15 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

Yeah, see I am not giving Eloy away.  He's worth more to the Sox than anyone else.  What I am doing with him is making him the everyday DH and making it such that Gavin Sheets isn't penciled in as an everyday player so when Eloy only play 100 games, we have a built in replacement.

Giving up on Eloy makes 0 sense.  Just let the dude who is actually a FA and is the root cause of the awful team defense exit the picture before his production actually catches up to his age.  

But Eloy seems to be saying he does not want to be a DH. Especially at 25 years old. If he insists on playing LF, you either play him or trade him, You then move Vaughn to 1B and make Abreu the DH and  some 1B.  If Abreu refuses to play 1B , then you trade him as well. 

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

The offense is in zero position to afford to lose Jose Abreu.  They can't pay for the stupidity of their coaching staff being kneecapping the offense.  If they are, they might as well sell off the rest of the offense and start over.

I mean, this organization is also not in a position to continue to punt OF defense, athleticism and lineup balance. Look where that gets us!!! Nimmo is a way better roster fit than Jose. We have a guy who is already a comparable hitter to Jose than plays his position and is a decade+ younger. Let’s not let emotions get in the way here. 

32 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

They can free up the DH spot all they want, but we all know Eloy would not be the primary DH. He should be but we know better with this org.

If you actually have OFs on the roster that are better fits to play the OF (Nimmo and Colas) and competent management, sure they can. 

33 minutes ago, SCCWS said:

But Eloy seems to be saying he does not want to be a DH. Especially at 25 years old. If he insists on playing LF, you either play him or trade him, You then move Vaughn to 1B and make Abreu the DH and  some 1B.  If Abreu refuses to play 1B , then you trade him as well. 

I give less than zero fucks about Eloys opinions. He has not earned the right to choose where he plays. Does Eloy want to be a big leaguer? Then DH. I am not saying you burn his OF glove, but he needs to be the primary DH. 

Edited September 1, 20223 yr by ChiSox59

4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

If you actually have OFs on the roster that are better fits to play the OF (Nimmo and Colas) and competent management, sure they can. 

They can, but what are they odds they bring in another competent OF over another DH only type bat? They don’t really deserve the benefit of the doubt to be honest. They might decide it’s a cheaper option to grab a DH then another OF.

Replace the guys making decisions, then sure I’ll buy it.

Edited September 1, 20223 yr by Bob Sacamano

8 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

They can, but what are they odds they bring in another competent OF over another DH only type bat? They don’t really deserve the benefit of the doubt to be honest. They might decide it’s a cheaper option to grab a DH then another OF.

Replace the guys making decisions, then sure I’ll buy it.

This.  I don't really trust the Sox to make a series of complicated moves and succeed.  We KNOW Jose Abreu can play here.

At the beginning of the season, I likely would have been in favor of letting Jose go but he's been the best hitter on the White Sox this season.  Quite frankly, I don't think any of the White Sox have lost their ability to hit for power.  It's pretty obvious that it is Menechino.  The data bares this out.  They do have a logjam at 1B/DH.  It's possible you could get something good for Sheets but I think I don't have a problem keeping him and trading Vaughn.  I also would go after someone like Gallo in the offseason.  He's been slightly better in LA but I also think he's bound for a rebound.  And he improves your defense immensely.

24 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

At the beginning of the season, I likely would have been in favor of letting Jose go but he's been the best hitter on the White Sox this season.  Quite frankly, I don't think any of the White Sox have lost their ability to hit for power.  It's pretty obvious that it is Menechino.  The data bares this out.  They do have a logjam at 1B/DH.  It's possible you could get something good for Sheets but I think I don't have a problem keeping him and trading Vaughn.  I also would go after someone like Gallo in the offseason.  He's been slightly better in LA but I also think he's bound for a rebound.  And he improves your defense immensely.

Sheets has options. He's the guy you stash at AAA in case Jose or Vaughn go on the IL. You include him in a deal if another team really wants him, but don't just give him away.

1 hour ago, Bob Sacamano said:

They can, but what are they odds they bring in another competent OF over another DH only type bat? They don’t really deserve the benefit of the doubt to be honest. They might decide it’s a cheaper option to grab a DH then another OF.

Replace the guys making decisions, then sure I’ll buy it.

Yeah I get it. I guess I just operate under the assumption that these guys aren’t that dumb even tho history suggests otherwise. If a commercial banker can see that another DH would be asinine add, I would hope a Harvard educated seasoned GM could as well. It’s just not that hard. 

Jose will stay. One plus option.

16 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Yeah I get it. I guess I just operate under the assumption that these guys aren’t that dumb even tho history suggests otherwise. If a commercial banker can see that another DH would be asinine add, I would hope a Harvard educated seasoned GM could as well. It’s just not that hard. 

I agree with you and the way you want to handle the roster.

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

This.  I don't really trust the Sox to make a series of complicated moves and succeed.  We KNOW Jose Abreu can play here.

And I've said that's a fair opinion.  To be clear, I fully expect Jose Abreu to be wearing a White Sox uni next season.  Meanwhile, the Sox will either continue to punt defense and lineup balance or they trade AV for a similar control SP and we watch AV turn into one of the best hitting 1B in the league the next half decade while Abreu falls off a cliff, and we get like 50 starts out of said SP.

