kwill

I think the best thing the White Sox can do is just chill. Let the madness happen that is the Winter Meetings. Let the young guys develop and take their lumps this year. They need to figure out what prospects will pan out and where they will fit in the rotation and diamond. It is not as exciting as making the big move but it needs to happen. Look at the Yankees last winter meetings. They sat it out and waited for their young guys to develop.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 5, 2017 -> 10:57 PM) No. They would have to give up their 2nd rounder to sign Moustakas. Not happening. Ah. Good point. I actually thought it would be a 3rd but after reading the qualifying rules again you are correct. It would only be a third if they would receive some kind of revenue share.

Does anybody else think they may look at the market on Mike Moustakas? As it stands the White Sox really don't have a 3rd baseman. He is going into free agency on the younger side at 29 years old and won't command a long contract. If the price gets dropped to 5/70 million maybe with some dollars front loaded to add more appeal wouldn't the White Sox have to consider. The last year he would be playing at age 33 which means you should be getting mostly prime years. He was an above average defender until last year when he became just slightly below which could have been an off year defensively. Travis Sawhik wrote an interesting article coming to the conclusion that his power is real and could probably play even better in our park compared to a stadium like Kauffman that is a pitchers park. Next years crop of 3Bs to me is not very good beyond Machado and Donaldson. I never put any stock in us actually being contenders next year for Manny Machado as the dollars and years would scare the Sox off. Josh Donaldson would be going into the following year at 33. I think this would allow Jake Burger to take his time in the minors like we are doing with Collins. The White Sox could see how he develops, move either Burger or Moustakas when Abreu's contract is up.

I really like the guy as a person, genuinely seems like a good clubhouse guy. He just cannot start anymore. I think its time the White Sox bring him out of the pen. He could be a really good lefty specialist as his stuff could play up in one inning of work and he does fairly well against left handed hitters. Splits Below: VS Righthanders: .293/.373/.567 VS Lefthanders: .218/.277/.356

Most people have commented along my thoughts as well which is he was rushed the big leagues and still is rounding into form last year. At the end of last year, he was flashing a plus changeup. You add that along with his slider and fastball and he could be a top 5 starter in the league. Sale has given us this unreal expectations of how quickly a guy can become dominant.

Does anybody know what happend to Matt Cooper? I thought he could get a shot at the big leagues some time this year but he not pitched since late June after a few rough outings.

I think 2017 and 2018 we can expect Top 3 maybe Top 4 for picks. I think next year will be harder though as development paths can be frustrating to watch as points where guy will falter, or settle into a lesser player than we originally thought.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 06:49 PM) http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?playe...itting/2017/ALL Sure, and this guy had a 750 OPS (wow, 0.17 points different!!!) in the Midwest League at roughly the same point in the season last year...prospects don't stay on a linear path. I think this a very good post in terms of understanding its a development process. Sometimes especially a guy who is 20 years old take some time to make adjustments. Hopefully, He still probably has 2.5 years at the very least of development.

Even Sheets has a 6 SO for like 50 ABS at this point. You have to figure that some of those balls are going to start falling for him.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 12:19 PM) MLB is a business in which the owner's goal is to make money, don't lose sight of that. When Hahn can save his boss about $20 million after shelling out $50+ for Robert it really helps lessen the sting. Hahn stated twice in the press conference about how the Yankees paying the entire salaries of Frazier/Kahnle/Robertson did play a factor. Was it the only factor? No, but a factor nonetheless. As fans we sometimes lose sight that ownership can only stomach spending so much money before it stops making sense. $20 million is considerable savings in this case. I guess my point is take back Headley for next season as a positional player. JR can easily makeup for any money loss on Robert next year. The White Sox currently have 26 million dollars worth of contracts for next year. Lets say there is another 25 million in paying cost control guys and arbitration that bring up the total to 51 million dollars. The lowest payroll team this year was the Milwaukee Brewers at 79 million dollars. We could easily afford Headley for next year and JR could save his money. You could easily play the what if game in baseball but lets not act like Reinsdorf is not making a bundle off of this rebuild. In fact, It would make some sense for him to possibly look to sell the team. From a business perspective you have lowest amount committed money moving forward with the same steady revenue. That is part of the reason you may see Stanton get moved at the deadline.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 11:17 AM) Saving $20 million was absolutely a big factor in this trade. Sox shelled out $50+ for Robert, so saving $20 makes that more palatable to ownership I am sure. This is a business after all. This is the frustrating part of the trade as the White Sox will save money next year as they have nothing committed. Good Ole JR could have taken back a piece like Headley. He could be a nice veteran player to play some nice defense at third who knows maybe he has a nice first half and flip him. I am sure if we took him off the Yankees hands they would have upgraded prospect in take or thrown in another player. Don't get me wrong, I am not crazy upset over the trade, just not excited like the rest Hahn has pulled off.

I do love how honest Hahn is with all of his answers. It is pretty refreshing to hear from a GM.

It is really interesting looking at it from the Yankees side of it now having 4 really great relievers for the next 1.5 years. It could very well be the best bullpen in the modern era beating out the Wagner, Dotel, and Lidge trio.

QUOTE (ecupittfan @ Jul 18, 2017 -> 09:24 PM) If you want to make an argument about a player being as good as Andrew Miller you should actually spell his name correctly. It kind of tells people you don't know what you are talking about. And I am not trying to be a jerkoff, just giving advice. Sorry about the miss spelling. I was trying to write it quickly. Do you disagree with my logic though? I feel like it was pretty sound.

