chisoxt

"The day Kenny Williams took over as GM of the Chicago White Sox, he had scheduled his first 365 days. It wasn’t a firm schedule, understand. He wants to make that clear. He always had the freedom to back away from it, go do something else, and he did back away plenty. “I’m not rigid about it,” he says. “I’m really not.” Which day out of that 365 did the schedule say...Get up...Get Dressed...Check Messages...Make bad Todd Ritchie deal?

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Sep 16, 2010 -> 06:11 PM) We might not be that far from greatness, but it's also hard to argue how we could possibly be improved... 1) Beckham would need to put up an 850-875 OPS 2) Quentin would need to hit consistently all year, especially on the road 3) We'd have to find the money to resign Konerko and AJ 4) We'd have to find a replacement for Jones/Kotsay with seemingly no money to spend (except on Manny Ramirez) 5) Peavy has to be 100% 6) The Twins would have to succumb to even more injuries or bad luck than they did this year (Morneau concussion)...and not bring in any new FA's, and possibly lose both Hudson and Thome, although I can't imagine Jim retiring OR not going back there again in 2011. And you know Ozzie and KW wouldn't bring him back, Jim would probably refuse after Ozzie's idiotic comments and if he did come back, he would be done after all. 7) The one big improvement would seemingly be Chris Sale waiting in the wings instead of Harrell/Torres/Pena 8) The bullpen has to replace Jenks, probably Putz, 50/50 KW lets Pena go, and Sale might be starting in the minors or majors (if Peavy isn't ready)...so that leaves Thornton and Linebrink, NOT good at all, and a huge concern coming off our 2nd half struggles in that area 9) Morel would have to come in and put up a 750 OPS and play Gold Glove caliber defense, because we can't rely up Teahen or Viciedo defensively, and Vizquel due to his age 10) We have to hope the "good" Alex Rios turns up again Not only this, but everybody also totally disregards the importance of a contribution form the farm system during the course of the season. I think that this is especially important for a older team like the Sox that typically has guys who are injured and dinged during the course of a season. This, IMO, is one of the reasons that explains why the Twins are so much better than us year in and year out. They always seem to pull guys out of their system to replace guys who are either hurt or underperforming. The replacement guys then go on to signicantly contribute to the team's success (Daniel Valencia). This isn't a typical pattern for just the twins...look around to any team's championship year (even ours in 2005 with Jenks, McCarthy and Anderson) and you will find evidence of some player(s) who weren't even on the radar screen prior to the season. Sure, those players can come from other sources (cast-off free agents, etc) but usually, they are guys from the team's farm system. is a continual reminder of how bad our farm system isattempt to pitch is

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 08:12 AM) As painful as this season has been, we have what most baseball people think is potentially a great staff. We have to keep that staff intact and tinker some more and make some big time changes with the everyday lineup. The problem is, the money we are pissing away to Peavy, Linebrink and Teahen preclude the team from making 'the big time moves' of which you speak. Just resigning Paulie would IMO be a bigtime move and only one that gets you back to some of what you had this year.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 07:08 AM) I think the gist of this thread is that the game has changed. Look all around baseball at the moment. At all the playoff teams or near playoff teams. Other than the Yankees, you see elite, homegrown, and more importantly, cheap and controlled talent up and down their rosters. The Rays, Rangers, Reds, Rockies head the list. And the Twins have obviously flourished at this for years. Yes, I know most of these teams sucked for years before they got to this point. But they're hear now. And it doesn't look like they're going anywhere anytime soon (especially the Rays, they're deeper than Oprah's asshole pitching wise, majors and minors). This is why guys like me, fathom, russ, I think Ace, ect, were so against the Jackson trade. It's not because we think Jackson is the second coming of Todd Ritchie. It's because it was a horrible business move. There was just no real logic behind it. Other than Cooper's insistence that he could "fix" him. But when you're already up against your financial threshold, and you already have glaring holes all over the place that need to be filled, you don't have that option. Somebody used the word "piecemeal" to describe the way the Sox run things. And that's a PERFECT way to describe it. I think that's what I mean when I say the '05 title was a fluke. Yes, we were the best team that year. But the way that team was put together was no formula for a sustained run, obviously. We added a lot of guys coming off down years or that nobody wanted and it magically came together for a year. And we've been doing that ever since with one division title to show for it the last 5 years. Unacceptable. I guess I'm one of the few fans that would welcome a "rebuilding" period (i.e. a down year or two) if that ultimately meant we were building for a sustained run of success. Finishing 2nd/3rd every year is like making out with a relative. Your ass is sitting at home watching the playoffs just like the teams that lost 95-100 games. Except they at least get a top 5 pick to work with. This is an absolutely awesome post and quite frankly, the one that makes the most sense. The meatheads (fans and media alike) love Kenny when he makes these outrageously bold moves by morgaging our future for quick-fix verterans. Truth be told, the 2005 team was put together with many low risk high reward smaller deals. Fans hate teams that are rebuildibng, but Kenny has screwed this organization up so badly that at this point, we may have no other choice. It will be a miracle if we don't lose 90 games either next year or in 2012, based on the players we will lose to free agency and the very poor shape oiur farm system is in. So if you lose 90 games with a rebuilding team or 90 games with one of KW's half assed roster hybrids (with a $90-100 million payroll), what's the diffference? Do you think that fans will want to see either team?