Just because there are reasons to not trust the Sox to make these decisions the right way doesn't mean they should  just avoid the problem and hope it magically disppears.  Jose Abreu can still hit; that's obvious.  But he's probably a good bet to regress in his age 36 and 37 season, and despite his great bat and decent glove, he's the genesis of the what is wrong with this team defensively because he forces other players to play out of position.  Its not really his fault, but its the reality of the situation.   

1 hour ago, pcq said:

Jose will stay. One plus option.

I think so too. God I hope we're wrong. 

Jose is the owner's favorite not going anywhere. 

20 minutes ago, pcq said:

Jose is the owner's favorite not going anywhere. 

He may want to retire. He’s earned 9 figures in his career and he didn’t want to commit at the start of what has to have been a miserable season.

I’ve been thinking about it since I put this thread up, and went back and forth, but honestly the only way I would want to see Jose Abreu go is if the front office went and a whole lot of other players went.

I don’t think the people running this organization have one clue about winning in the postseason or building a postseason contender anymore, and I don’t see Jerry firing anyone…but if we somehow did clean house, I would want Jose gone because it’s the smart play and a talented manager and GM could flip it around in 2-3 years. 

If it’s going to be the same clown show in the front office and managing for the next two years, then yes I want Jose Abreu, the man who bleeds black and white, to finish his career with the White Sox .He’s been nothing but someone to celebrate on and off the field and selfishly I want him to have his entire career here. Unless he would have a chance to win a title. Then I would trade him wherever he wanted to go. 

17 hours ago, SCCWS said:

But Eloy seems to be saying he does not want to be a DH. Especially at 25 years old. If he insists on playing LF, you either play him or trade him, You then move Vaughn to 1B and make Abreu the DH and  some 1B.  If Abreu refuses to play 1B , then you trade him as well. 

Abreu is a free agent at the end of the season so the Sox can't 'trade' him, but if they get him back then DH and occasional 1B is the best option, but that still leaves the problem that Eloy and Sheets should not be in the OF and are basically DH types, not to mention Grandal is looking more of a DH than an everyday catcher.

Basically this off season needs to address the same issues as last offseason, sort out a proper RF who can hit (and even a LF would be nice), sort out 2B, and clear the log jam at 1B/DH, and that is before you get to sorting out the starting rotation that will presumably lose Cueto and has the Giolito issue. Sorting that lot out is way beyond Hahn as he has proved in the past.

22 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

I give less than zero fucks about Eloys opinions. He has not earned the right to choose where he plays. Does Eloy want to be a big leaguer? Then DH. I am not saying you burn his OF glove, but he needs to be the primary DH. 

I understand your point, but if Eloy/agent  says then trade me where I can play in the field at 25 even though I am a terrible OF, what happens?  Trade him as a DH to another team who will play him in OF/IB( not sure he even is capable).

9 minutes ago, SCCWS said:

I understand your point, but if Eloy/agent  says then trade me where I can play in the field at 25 even though I am a terrible OF, what happens?  Trade him as a DH to another team who will play him in OF/IB( not sure he even is capable).

Eloy Jimenez is in no position to make demands of a front office. He is under a contract where the biggest money is in option years. What is he going to do, sit out? Come in out of shape Harden style? If he wants to play a certain spot he has to be earning it.

22 minutes ago, SCCWS said:

I understand your point, but if Eloy/agent  says then trade me where I can play in the field at 25 even though I am a terrible OF, what happens?  Trade him as a DH to another team who will play him in OF/IB( not sure he even is capable).

This is not the way things work.  

And no one else will play Eloy in the OF more than the Sox have.  

On 8/30/2022 at 11:12 PM, The Beast said:

Bad team this year and he’s not the problem. Keep him and deal one of the three hitters playing as position players. Fill the starting pitching void that existed at the start of the year with Rodon gone. Yes that fucking hole existed and Kopech wasn’t the solution or replacement.

Why would you keep Abreu turning 36 and his power numbers are declining badly. Yes he is hitting over .300 this year, but it's a lot of ground ball singles. Based on Jose's 2022 home run projection he will probably finish the season with his lowest HR total in 9 seasons. In fact, he is on target to hit less home runs than his 19 HR's from the 60 game Covid season. You must remember Jose came into MLB as an older rookie. He played 5 pro seasons with the national Cuban team. 

I get we can't keep playing Sheets and Vaughn in the outfield, but Vaughn is only 24 and Sheets 26. How many more years does Jose have left that are productive? Then all of a sudden Jose is gone in a few years and you've already traded away Vaughn or Sheets or both. How will that go if either of them or both have great careers for another 10-15 years with another team? Maybe our genius VP/GM Hahn should have thought about this more when in 2017 he drafted Sheets in the second round 49th overall, or Vaughn in 2019 in the first round 3rd overall. 

Any updates on whether or not this zero win player is for real?  

Is there any way you can platoon him a different way? He's great at home, and a slow Leury Garcia who plays RF like Paul Konerko would on the road. Only have him on the roster for home games.

27 minutes ago, GREEDY said:

Any updates on whether or not this zero win player is for real?  

Lol.  Seriously.  

Is Daniel Palka for real?

Is Matt Davidson for real? 

No, the answer is no. 1 month of hitting well isn't real. It's one month of hitting well.