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> "How the White Sox win the World Series", Shhh, no one show this to KW
greg775
post Feb 17, 2017 -> 10:51 PM
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QUOTE (WBWSF @ Feb 17, 2017 -> 01:10 AM) *
I unfortunately agree with you. I see years of bad White Sox baseball ahead of us. My hope is that JR sells the team soon, hopefully after the 2017 season.

Please, please JR, sell the team.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Feb 17, 2017 -> 03:29 AM) *
it is indeed happening. Like it or not.

I don't like it at all. OK we've made two trades and made what could be a steal in Zach Duke for Tilson. But that's it. Pretty lame beginning to a rebuild when we still have all these veterans. My point is if we've got all these veterans, if the Sox weren't so cheap they'd have acquired a catcher (one is still available) and an outfielder and DH and a reliable seventh inning guy and we'd win the crappy AL Central. We could still rebuild while doing so. Why? Well we're not gonna trade Frazier now in his last year of contract and ditto Melky last year. If Rodon has an excellent year we have a great 1-2 punch in Q and Rodon.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Feb 17, 2017 -> 07:12 PM) *
Great points and I agree. The Sox have already established a very solid foundation for this rebuild. Sox fans just need to have some patience and perhaps a bit of faith in Hahn. Clearly this rebuild is Hahn's baby so let's give him a chance to see what more he can do. Personally, I like what he's done so far despite the trade returns bringing back more pitching than hitting.

Everybody's assuming our rebuild will be as successful as the Cubs' was. We shall see.
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BlackSox13
post Yesterday, 01:20 AM
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QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Feb 17, 2017 -> 01:14 PM) *
I love you too man. <3

Miley, you're the son I always wanted but never had. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cheers.gif)

Hey. Been meaning to ask you, did you draw your avatar? That's really good dude. Much better than the stick figures I'm capable of drawing.
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ChiSoxFanMike
post Yesterday, 06:17 AM
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QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 01:20 AM) *
Miley, you're the son I always wanted but never had. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cheers.gif)

Hey. Been meaning to ask you, did you draw your avatar? That's really good dude. Much better than the stick figures I'm capable of drawing.

Aw. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

But no, my sister drew it for me for my birthday. I have no artistic ability whatsoever but she's really good. She was only 13 when she drew it too, she's even better now. Thanks for the nice comment. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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GreenSox
post Yesterday, 08:26 AM
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QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Feb 17, 2017 -> 01:42 AM) *
Theo took over the cubs in 2011 and that's pretty much when their rebuild started. Theo had his work cut out for him due to the horrible contracts Hendry left in his wake, namely Soriano and Dumpster who's contracts made them difficult to trade. Once those contracts were gone, which required them to eat money to be rid of them, the pace of their rebuild did pick up but it still took a good 4-5 years.

Trading Sale and Eaton has already put the Sox ahead of the cubs/Astros rebuild pace. Imagine how much further along the Sox will be when Q is traded. There's potential to move even further along if the Sox are able to get some kind of value for Robertson, Frazier and possibly Jones at the deadline. Now add the June draft and July intl signings and the Sox organization will be in really good shape going into next winter.

That's the issue. The Cubs got key pieces for mediocre pitchers like Feldman and Dempster. They got a great piece for a good pitcher Samardzija. (to be fair, Cubs also gave away LeMahieu in the dispersal process). A lot of that, coupled with the Rizzo gift, is good fortune - honestly, if the Sox December trades end up with what the Cubs got for Feldman/Dempster/Samardjija that will be pretty good, despite the fact that the Sox traded the vastly superior players.

In addition to the players you mentioned, Sox might also have Gonzalez and maybe (if we get really lucky) Shields nicely dressed up to be dealt in July. Out of that whole second tier group, the Sox need to come away with a couple of keepers. But that's a lot of players to trade in basically one trading period, including Q, whom the Sox haven't been able to move.

Every team is set up differently. The Sox had a lot more quality to trade than either the Cubs or Astros (who got very little out of its dispersal).

This post has been edited by GreenSox: Yesterday, 08:28 AM
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Chicago White So...
post Yesterday, 08:57 AM
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Honestly, 2018 could be worse than 2017. Our offense will be losing at least two key contributors in Frazier & Melky and maybe even Abreu. The only prospect worth a damn replacing them at the moment is Moncada. That could be a really ugly dropoff. The pitching side should be better with Giolito, Lopez, Fulmer, & Burdi all up, but they'll all have their growing pains and will have to offset any potential contributions from Quintana, Robertson, and possibly Jones this year. That's not a guarantee by any means.

We're going to need add a few more near major league prospects and see some fast development for 2018 to be an improvement. This is all assuming they don't plug some holes with legit options in free agency.

