I didn’t get home until the bottom of the 9th of game 2, but based on the box score alone I can’t recall a single double header more embarrassing than this one.

For those who actually watched the games, how bad was it?  Is Dallas basically cooked?  Is Tony going to be a detriment all season?  Does this team feel like they have the division locked down and are getting cocky?  Is the lack of left-handed hitting going to be a routine problem?

It’s easy to overreact to a bad couple of games, but it’s also hard not to be concerned when major areas of weakness were completely exploited today.  Please share your thoughts for those of us not able to watch.

@fathom - I need your honest assessment here.

It was really bad today. But this team is and will be so much better than that. 

but today was awful in very respect expect the bullpen. 

The team clearly was not ready to play today in game 1. I'm not sure what TA and Abreu were doing during the 2 off days, but they showed up like they smoked to celebrate 4/20 prior to the game. Keuchel started out pitching fine and then unraveled after the error in the 2nd inning. He went from keeping everything low in the zone in the first inning to leaving everything up in the zone. We know what happens when Keuchel does that. 

The struggles for Robert are a little concerning. He has hit some balls hard during his 0-20 stretch, but he's looking overmatched almost every at bat. Unfortunately it reminds me of his at bats in September of 2020. I think he'll be able to hit himself out of it, but his slump has come at a time where just about everyone in the lineup is not hitting. Abreu is off to his usual bad April start. Grandal is hitting like crap without his usual patience and walks. Eloy looks lost at the plate and can't decide what stance he wants to use. TA is hitting, but his defense today bordered on sabotage. Vaughn did have a good game 1, but looked fairly sluggish game 2. Without a Yermin-esque performance to carry this offense, we're gonna be starring at .500 by the end of April if our big hitters don't figure it out. 

IMO, if this team really felt as embarrassed as they should have for game 1, they'll come out tomorrow and jump on Plesac like they jumped on Civale to clinch the Central last year. That was a team that looked motivated to win. Right now they don't look like they have that motivation and it's hard to convince me otherwise with the showing from the team and TLR today. 

Just now, ChiSox59 said:

It was really bad today. But this team is and will be so much better than that. 

but today was awful in very respect expect the bullpen. 

Here’s the thing.  Dallas Keuchel may be approaching the end of the road.  Even if Lucas comes back soon, how do we survive with a rotation that only has three good starters?

Beyond that, Hahn did absolutely NOTHING to address our weakness against tough RHP this offseason?  How do we overcome that in the near term?

And finally, Tony La Russa is going to continue making horrible baseball decisions that cost us games.  There is no cure for that when the owner has empowered him over the entire front office.

I’m not looking to be a pessimist here or overreact to a bad double header, but multiple flaws were highlighted today and none of them have an easy solve.  Hopefully the roster is talented enough to overcome these weaknesses, but it’s very clear to me that Jerry & Hahn have opened up this team to unnecessary risk with their coaching & personnel decisions.

Game 1 was actually worse then the box score shows - if that is even possible. I think every single position player made at least 1 error or "dumb play" that wasn't scored an error.

Let's go around the horn:

1B. Probably one of the more solid defense performances but as other posters noticed in the game thread he wasn't extending on plays at first and there were a couple very close ones. Also missed a short hop throw from Burger which he should have gotten IMO.

2B: Mendick actually didn't have any major blunders other than throwing a whiffle ball 2nd to 1st on what should of been a double play. Also went 1-6 on the day with 4 K's.

SS: No comment needed here. Probably the worst game of TA's career. See video of him flipping off the Cleveland crowd cheering his errors. He did make a couple nice plays late in the game so I guess there's that...

3B: Burger with an error and 0-3 with 2K for good measure.

LF: Vaughn bobbled and lost a ball on a single, no one advanced so wasn't ruled an error.

CF:  Robert airmailed a cutoff man. 0-4 and I believe he's 0 for his last 20 now?

RF: Engel also airmailed a cutoff man which would have resulted in another run being scored. He did get a hit and our lone run so props to him. 

C; I think Grandal had one passed ball (not sure if it was scored that) but that's all I can recall. 0-4 on the day too.

P: Keuchel... where to start... In his defense I will say after the atrocities committed by the defense I too would lose it. 7 straight hits at one point. 11 straight batters reached base. Failed to cover backup at home on a play. Blamed the defense OFC in the post game interview. 

 

Oh and to boot:

The NBC team fucked up the scoreboard overlay for about half the game. TLR/whoever our replay guy wasted our review early. 

Bonus: Game 2 super joe sending our fastest runner Engel home with 0 outs, out by a mile. 

I'm sure I'm missing stuff but I'd rather not try to remember today...

 

3 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Game 1 was actually worse then the box score shows - if that is even possible. I think every single position player made at least 1 error or "dumb play" that wasn't scored an error.

Let's go around the horn:

1B. Probably one of the more solid defense performances but as other posters noticed in the game thread he wasn't extending on plays at first and there were a couple very close ones. Also missed a short hop throw from Burger which he should have gotten IMO.

Abreu had the ball in the second that was originally called an error and then changed to a hit.

5 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Here’s the thing.  Dallas Keuchel may be approaching the end of the road.  Even if Lucas comes back soon, how do we survive with a rotation that only has three good starters?

Beyond that, Hahn did absolutely NOTHING to address our weakness against tough RHP this offseason?  How do we overcome that in the near term?

And finally, Tony La Russa is going to continue making horrible baseball decisions that cost us games.  There is no cure for that when the owner has empowered him over the entire front office.

