Million
Number of eating and drinking locations nationwide in 2017.
14.7 Million
(10 percent of the U.S. Workforce): Number of restaurant and foodservice jobs nationwide in 2017.
$799 Billion
(4 percent of the U.S. GDP): Projected sales for the restaurant and foodservice industry nationwide in 2017.
$2 Trillion
annual economic impact of the restaurant industry (just under 10% of GDP)

You can still keep places open that have drive throughs, curbside pickups to mitigate some of that. But yeah, the choice is going to come down to losing that sector of the economy or renewing outbreaks for the next year it seems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

While true, it's not safe for all of us to be working either. Too bad we don't have a union that can stand up to unsafe working conditions. 

Complain about your CEO putting a monetary value on your life. 

Who is everyone?  Are you actually suggesting a complete shut-down of all manufacturing and retail operations in the US?  What you want is not even remotely realistic and no CEO is going to remain in his role if he acts in complete disregard to financial performance.  No doubt the health & safety of US workers is important, but so is a functioning economy.  There is a balance to this and you seem way too extreme on labor relation issues to appreciate that.

Also, the manufacturing plant for my business is union based (one of the strongest in the country) and they have worked throughout this pandemic outside of a three week shutdown.  Yes, some people have temporarily elected out over COVID-19 concerns, but the vast majority are working because they want to get paid and feel the safety protocols in place are good enough.  The union did not just scream “unsafe working conditions” and refuse to work like you are suggesting.  They are willing to accept some level of risk because they realize there is no perfect solution here.

  • Thanks 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

While true, it's not safe for all of us to be working either. Too bad we don't have a union that can stand up to unsafe working conditions. 

Complain about your CEO putting a monetary value on your life. 

I am glad I am working lol.. God please no more unions

Edited by Squirmin' for Yermin
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Who is everyone?  Are you actually suggesting a complete shut-down of all manufacturing and retail operations in the US?  What you want is not even remotely realistic and no CEO is going to remain in his role if he acts in complete disregard to financial performance.  No doubt the health & safety of US workers is important, but so is a functioning economy.  There is a balance to this and you seem way too extreme on labor relation issues to appreciate that.

Also, the manufacturing plant for my business is union based (one of the strongest in the country) and they have worked throughout this pandemic outside of a three week shutdown.  Yes, some people have temporarily elected out over COVID-19 concerns, but the vast majority are working because they want to get paid and feel the safety protocols in place are good enough.  The union did not just scream “unsafe working conditions” and refuse to work like you are suggesting.  They are willing to accept some level of risk because they realize there is no perfect solution here.

1st bolded-no, not even close. 

2nd bolded-what's good for the employee is good for business. The economy is not a zero-sum game. You can make it bigger. 

I suggest you watch "Saving Capitalism" By Robert Reich. He talks about how there's a cycle of prosperity where everyone gets more, and a cycle of austerity where inequality runs rampant. The economy runs from the bottom up, not the top down. 

The Italics: 

If they feel safe, that's good. The fact they went on strike for 3 weeks to negotiate working conditions is what is supposed to happen. 
 

It's all about what's essential and what isn't. Baseball and other team sports aren't essential, so they shouldn't happen, period. 3 weeks ago I could buy this stuff coming back. Now, no way in hell because the shutdown did nothing. If this pandemic should have taught you anything, it's that the people that get paid the least are the most important workers in our society. How does that make sense? 

1. I don't think it's safe for people(the public) to go into stores though

Retail(including groceries) should be instacart-style or contactless curbside only. Hire people to be package delivery drivers and do contactless/app based delivery. They shouldn't let the public in retail stores, Period. It's not safe for the employees, especially when idiots refuse to wear masks as a political statement. 

2. With regard to manufacturing/food chain issues, they have to spread out more. They absolutely need to keep running, but they should have to space people out 2-3 times more than they are. No being packed into a plant like sardines. My thoughts are that they need to cut the number of workers in per shift in by 1/2 to 2/3 for safety purposes. Everyone keeps their  job and benefits, just work fewer hours. 
 

