Chicago White Sox

Markakis hit 3 HRs in nearly 700 ABs. His ISO last year was .080. For perspective, Carlos Sanchez's ISO was .103. He may have a nice OBP, but no way in hell am I committing $11M/per for three years to a corner OF with those kind of power numbers.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jan 6, 2016 -> 10:08 PM) This after show is the best thing ever. One of the greatest 30 minutes of television I have ever seen.

There is nothing good about Gordon going back to K.C. Reduces the supply of impact OFs, doesn't impact the demand for them (if you assume the Royals were all or nothing on Alex), & makes a key divisional competitor stronger. If Upton is a long-shot, then the Sox can't keep dicking around on Cespedes.

I'm sorry, but is this thread serious? Fowler has been a switch-hitter his entire career. What evidence is there to suggest he'd be better batting exclusively right-handed? Are you really using his splits against LHP to make that case? Of course he's better batting against LHP, the majority of right-handed batters are. And unlike a lot of switch hitters where the results are horrible from the weak side, he's actually been pretty solid (about a 100 wRC+), suggesting switch-hitting may be helping. Regardless, it's a huge risk to sign this guy (while giving up a pick) and have him change his entire batting approach, all in hopes of finding the perfect two hole hitter. Who cares if Gordon is left-handed and has to bat after Eaton? He'll face a ton of RHP and likely would be far more valuable in front of Abreu than Fowler would be facing RHP from the right side.

I think it's important to point there isn't one Latin American signing in that list. If I had to guess, I would have to think there are only a handful of other teams (if any) without one in their top 10. Outside of a few exceptions, we've pretty much have had to rely on the draft to build our minor league system. That's obviously changing and the good news is we'll finally see the fruits of our labor this year with the first wave of guys hitting full-season ball and a ton more interesting prospects in rookie leagues. Even if that top 10 list is a bit underwhelming, there is plenty of reasons to be optimistic about the system.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 11:39 AM) Ilitch is old and the Tigers are built to win now. Their farm system is f***ed anyway, so I wouldn't be surprised to see them try to get one of the big 3 even if it put them over the luxury tax. They're right at the luxury tax threshold right now, so basically every dollar spent from this point forward will come with a 17.5% tax. And backloading a deal won't help, as luxury tax calculations use the AAV of all contracts. And let's not forgot the luxury tax rates increase each consecutive year you're over, so there are potential repercussions for 2017 by going over now. IMO, I think they avoid any big free agents, but you never know with Ilitch.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 11:25 AM) Anyone think Davis might be the one holding up the market? If he signs with Baltimore that takes out one of the big players. As for the other teams, it sounds like St. Louis will trade for a Colorado OF, the Tigers would be over the Luxury Tax penalty for the next several seasons if they made a big offer, and I think Ilitch has only gone over once in the past decade (2008). The Angels also seem afraid to go over the tax limit, and the Giants are currently being linked to Desmond, and if they sign him I don't think they'd also commit big money to Cespedes. There really might be a smaller market for Cespedes than we think, which makes the 3-year demands seem not so unreasonable from our side, though I still think it's just posturing. We might be able to sign him for 4 years. I 100% think Davis is holding up the market. However, I think we're starting to get to the point where both teams and the big free agent OFs can't keep waiting. At some point, teams will go to plan B's (lesser free agents or trades) and guys like Cespedes & Gordon will get stuck with even less attractive offers. These guys simply can't wait forever on a Boras client to come to a decision. I think the Nightengale leak is the Sox's way of telling these free agents to s*** or get off the pot.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 10:42 AM) Yep. This thread will get 100 posts before someone even signs. Bold prediction! ?

QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:33 AM) Probably right but FWIW Bob said Cespedes might be the most incline to accept a short term deal with Upton being the least likely. Who knows I really just want the roller coaster to stop. Three years wouldn't make sense for Cespedes, given the crazy free agent class that year (including some serious OF free agents). If he's willing to gamble on himself, a 1 year deal makes the most sense. Otherwise, he should be pushing hard for a 5 year deal. If he reverts back to a 3 WAR type season next year, he'll end up losing out on a lot of money. Also, it's quite fascinating if the Sox really won't go beyond a 3 year deal. Right now, our only contractual obligations for 2019 are Sale, Quintana, Abreu, Eaton, & Jones and that's assuming we exercise their options. Combined they make $49M, although that will probably go up a bit assuming Abreu elects free agency. Obviously there would be some arb guys too, but overall we'd be in great shape to be serious players in the crazy 2019 free agent class. With our TV expiring right around that time, I wouldn't be surprised if that indeed is their big plan in hopes of driving up the value of a new contact.

QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:27 AM) Nightengale saying three years maybe a must in order for the sox to get one of the three. Is a must from the players' perspective? If so, I'm not sure that's really news. I would assume 4 years is a must with Gordon & Cespedes. And quite frankly, I'd be very surprised if they Cespedes took less than 5 years. He's coming off a monster season and needs to capitalize.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:14 AM) None of us really know how much ownership is willing to spend this year, or next. Perhaps, they're not even sure, themselves. Whatever the projected budget, it has nothing to do with the concept that "GreenSox" and I are advocating, regarding front loading a contract, with a player "opt out". I'm curious, "Caulfield12," putting aside the issue of budget constraints, do you agree with the notion, and if not, why not? Of course it does, it's hard to front-load a contract if you're already struggling to fit that signing into your budget. Theoreticallly sound ideas like the one you're proposing don't always equal practical ideas.

This confirms to me that Gordon is their focus. No way in hell 3 years gets you in the door with Cespedes. My guess is Gordon is looking for a 5 year deal right now and the Sox are using this leak as a way to get him to "settle" at 4 years.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 07:19 AM) What? Who? I think he's referring to Ty Cobb. Regardless, being a scumbag off the field and cheating on the field are two completely different issues. IMO, outside of the most extreme cases, the Hall shouldn't concern themselves with character issues. Also, using steroids & HGH is a on a completely different level of cheating than using greenies. It's like comparing heroine to weed in terms of recreational drugs. And I'm not justifying the use of greenies either, but we can't go back in time and kick out everyone that ever used them (nor would we know). The HOF voters can try to right the ship now in terms of steroids when factual evidence is readily available. It's interesting to me that most of the people who are in favor of letting known PED users like Bonds & Clemens in grew up in the Steriod Era. If there was ever a time for GreenSox to call people hero-worshippers, now would be the time. And I say this as someone who also grew up in the era. These guys did some amazing stuff and nothing will ever be able to take that away from us, but to glorify known cheaters by electing them into the Hall is 100% wrong. Getting into the Hall of Fame is a big deal for these guys and those that were caught cheating in a significant way don't deserve that satisfaction.

Can I change my name to "John"?

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 06:10 PM) Just to clarify, Melky signed a 3/42M contract that pays him 13M/14M/15M during those three years. http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/...shtml#contracts If KC did actually offer Gordon 4/52M, that is a low-ball offer in that the annual value doesn't even meet Melky's. I'm not a fan of signing Gordon but he's definitely better and worth more than Melky. I think 4/72M is about what Gordon ends up with unless a team goes five years. Good catch. Still, it's an insulting offer to a guy who has been one of the best position players in baseball over the past few years. My guess is the Royals have come up from that number, but it's even remotely true, there should he a large gap between K.C. and other interested suitors. He's not going to take an 8 figure discount if the years are the same.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 06:04 PM) Worth noting how much you're doing the same thing I would be if I said how terrible he was in May - selectively including 1 month. OPS+ by month: Apr: 78 May: 48 June: 100 July: 185 Aug: 107 Sept: 88 On the whole season, his spectacular July balances out his terrible May, leaving him as an "average" hitter with a 100 OPS. That would be bad for a DH, it's weak for a corner OF, and if you throw in poor defense, well there you go. Lol...I saw this post coming a mile away. Unfortunately, you can't be objective with former roiders, so I'm not even going to waste my time. Regardless, I'm confident he will put numbers closer to his 2011 & 2014 seasons than his 2015 season next year. Guys have flukey months and if you watched him hit in May it wasn't the same Melky we've seen im recent years.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 05:25 PM) I think this is the key. How far over the KC offer are the sox willing to go? I have no doubt it will be more but how much? Well the rumor is the Royals offered around 4/$52M, so my guess is a lot more. The Sox just gave Melky $15M/per, don't see why they wouldn't be willing to give a much better player in Gordon close to $20M per over four seasons.