QUOTE (Paint it Black @ Sep 11, 2010 -> 09:19 AM) Name a prospect that has come back to bite them in the ass. I'm waiting. Gio, Rchard and Hudson will win over 40 games combined next year...count on it. That's a lot to trade with not much back in return.

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ Sep 11, 2010 -> 03:04 AM) you know, i'm glad we have one of those GM's who gets even angrier than fans do That is one of Kenny's biggest problems

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Sep 10, 2010 -> 12:33 AM) Let start looking ahead here. 2011 free agents: Bobby Jenks, Freddy Garcia, Paul Konerko, AJ Pierzynski, Andruw Jones, Mark Kotsay, JJ Putz, Omar Vizquel, Manny Ramirez . This is a combine salary of around 30 million dollars. Im assuming the Sox will part ways with Garcia, Jenks, Jones, Kotsay and Ramirez. I think the Sox will offer Konerko a 3 year deal worth 10 mil per year season with bonuses. He has proven once again that he still has pleanty in the tank and that he can carry this team. I think they will offer AJ arbitration and he will accept it. I say he'll get around 4 million next year. I also believe they'll re-sign Putz and Vizquel. They both were HUGE pieces to this years team. Putz will likely get a 2 year 4-5 million deal while Vizquel another 1.5 million deal. So lets look at it: 30 million- 10 mill (PK) - 4 mill (AJ)- 4 mill (Putz) - 1.5 mill (OV): Thats about 17 million left over to spend on a DH or 3B based on last years salary. Lets look at the lineup: Pierre LF (proved to still have it- lead league with SB) ???? 3B (Omar will likely go back to bench role with proper aquisition) The guy I want is Beltre. . . Rios CF (I loved his play all year long!) Konerko 1B (The King will return!) ???? DH (KW will definitley address this issue right away in the offseason) Who do you like? Quentin RF (if there is one guy KW will trade this offseason, i think its him) Pierzynski C (With Flowers regression, AJ will get another chance to rebound) Ramirez SS (had a hell of a year defensively) Beckham 2B (really picked up his game in the 2nd half before the hand injury) Bench: Lillybridge (infield/outfield)- cheap. needs to work on his baserunning Castro C- loved him as a backup this year Teahen INF/OF- Most overpaid bench guy we will have next year. Likely will be PK's backup at 1B. ????? OF- KW will likely get a veteran with something to prove again here. Vizquel- INF- the old man has GAME! Rotation: Buerhle- Getting older- but proven to still have it. Peavy??? Will he be ready to go? Or should i say will he ever be the same? Danks- Loved him this season. Floyd- Im still waiting for him to excell- the dude can pitch. Jackson- In a full season i think he can turn out to be our ACE. Bullpen: Sale CL- Yes i want Sale as our team's closer. This dude is NASTY! I think he can be someone we can rely on no doubt. Putz SU- He was very impressive until his injury. Thorton SU- Mr. Reliable! Santos SU- This guy has nasty stuff and his getting better and better. Pena MR- This guy impressed me all season coming in and salvaging games for us. Linebrink MR- Yep his contract continues on. Threets LS- A lefty specialist. Hopefully he returns healthy next year. Our pitching appears to be set which is a great luxory for KW to have going into 2011. We will still need a DH, 3B and another OF specialist for the bench. I want Adrian Beltre for 3B. For a DH i can see KW making some sort of a blockbuster deal perhaps involving CQ and some prospects. What are your thoughts moving ahead. . i love the makeup of this team and feel that we very close! My thoughts...Do not assume that Konerko will be back...He almost went to LAA last time, and given the likliehood of a shorter term contract for less $, he may decide to bolt to a team closer to home, or to a more serious contender. Threets will be out next year, and if Tony Pena impressed you this year, more power to ya. You assume that Kenny will have a lot of $ to spend on free agents. i do not know if that will be the case. I tend to think not.