I guess the big difference with some people is that they rate Tommy Kahlne differently. I view him as a good as Andrew Miller but with not with the consistent pedigree. Have a consistent pedigree is huge though when talking relievers. Link of Fangraphs Article today below. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-white-s...jor-trade-chip/ Another difference though is that Kahlne will be cheaper than Miller moving forward with Miller making another 2/18 after the time of the trade. Kahlne still has all three years of arbitration left which if he does really well will equal what 3/15. Remember what happend to Dellon Betances. Then on top of it you add the additional value of David Robertson and Todd Frazier( even if marginal) with taking back Clippard. In my opinion, you should be able to match or get better value than what the Yankees got for Miller last year at the deadline. Rutherford is a good start but you need at least another 2 intriguing pieces to get me excited.

I see no reason why the White Sox couldn't just eat that Headley contract for next year to get better prospects. We have no money committed for next year. The Yankees are trying to get under the luxury tax for next year.

Normally pretty optimistic about deals but the White Sox are giving a good amount of value. I would want more than Rutherford even if he was a good prospect coming out of the draft. He currently has a .733 OPS in A Ball. I would expect the last player is who they are haggling over hopefully Andujar is the guy but I would settle for Wade.

I have to believe that the Sox are going to be taking more players back off the 40 man roster as the Yankees are adding 3. I would expect either Andujar or Wade to be part of the deal.

From Phil Rogers. No word on Frazier trade (yet) but he's in dugout doing round of hugs and handshakes.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Jul 18, 2017 -> 07:02 PM) FWIW---- Red Sox in rain delay. DD came on pregame and said no trades are close. Said they would like to upgrade 3B and keep Devers down in AAA. Doesn't think they will address bullpen but said that could change closer to the deadline. Well that just cold water on this situation. I don't know where the Robertson thing came from either.

BTW, Matt Wieters 80/83 rank in pitch framing according to Baseball Prospectus. That is really bad. http://www.baseballprospectus.com/sortable...php?cid=1899516 Side Note: Avoid looking at #1

Tell me what you think of this three team deal: Nationals Receive: Tommy Kahlne Carson Kelly Cardinals Receive: Avi Garcia David Robertson Cash White Sox Receive: Victor Robles Delvin Perez Austin Gomber(Or another future reliever type) or Dakota Hudson Nationals Do It: They receive another cost control arm out of the bullpen because really they only have the two reliable ones they acquired today. This would add a third arm out of the pen for their playoff run. Kelly provides them with an excellent backup catcher option this year with the ability to be controlled for the next 6 years. If the Nationals believe Soto can truly be a great outfielder than this lessens the sting of losing Robles. One thing I will say for the Cubs is that Theo understands that windows only last for so long. Nationals next two years are probably at their peak even if Harper stays. Scherzer is at peak performance, Strausberg is healthy, and all of your position players are playing peak levels like Zimmerman and Rendon. Turner will be back for the playoffs. You have to make your run now in the next 2 years before everybody gets expensive. Young players can only offset costs so much. Nationals Don't Do It: They really love Victor Robles and feel like they are going to lose Harper. Their timelines would be seamless transitions. They don't believe Carson Kelly will be a standout backstop like projected. Cardinals Do It: The Cardinals are cash strapped and really don't have too much positional talent in the near future besides Kelly. Unfortunately, The franchise was dumb and decided to give Molina a 3/60 million dollar extension in the offseason. This blocks your best positional talent for the next 3 years which leaves me to believe you are willing to trade him. You believe that the real Avi Garcia is having a coming out season and will provide the necessary hitting in the outfield that you are drastically missing. He provides cost control in the outfield for the next 2.5 years while you try to build up your farm system. This is important as you have too much money tied into next season to make a legitimate run at a quality outfielder like JD Martinez or Lorenzo Cain. The Cardinals would not have to give up any of their premium pitching talent in Reyes, Weaver or Flaherty. Perez although a great talent is still in Rookie Ball and is continuing to have make up concerns. Cardinals Don't Do It: They don't believe in Garcia that much and would rather save that chip for a better item in the offseason. Although getting a closer is nice, Paying Robertson 13 million for only the 1.5 is not that great of a bargain. White Sox Do It: White Sox get Victor Robles to pair with Eloy Jimenez in the future. They have roughly the same timeline to the majors which is important. Robles would provide the White Sox with three of the top positional prospects in baseball. Perez is definitely a wild card that may not produce but he does provide a middle of the field prospect that is probably the one weakness outside of Moncada in the system. They should probably get another player in this deal as they are trading three major league players in this deal. The easiest way to tank is a bad bullpen. This would lead them down a path of a top 3 pick in 2018. White Sox Don't Do IT: They are trading three major trade assets on the board for only three minor leaguers. You really are banking on Robles hitting and whatever else you get from the deal is gravy. This would be the last trade of the rebuild. Their could be concern of having so many young starting pitchers and not having a bullpen to protect their leads could be demoralizing. In total a three team deal is extremely hard to complete but ya never know.

Could be for DeGrom.

I honestly think their is no way Panda is coming to the Southside. What I do think is happening is how much cash considerations is being sent over with Frazier.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 09:48 PM) I'm sticking with C.J. Chatham as being the primary piece coming our way. Agreed. Why move him so early if the return is not at the top end of what you want? We need more middle infielders in the system.