GreenSox

Yes, you're probably right. But I've always felt that their drafting was a bigger issue than development. They do a lot better pulling players from other teams' minor league systems.... of course everybody does, as it's much easier to evaluate. Even now it seems/feels like Shirley is a big improvement....but are the results there yet? Of course I don't know who's really doing the picking and who's doing the punting and all of that.

Honestly they haven't been great at that either. Since 2010, 3 TOR guys in Sale, Crochet and Rodon - pretty good as aces are hard to find. And then Bassitt for mid-rotation. And that's been about it. Now Martin and Cannon are looking like they might settle into solid mid-rotation starters (which is an improvement as we've had basically 1 in 15 years). And we have 3 prospects with ace potential...but as of now, it's still just potential.

Absolutely, but we need to keep eyes wide open for teams willing to overpay. That said, I'm not exactly sure what 5.5 seasons of a pitcher who looks like he'll settle in at 2-3 WAR is worth in terms of prospects. But in general, I'd like 3 interesting prospects back for such a player.

I'll file this under "What's the Point." Looks like the pitching version of Slater or Tauchman.

I'd like to see them bring up Fletcher and/or Julks. Each is having a good year; each was traded for so the Sox saw something in them. With all of the mess that was the 2024 season, perhaps they should get another look before rendering definitive judgments. Slater and Tauchman have each been around MLB for a number of years, and neither has ever been a full-time starter. They see to be similar offensive players, neither with much power and one RH and one LH. I guess the idea is to platoon those 2 eventually. But I just don't know what that does for us.

Absolutely not. But we do have a couple of guys in Charlotte better than Palacios; and a couple who make more sense than Taylor. So I wish Getz would accelerate the churn.

Has that really ever happened though? Where the Sox trade dump someone only because JR doesn't want to pay them?

This has that "Shane" McKinven, feel; he's built up a ton of equity, there's nothing to lose, so I'm good with it.

If he knew that 2016's start was "smoke and mirrors", why did he continue to squander more resources into that team, such as the trade for Shields (fresh off of a 10 run drubbing in Seattle) and a first round pick on a reliever?

I'm still wishing for the 2 players they got from the Cubs for Bush...to part with the ML leader in steals.

And it can't be easy to be traded from the only mlb org. you've ever known; he's already from a different country and may have language issues (not sure how English fluent he is); and then to go to the Sox with their record and who were being badmouthed by players and media. None of that is easy.

Vargas can play him some hot corner!

And it's equally specious and dangerous to ignore his successes. For every Cease trade there is a Crochet trade....(not to mention that Crochet would be wallowing in the pen without Getz because that's why everybody's favorite GM drafted him in the first place). There is the Fedde trade, but then there is no Fedde in the first place without Getz. There is DeLoach but there is also a 2nd round comp pick that is ignored. We have Christian Mena but also Shane Smith. Yes, the strange veterans he puts on this roster are troubling....but we have young rotation. We don't know if he'll succeed. But the successes have been ignored to a far greater extent than the failures.

Lee is the one to trade. Either will bring back the value of the standard backup catcher. But Thaiss does some things that are particularly important to this young team, including demonstrating plate discipline. Vargas is certainly born-again. I’d give a couple of our AAA outfielders a chance of redemption. Last year was tough on everybody, so they can’t let it write the story.

Indeed...that's why we're making room for Slater!

Yeah, there is that aspect....this is quite the collection of position players.

Keep Palacios...he's growing on me ...he takes his walks.

Nah, it's interesting. It's also a handy one-page view of the early draft board. Lot of Shortstops.

Even then, Roland Hemond wasn't pushed out until the mid 1980s.

Is this mock from one of the publications, or from a group that you're involved with? I like Witherspoon for a pitcher, but he seems to be rocketing up past the Sox

Your top 5 position players drafted by the White Sox since 2010: 1. Marcus Semien, 2011 R6, 45.5 bWar 2. Tim Anderson, 2012 R1, 15.3 bWar 3. – tie- Adam Engel, 2013 R19, 3.3 bWar 4. – tie - Alex Call, 2016 R3, 3.3 bWar 5. Nick Madrigal, 2019 R1, 3.2 bWar On the pitching side, they've drafted 2 aces, 2 near-aces (Rodon, Bassitt) , and a couple of relievers. But it's not like the Guardians have done much better: it's pretty much Lindor and Kwan (and a lot of good trades and international signings).

That's kind of a function of losing 120, which is to a large extent a function of being in a much worse starting spot. Both rebuilds had 3 major trades at their outset. In the last rebuild, all 3 looked great right off the bat. Then add Abreu, Anderson and Robert, and it was easy to see a good young team coming together. This time, the first 2 trades (Cease and Fedde) looked less than impressive at the time (and still do). The third looked like a homerun but it didn't have the sizzle that made headlines (no top 10 prospects or even a top 3 RedSox prospect). But the farm is organically better (i.e. this farm has more pre-trade talent than the last one did) and, for better or worse, that's what will drive this rebuild. Anyway, a lot of turnarounds aren't noticed until they've already happened. There are usually a few signs if one looks hard enough....and there are a few surrounding this bunch.

The genesis of the problem then as it is now is poor drafting/international signings and a lot of clowning and unwarranted arrogance (a team with their poor draft record acting like they're the smartest guys in the room with the reaching and punting e.g.). Maybe things have improved - won't know or a while. Anyway, at this point, they seem to waste resources on niche players: the great fielding SS who can't hit; great fielding OF; last year it was Maldanado, the catcher that pitchers love, but who can't hit. I These are the kind of players the good teams sign to top-off the roster. The fast guy who can't get on base fits this category. They have no use to the Sox who should be in audition mode - either for the Sox or to peddle to other teams. Right now they need to figure out how to get Lee up so that he can be moved. I don't even think the current pen is all that hopeless...too much pressure is put on them due to lack of offense that mistakes are magnified. There are some guys to trade and I hope they do it well.

I get letting Workman go- but not if you're keeping Amaya around. That's just ridiculous. I think Getz has made some really good moves that he doesn't get a lot of credit for. A lot of these are significant and will be long-term beneficial. But his management of the 27 has just been bizarre and has depressed the win total; unnecessarily, imv.

I think the GM absolutely should make the pick, just like in the NFL, NBA, etc.. He obviously should have the scouting director and staff at his side, but the GM is the one who builds the roster. Getz has moved on from a lot of people in the org., but he has kept Shirley. Not sure if that's significant or not.