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Sep 9, 2010 -> 01:46 AM) After all of the drama between Williams and Ozzie this season, along with the fact that all-time Reinsdorf favorite Tony LaRussa will be looking for a job this off-season AND is interested in trying his hand at being a GM, I would not be surprised to see KW bumped upstairs in order to accommodate LaRussa. That is my bold prediction! I thought about this same thing too. It would be like Jerry to dick over Rick Hahn and hand the job to Tony. Jerry likes to think 'outside the box' on his hires, and as you mentioned, he would love to rehire his buddy La Russa in some capacity.. Also, I thouht that if Ozzie goes, could Dave Duncan step in as manager??

QUOTE (southsideirish71 @ Sep 9, 2010 -> 01:36 AM) Kenny needs to do a better job of building a roster. We basically played a man down on offense all year long because he listened to the whims of a man who is pretending we are in the NL. Ozzie proofing the lineup is the key for any executive who is above him. Role players especially lefty marginal players become keys in our lineup. Oddly imagine if we took the money we spent on Manny, added Kotsay and Teahan. We might of had a real DH. This is the problem when you totally disregard the farm system...you have to grossly overpay (in free agent money and trades) for REPLACEMENT LEVEL talent. I also do not like how we tend to overpay for guys whose better years are behind them (See Jake Peavy). This has been a good season, but I for one would like to see Kenny 'promoted' next year.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Aug 18, 2010 -> 03:09 PM) Ummm...can't we just be happy that this White Sox team is this/close to even being in first? I mean, isn't this a team that most "pundits" and even a good chunk of this board thought would be behind the Twins, Tigers and yes, even the Indians. Some even saw the Royals as above the Sox this year. If this is the case (fifth place finish), then the General Manager of this team should be fired immediately, given the team's poor farm system and $107 million dollar payroll. This is how far we have regressed since 2005...Too many content fans like this one being content with a bad team just because we 'won it all' that year.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 18, 2010 -> 12:10 PM) I'd still take our core and place it against that of most teams. We just need to get it done on the field. I would not know where to begin in defining what our 'core' is? Are you referring to our aging catcher, who will be a free agent next year? Or our broken down closer? Our first baseman who is having a great year, but will be a free agent after next year as will be our mainstay left handed starting pitcher? Some core.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 16, 2010 -> 01:02 AM) Yay! We have Game 163 and the World Series. Other than that, a record of complete and utter failure against the Twins, lol. Rick Hahn's kid is the reason half of the White Sox fanbase isn't pulling their remaining hairs out, because that coinflip goes the other way...before they changed the rules...and it's even more depressing if the Twins have 7 ALCD titles to our 1 since 2002. There is a part of me that wishes we had lost that coin flip. This second half collapse thing is like a scene from Groundhog Day. I wish that we could become an organization that develops players.

My theory is that we have zero talent on the farm, system that can help us as the season drags along. Baseball is a game of attrition. Very rarely do you end the year with the same guys that you started with. And we have a team with veterans who are even more prone to breaking down. When guys wear or break down, you need capable replacements. We typically have none. Thanks our GM for that.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Aug 13, 2010 -> 12:14 AM) The top of the last three drafts have been quite good... 2008 gave us Beckham, Hudson, Morel and D2. 2009 gave us some good results too, they just had injury issues this year that were big: Mitchell, Phegley, Thompson, Holmberg. 2010 has looked good so far, with Sale, and nice performances from Reed, Petricka and Wilkins Keep in mind too, that 2009 batch his a weird injury bug, but Mitchell and Thompson project to be back at strength later this year. I'd bet that a year from now, the system will look a lot better than you think, assuming we don't trade away a whole bunch more of the farm. There are also a couple other guys who were highly thought of that spent a year off on injury and are just now coming back: Nevin Griffith and Jose Martinez. I think the drafting and development were bad for a while, but under the new regime, things are looking up. Yes it has been good. But my sense is that many of these guys won't be around for long either, as was the case with Hudson. In today's economic climate, a team like the Sox has to control their payroll. Making moves like dealing young, inexpensive and decent players Gonzalez and Hudson and getting expensive vets like Linebrink, Peavy and Jackson and will ultimately doom this franchise. I know that Liney was signed as a free agent, but it was a terrible decision to get him and his money could have been used more constrctively in other ways.