3. I'm not suggesting a full shutdown, but I think phase 1 is the furthest that I'd go at this point, and even some of those protocols don't go far enough. 

It's fairly obvious that opening businesses is hazardous to your health. Anyone who can do commerce online, should. you can pass the shipping costs out to the consumer. The bigger issue is people cannot be trusted to police themselves in the US. 

There's always going  to be some risk, but the amount of risk that people are asked to take is way too much imo.  Also, I question the safety of public transit so that opens an entirely different can of worms. The thing is minimizing the amount of people in one place at one time, and who is allowed in and who isn't.  

It seems like this thing is really contagious indoors, but significantly less so outdoors. We need the entire country, all 50 states to get on board with this plan otherwise it's going to get out of control for the foreseeable future. 

Edited by Jack Parkman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

You can still keep places open that have drive throughs, curbside pickups to mitigate some of that. But yeah, the choice is going to come down to losing that sector of the economy or renewing outbreaks for the next year it seems.

Colorado hasn't seen a huge spike - though we have seen an uptick - and Polis shut the bars (defined as no food) back down, a mere 12 days after they were reopened (still can do carryout and delivery).

The feds have to step in with some serious additional stimulus.  The choice should be the feds pay businesses to stay closed and workers to stay home (bmags stated it perfectly above) - not we lose businesses that equal 10% of GDP or we have constantly renewing outbreaks.  Extend the $600 UI benefit indefinitely, target direct grants to businesses that have been shutdown, and let's have a national, across the board, strategy for containing the virus going forward.  Because the first try at reopening... hasn't worked.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, illinilaw08 said:

Colorado hasn't seen a huge spike - though we have seen an uptick - and Polis shut the bars (defined as no food) back down, a mere 12 days after they were reopened (still can do carryout and delivery).

The feds have to step in with some serious additional stimulus.  The choice should be the feds pay businesses to stay closed and workers to stay home (bmags stated it perfectly above) - not we lose businesses that equal 10% of GDP or we have constantly renewing outbreaks.  Extend the $600 UI benefit indefinitely, target direct grants to businesses that have been shutdown, and let's have a national, across the board, strategy for containing the virus going forward.  Because the first try at reopening... hasn't worked.

The government HAS to replace income if they want this to start to put this virus down until a vaccine can be created.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, illinilaw08 said:

Colorado hasn't seen a huge spike - though we have seen an uptick - and Polis shut the bars (defined as no food) back down, a mere 12 days after they were reopened (still can do carryout and delivery).

The feds have to step in with some serious additional stimulus.  The choice should be the feds pay businesses to stay closed and workers to stay home (bmags stated it perfectly above) - not we lose businesses that equal 10% of GDP or we have constantly renewing outbreaks.  Extend the $600 UI benefit indefinitely, target direct grants to businesses that have been shutdown, and let's have a national, across the board, strategy for containing the virus going forward.  Because the first try at reopening... hasn't worked.

I think I gave this metaphor yesterday - if you've got businesses open where there can be 25-50 people in a room conversing (eating), it's like playing a game of Yahtzee. Things tick up slowly at first because you're rolling pairs on the die and stuff like that, but then eventually you hit a Yahtzee and suddenly you have a major outbreak. Then, out of that population, the next 50 people are all rolling, and suddenly you get a second Yahtzee out of that group. Then you get another 2 Yahtzees out of the third group.

It starts more slowly than you expect because it burns its way along slowly, one person or two people at a time, until it hits the perfect combination of setting and person who is infectous enough, then it pops. I was genuinely surprised it didn't spike faster in Texas in May, but that's because I wasn't understanding or processing the statistics of those single large bursts being rare, they don't necessarily happen instantly even if you've done something you shouldn't. 

That slow start also has the effect of lulling your governors to sleep, making them think that because they didn't see an immediate spike they can continue opening mroe things. "See everything's fine who's going to apologize to DiSantis", "There's no big surge of cases so we're clear to proceed to Stage 3 of reopening (Abbott did that on June 12)". 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×