This post has been edited by Chicago White Sox: Yesterday, 08:57 AM
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WBWSF
post Yesterday, 09:04 AM
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QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 08:57 AM) *
Honestly, 2018 could be worse than 2017. Our offense will be losing at least two key contributors in Frazier & Melky and maybe even Abreu. The only prospect worth a damn replacing them at the moment is Moncada. That could be a really ugly dropoff. The pitching side should be better with Giolito, Lopez, Fulmer, & Burdi all up, but they'll all have their growing pains and will have to offset any potential contributions from Quintana, Robertson, and possibly Jones this year. That's not a guarantee by any means.

We're going to need add a few more near major league prospects and see some fast development for 2018 to be an improvement. This is all assuming they don't plug some holes with legit options in free agency.

I agree with your assessment of the 2018 White Sox. You could have the worse offensive team in MLB. Does anybody really think that JR is going to spend big money on premier free agents? He hasn't done that since he signed Albert Belle.
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Chicago White So...
post Yesterday, 09:11 AM
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QUOTE (WBWSF @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 09:04 AM) *
I agree with your assessment of the 2018 White Sox. You could have the worse offensive team in MLB. Does anybody really think that JR is going to spend big money on premier free agents? He hasn't done that since he signed Albert Belle.

I think he will, but it won't be until the following year most likely. Hahn made it clear at SoxFest that the money will be there when the Sox are a few pieces away.
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southsider2k5
post Yesterday, 09:17 AM
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QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 08:57 AM) *
Honestly, 2018 could be worse than 2017. Our offense will be losing at least two key contributors in Frazier & Melky and maybe even Abreu. The only prospect worth a damn replacing them at the moment is Moncada. That could be a really ugly dropoff. The pitching side should be better with Giolito, Lopez, Fulmer, & Burdi all up, but they'll all have their growing pains and will have to offset any potential contributions from Quintana, Robertson, and possibly Jones this year. That's not a guarantee by any means.

We're going to need add a few more near major league prospects and see some fast development for 2018 to be an improvement. This is all assuming they don't plug some holes with legit options in free agency.


Totally agree. I really see 2018 being our bottom, not 17.
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ChiSox59
post Yesterday, 09:30 AM
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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 09:17 AM) *
Totally agree. I really see 2018 being our bottom, not 17.


Which is why I say take your time with the kids. No reason to blow service time in 2017 (and 18) if the team sucks balls and the player didn't force their way onto the ML roster.
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Thad Bosley
post Yesterday, 10:05 AM
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QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 10:11 AM) *
I think he will, but it won't be until the following year most likely. Hahn made it clear at SoxFest that the money will be there when the Sox are a few pieces away.

Ah, but be careful. The question was would ownership pay for "premier" free agents the next time the Sox are a few pieces away. That exact opportunity presented itself about as good as it could last offseason when Yoenis Cespedes was available, and the team failed to make it happen. You expect a different outcome the next time around with the same ownership and management in place? I hope you are right, but color me skeptical right up until that time when I see it happen.
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GreenSox
post Yesterday, 10:08 AM
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QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 08:57 AM) *
Honestly, 2018 could be worse than 2017.

Probably will be although Melky, Frazier et al will only be contributing for 60% or so of the season if Hahn does his job.
That's fine.
62 wins or 72 wins....no difference if you are actually trying to build a winning organization.

This post has been edited by GreenSox: Yesterday, 10:10 AM
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Chicago White So...
post Yesterday, 10:10 AM
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QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 10:05 AM) *
Ah, but be careful. The question was would ownership pay for "premier" free agents the next time the Sox are a few pieces away. That exact opportunity presented itself about as good as it could last offseason when Yoenis Cespedes was available, and the team failed to make it happen. You expect a different outcome the next time around with the same ownership and management in place? I hope you are right, but color me skeptical right up until that time when I see it happen.

Completely different situations. In your scenario the Sox were approaching some theoretical payroll threshold, whereas the Sox should have minimal payroll commitments entering the epic 2018/2019 free agent period. What exactly do you think Reinsdorf will do? Not allow Hahn to sign free agents above a certain AAV or for a certain amount of years? I just don't see it unless Hahn is looking to sign an elite pitcher to a crazy long-term contract. Otherwise, I expect Hahn to a fair amount of autonomy on how he spends his budget.
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Jerksticks
post Yesterday, 11:28 AM
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QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 18, 2017 -> 10:10 AM) *
Completely different situations. In your scenario the Sox were approaching some theoretical payroll threshold, whereas the Sox should have minimal payroll commitments entering the epic 2018/2019 free agent period. What exactly do you think Reinsdorf will do? Not allow Hahn to sign free agents above a certain AAV or for a certain amount of years? I just don't see it unless Hahn is looking to sign an elite pitcher to a crazy long-term contract. Otherwise, I expect Hahn to a fair amount of autonomy on how he spends his budget.

Yes I agree. When your opening day payroll projects to be $20-$30M, you have some wiggle room.
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