QUOTE (MattZakrowski @ Aug 13, 2010 -> 01:26 PM) Even if Peavy is a better pitcher than Richard (when not on the DL), he makes an absurd amount of money for what he is now. Peavy's an above average guy, but even when healthy he was the #3 here. We could have put that money to use in acquiring a better DH/LF/3B. One thing I took from this deal is that in the future, I hope we do the majority of our free market spending on positional guys, because having a pitcher with a huge contract is dangerous, considering the nature of pitching and the associated injuries. I frankly wish that someday, we will actually develop and, you know, actually keep some of the younger guys. Williams strategy of dealing prospects for older and expensive veteran talent may work fine as long as you have a solid veteran core that is under your control for several years. But when those veterans leave or (get old and bad) as will be the case with AJ, Paulie, Jenks (this year) and perhaps Buehrle and Thorton (next year), then what? I guess that's when Kenny kicks himself upstairs and sticks those tough decesions to Rick Han to figure out.

QUOTE (GREEDY @ Aug 12, 2010 -> 10:05 PM) You are flat out nuts.... Peavy is only owed $50,000,000!!!!!! Let me put it this way so even the most baseball stupid can understand: There isn't a team in baseball that would take Peavy for a bag of balls, even if you packaged him with Gordon Beckham Factor in that Richard appears to be a bona fide major league baseball player under team control for several years, and that makes your post the worst I have seen on this message board. EVER. I love KW but saying that the Peavy deal is currently a good deal is blind ignorance. Agreed. I am amazed how much fans chase 'past performance' in evaluating trades and a player's worth. The questions to consider are 1. How good will the player perform for YOUR team? 2. How much going forwaed will the player be paid and will it be commensuarte with #1? 3. How healthy is the player and how old is he? In the case of Peavy, he is not that old, but was owed a ton of money and had an injury history as long as my arm.,Other than that 2007, his career record was not that great considering he pitched in a huge hitters ballpark, San Diego. For Kenny to pull this trade off was downright reckless. I know Kenny wants to win badly, but I wonder if he makes thse types of deals with the confidence knowing that he already has a WC under his belt and Uncle jerry is ready to hand him a cushy 'John Paxon-like' job one day where he can hide behind another GM.

QUOTE (sin city sox fan @ Jun 18, 2010 -> 01:10 AM) When nobody thought this team could turn it around, Kenny had the patience not to dismantle the organization. Now that the Sox are playing better baseball than any other team in the majors, he truly deserves to be lauded. When the champagne flows in October, I hope that Kenny is justly credited for not making moves which would have destroyed this season. Sox on a roll....nothing could be better!!!!! Are you serious?

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Jun 11, 2010 -> 12:50 PM) Good God... Kenny Williams is going to resign if this keeps up. I wasn't believing any of this Kenny Williams v. Ozzie crap in the beginning, but it sure does seem like it's true now. It looks like Reinsdorf is going to have to make a decision. If KW leaves, I'm going to be pissed. Like he had nothing to do with this mess. If KW leaves, I am going to be happy!

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jun 11, 2010 -> 06:20 AM) ^Sounds like Kenny is pissed Ozzie made public comments about the situation and then went on another pointless table-flipping rampage. Rather than say anything to Ozzie he should go take this up with Cowley because Cowley is the one winning in all of this. Cowley's the one putting all this Guillen family s*** out there, stirring the pot, and all he's getting for it is readership. It's a damn shame it's come to this too. Kenny can be a great GM when he's concentrating on his job and trying to win. This year is all on Kenny, no matter what, because no matter what Ozzie ever said he wanted, Kenny is the GM and Kenny gets to call the shots. Please STFU and get this team some help. If all of this happened, why is it Cowley's fault? As a reporter, what is he supposed to do, look the other way? GMAFB. Were it me, i would launch both of them. The entitlement from 2005 is ovah.