I’m not looking to be a pessimist here or overreact to a bad double header, but multiple flaws were highlighted today and none of them have an easy solve.  Hopefully the roster is talented enough to overcome these weaknesses, but it’s very clear to me that Jerry & Hahn have opened up this team to unnecessary risk with their coaching & personnel decisions.

These are valid concerns. 

25% of this roster is gone next month. They will be fine. It wont be a runaway this season...but the division still sucks.

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

Abreu had the ball in the second that was originally called an error and then changed to a hit.

TA and Abreu were almost equally bad in the first and second inning today. 

We play 162 games. Some days you have it, some days you don't.

Today we didn't have it and we played two games (and the second game with a lineup full of players most casual fans have never even heard of).

Tomorrow is another game. I'm not concerned.

20 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I didn’t get home until the bottom of the 9th of game 2, but based on the box score alone I can’t recall a single double header more embarrassing than this one.

For those who actually watched the games, how bad was it?  Is Dallas basically cooked?  Is Tony going to be a detriment all season?  Does this team feel like they have the division locked down and are getting cocky?  Is the lack of left-handed hitting going to be a routine problem?

It’s easy to overreact to a bad couple of games, but it’s also hard not to be concerned when major areas of weakness were completely exploited today.  Please share your thoughts for those of us not able to watch.

Dallas is cooked.  The defense was drunk to start game one, the bats are scuffling, and TLR basically punted game two with that AAA lineup.  They definitely did not come out ready to play.  I don't know if it is indicative of deeper ills or not yet though.

Just now, EloyJenkins said:

25% of this roster is gone next month. They will be fine. It wont be a runaway this season...but the division still sucks.

You really think VV, Keuchel and Harrison will be gone?

Sure, the back end of the bullpen and Mendick.

But who else that really matters?  Sheets with Pollock back?

All those relievers going down is just window dressing to the core endemic issues plaguing the team right now.

My #1 concern coming into this season was TLR, and that hasn't changed.

Talk to me three weeks after Lynn is back.

7 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

My #1 concern coming into this season was TLR, and that hasn't changed.

I agree with this. The fact of the reality is he is old AF. The mind deteriorates as you age. When that happens depends on the person. I'm worried of the possibility that he has slowed down a bit, but there are zero checks and balances for him. It seems like he has more power than Hahn does in this org. 

I would agree with concerns about TLR.  The fact that he didn't pinch hit at the end of game 2 when it was in reach is absolutely asinine.  His failure to adjust strategy on the fly is horrific, as has been noted by many posters.

I will continue to believe that the offense will figure it out at some point, but the concerns against RHP are far too documented at this point to not be seriously concerned about long term.

One bright spot is the bullpens (and Lambert's) performance means that either we have a very good bullpen or Clevelands offense really is that bad which means they likely won't challenge hard anyways.

I know it won't happen, but I hope Keuchel doesn't make it back to Chicago.

43 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

 I can’t recall a single double header more embarrassing than this one.

 

You only have to go back 2 years

 

 

Game 2’s stupidity I’m just used to. LaRussa gives away games like that. It’s awful, but it’s nothing new.

Game 1 though is something else. For a veteran team that fashions itself a championship contender to come out like that, completely scatterbrained and unfocused and unprepared, just after a 2 game break, against a division opponent early in the season? That’s a new one on me. I might reach back to the ridiculously poor fundamentals we saw early in 2013 for a comp. That simply shouldn’t be happening, and I don’t know what else to say. 

If you ignore the 10 runs Dallas Keuchel allowed, the Sox pitched 15 innings and allowed 3 runs, and that's with Giolito, Lynn, Crochet and Kelly on the IL, and without using Graveman or Hendriks, with the three runs all allowed by guys who will both be at Charlotte by Sunday.

If the pitching stays even somewhat healthy going forward, this is going to be an outstanding pitching staff.

I have full confidence that Abreu, Robert and Grandal will start hitting much better. I have full confidence that Moncada will at worst be a marginal upgrade over Burger and at best someone who sparks the offense.

I'm concerned about Eloy, though I can't quite explain why. I'm concerned that Keuchel will continue to get too many innings once the injured pitchers are all back. I'm concerned that 2B will be a black hole again. I'm concerned that Vaughn won't play enough vs RHP, and will bat too far down in the order when he does.

18 minutes ago, ron883 said:

I agree with this. The fact of the reality is he is old AF. The mind deteriorates as you age. When that happens depends on the person. I'm worried of the possibility that he has slowed down a bit, but there are zero checks and balances for him. It seems like he has more power than Hahn does in this org. 

Ron…..

Well said. 

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Game 2’s stupidity I’m just used to. LaRussa gives away games like that. It’s awful, but it’s nothing new.

 

If he really felt Abreu/Anderson/Robert needed a day off, fine. But why not have them face McKenzie rather than Bieber? That's what I have the biggest issue with.

1 minute ago, CentralChamps21 said:

If he really felt Abreu/Anderson/Robert needed a day off, fine. But why not have them face McKenzie rather than Bieber? That's what I have the biggest issue with.

Or react in the middle of the first game when things went to hell. 

Or at least don’t hit Harrison, Haseley, Leury in the 123 spots.

That’s just standard LaRussa bullplop. I can only get outraged by it so often at this point.

I see a team that isn’t as good as last years in a division that will be much better.   The struggles hitting against RHP will haunt this team.