I was expecting something closer to his 2011 & 2014 seasons. The power numbers in particular were way down, especially when you consider his move to the Cell. As previous posters mentioned, his 2nd half is much closer to the player most of us were expecting.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:39 PM) Regarding Sanchez: http://www.liderendeportes.com/movil/detal...dNoticia=175700 " In fact, the absence of Sanchez in the semifinals is because the White Sox are very interested in the infielder is trained during the month of January as shortstop, and so it was told to La Guaira about two weeks ago. "We made ​​a proposal, both Carlos and to the White Sox, to at least partially train him throughout the month of January as shortstop, but Carlos preferred to follow a full-time program of preparation as a shortstop, " concluded Jose Antonio Herrera. " Pretty much confirms what we've heard about Sanchez and Saladino competing at SS in ST. And I'm a fan of that. We're better off having some competition than just handing Tyler the job.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:28 PM) since he was offered 200 million by other teams, he is taking less for a few years, in order to boost his value in 3 years to make more than the 200 guaranteed now. this will work out provide a) he continues to produce, b) he doesn't get hurt, c) there is a team willing to spend that much more on an older player. He is really betting on himself. I think I would have gone for the big money now, if the money is his only concern. He's not taking less now though. He's getting $78M over three years. Those other deals would have most likely been back loaded. He's making more now and later assuming no sudden drop off in performance over the next three years. If so, he loses roughly $16M or so in years 6 through 8 of his contract, which is significantly less than the potential payoff.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:23 PM) So, in other words, he signed this deal due to the opt outs not the most money in the deal. He signed it with the possibility of more money later not more money now. He's looking at $78M over three years ($26M AAV) then another $200M+ contract as a 29 year old free agent. If he gets hurt or his play suddenly falls off, he's guaranteed $184M over 8 years. He gave up roughly $16M in guaranteed money for the chance earn a ton more as a free agent in a few years. Like fathom said, he signed one of the most player friendly contracts of all time. Kudos to Theo for landing his guy, but Heyward took no discount.

QUOTE (fathom @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:15 PM) Despite what the Chicago media likes to report, his contract is hardly a discount. He'll make way more money in the long run with the Cubs contract structure. Exactly. What's is AAV in the deal if he opts out after three years? And he'll most likely be looking at a $200M contract at that time from his next team. He didn't take a discount whatsoever, he simply took the over that maximized his potential earnings while also providing a nice security blanket if something went wrong for him.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:08 PM) So you're 100% confident Johnson and Saladino will keep their spots all season long then? Not at all, but I think Cespedes is significantly better than Parra and that Latos & Ramirez aren't sure things either. I'll happily take one impact player and two question marks than one mediocre played and two question marks with a bit more certainty.

QUOTE (Brian @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 01:38 PM) Bridget Fonda was hotter than Uma Thurman. That's about it. This I can agree with.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 01:52 PM) Hasn't everyone said all along Desmond and Fowler were the two most likely candidates to go unsigned into the regular season due to the QO picks attached? Fine, just bring back Alexei Ramirez at that time. So in June, you'd have Ramirez, Latos and Parra or Cespedes. I'm also assuming at least one starting pitcher will miss time, so you avoid having to start Turner or Beck. I will 100% take Cespedes, E. Johnson, & Saladino over Parra, Latos, & Ramirez. Not even a debate for me.