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Jun 9, 2010 -> 05:01 PM) Earlier this year, Tony LaRussa gave an interview where he hinted that he might like to try his hand at something different in baseball, which included the role of general manager. He also indicated in that same interview that he loved Jerry Reinsdorf and would be open to the idea of working for him again. I think LaRussa re-upped with the Cardinals for just one year, and so with his contract expiring at the end of the season, coupled with the current mess the Sox find themselves in, I wonder if the timing might be right for the triumphant return of Mr. LaRussa to the South Side of Chicago, home of his first job in Major League Baseball, as the Sox' new GM (with Williams remaining in the organization in some other capacity). I have wondered (and posted) that very same thought. Consider that longtime assistant Dan Evans was passed over for the job for Kenny, who had less senority than Williams at the time. I do not think that bringing in LaRussa would be beyond the realm of possibility. (I, for one, would not want to see it). Jerry has a history of peculiar, out-of-the box hires. Plus, he has to be angry as hell about the Peavy deal, and the rest of this current train wreck, which Hahn was a part of.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 9, 2010 -> 02:37 AM) We were talking about it earlier. You can't keep making bad trades and expect to have a competent roster. The Swisher debacles really hurt the talent in both the majors and minors, and then the Peavy trade killed our pitching depth. KW should thanks his stars Rios has rebounded this season. Kenny Williams has destroyed this team for years to come.

QUOTE (spiderman @ Jun 8, 2010 -> 05:49 PM) Let's face it, the White Sox are not going to rebuild the team, they are going to continue try to win, but we've reached a crossroads here - we need to find out whether Viceido/Flowers can be expected (not guaranteed, see Beckham) to contribute to next year's team. The White Sox have no choice. How can this team win next year with the players that they have either on the parent club or in the farm system. They can't. Acquire free agents, you may suuggest? Not with the money tied up with Peavy and Rios.

QUOTE (joeynach @ Jun 8, 2010 -> 07:50 AM) Im a fan too, but you cant really let your fans run your team. They dont operate in the same galaxy you do when your a member of the front office. I just read an article in forbes about Philly's recent success. Their success is a product of patience by mgmt, tell the fans and media too bad be quiet for awhile, and excellent production (and spending) from scouting and drafting. If its time for PK and MB to go for the correct direction of this team then thats what needs to happen, I cant worry about Alice from Oak Lawn who on teacher night in 2011 is shocked and saddened to hear that hear favorite player Paulie and her secret crush Buehrle are no longer with the team. I think that Kenny gets caught up into doing the types of deals that appeal to the meathead contingent of our fansbase and media ..ie, getting the big name veteran guy for prospects. For the most part, I have hated those all of those deals from the moment they are made, yes even the Jake Peavy trade. You can't look in the rearview mirror at a players production from three years ago and assume that that player will produce the same for you going forward at a very high salary to boot! Truth be told, Kenny has been much more successful making the small deals. In fact, the 2005 WC team was put together with smaller under the radar pickups and trades, not with deals like Nick Swisher or Jake Peavy. Yes, Olney reports that the purge will begin soon....about one year too late in my opinion. This thing may take years to fix.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 2, 2010 -> 03:30 AM) It was over two weeks ago. Twins have played a tougher schedule than ours, and now they have Kubel starting to heat up. Plain and simple, they're a better team than the Sox. I also find it funny that the meathead contingent of our fandom believes that there is a lot of luck involved in the Twin past and present success, ie, the astroturf, the baggie, the roof on their old stadium, etc, etc. All I kept hearing all winter was how terrible the Twins were going to play outdoors in their new stadium. What these people dont get is the fact that the Twins have been kicking our ass for 10 years now and will continue to do so for a long time.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jun 1, 2010 -> 09:46 AM) Why not just have Morel fill in Lilli's spot? I'm sad that CJ has been struggling, as he is probably my favorite farm hand for the sheer fact that he's a huge overachiever because of his work ethic. Edit: Just dawned on me that means Gordon is probably being sent down, to play 2nd, and Lilli's spot is being taken by Morel after all. My theory is that Kenny will use Morel as a trading chip (later this month perhaps) and wants to keep him in the minors so that he does not expose his flaws.