South Side Hit Men Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/sports/mlb-playoffs-backlash-rcna120282 The Braves (104-58), who were 14 games better than the Phillies (90-72), and the Dodgers (100-62), 16 games superior to the D-backs (84-78), were eliminated in their best-of-five rounds, with the Braves winning one game and the Dodgers none. https://mollyknight.substack.com/p/the-five-best-regular-season-teams?r=7dijz&utm_medium=ios&utm_campaign=post Quote In voting to agree to expand the playoffs, the players may have hoisted themselves on their own petard. Because if an 84-win team can make the playoffs and ride a week-long hot streak into the World Series, why on earth would any owner spend money on player salary to win 90 or 100 games during the regular season? Why spend $5 on a lottery ticket for a 50/50 raffle when you could spend $1 on a ticket and your odds of winning are just the same? Quote The combined 354 wins of the four teams remaining is the fewest ever for any four teams who made the NLCS and ALCS. Is this what we want? I know it’s what the owners want, as it disincentivizes them to spend money. It might be what the league wants, except that if small-market teams like the Diamondbacks wind up in the World Series more often now that the playoffs are even more random, ratings will tank and so will the league’s bottom line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 36 minutes ago, tray said: Harper, Schwarber Turner.. choked at the end. Ketel Marte and the D Backs go into the WS as underdogs. Is this some luminary observation that spending money is a bad move? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopek Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 10 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said: Quote Because if an 84-win team can make the playoffs and ride a week-long hot streak into the World Series, why on earth would any owner spend money on player salary to win 90 or 100 games during the regular season? Why spend $5 on a lottery ticket for a 50/50 raffle when you could spend $1 on a ticket and your odds of winning are just the same? Amazing that the concept of having good players on your team gives you a better chance to win than not having good players is controversial or difficult to grasp. Does spending big guarantee you postseason success? Of course fucking not. No one ever said it does. Stop being deliberately obtuse. Injuries happen. Cold streaks happen. It's baseball. But if you are arguing against the idea that spending money on good players is worth it because there's a possibility that you might not win the World Series, then have fun with your stars aligning, team of destiny bullshit. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 20 minutes ago, Snopek said: Amazing that the concept of having good players on your team gives you a better chance to win than not having good players is controversial or difficult to grasp. Does spending big guarantee you postseason success? Of course fucking not. No one ever said it does. Stop being deliberately obtuse. Injuries happen. Cold streaks happen. It's baseball. But if you are arguing against the idea that spending money on good players is worth it because there's a possibility that you might not win the World Series, then have fun with your stars aligning, team of destiny bullshit. Just maybe baseball is not a predictable sport. Some of these teams that won 100 games were the result of more bad teams than last year. Padres, Giants, Cardinals, the whole AL Central, Yankees, Red Sox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 11 hours ago, Quin said: Is this some luminary observation that spending money is a bad move? It can be if you spend $300M and dumpster dive for the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 12 hours ago, tray said: Harper, Schwarber Turner.. choked at the end. Ketel Marte and the D Backs go into the WS as underdogs. Someone finally figured out that you don't give them anything to hit. Let the other 7 guys try to beat you. That's where small ball steps in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 21 minutes ago, kitekrazy said: It can be if you spend $300M and dumpster dive for the rest. That's the Angels though The Phillies have a pennant and NLCS berth in back to back years 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 12 minutes ago, Quin said: That's the Angels though The Phillies have a pennant and NLCS berth in back to back years I'd rather be in the Phillies shoes than taking the White Sox approach of misallocated spending and random playoff appearances wishing and hoping on a prayer... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 23 minutes ago, Quin said: That's the Angels though The Phillies have a pennant and NLCS berth in back to back years Angels seem to lack improving their farm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 11 minutes ago, Tnetennba said: I'd rather be in the Phillies shoes than taking the White Sox approach of misallocated spending and random playoff appearances wishing and hoping on a prayer... Sox are bad at scouting big league free agents or for some reason free agents don't do well here. That's when you need to invest in the farm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 Honestly, the 2020 Sox are a good comp to the Dbacks - 2 top of the rotation pitchers - ROY caliber OF (Robert's falter down the stretch hurt him) - Young talent coming onto the scene And don't forget: Moncada was a #1 prospect. Eloy was highly ranked. Vaughn was. Cease had talent. Crochet came in throwing fire. Then they make the playoffs as a WC. They just didn't catch fire. (Obviously this is super reductionist and it isn't a 1 for 1 comparison) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 Imagine crying that the playoffs weren’t easy enough because you couldn’t beat a team that you don’t believe is good enough to be in the playoffs 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 22 minutes ago, kitekrazy said: Sox are bad at scouting big league free agents or for some reason free agents don't do well here. That's when you need to invest in the farm. They aren’t bad at scouting big league free agents. They just don’t do it because they don’t sign big league free agents. They sign second tier free agents(sometimes. Mostly 3rd tier) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ'S Cousin Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 On 10/24/2023 at 1:08 PM, Quin said: Spend money, hire Bochy not many of you will admit it or remember back BEFORE pedro was annouced as manager I said many times to hire Bochy. The sh*t i took saying, "he's just another old man retread, like TLR" not exactly those words. i'm paraphasing of cource. I boycotted the entire season, did not go to a game. I usually attend 10 to 15 games. TV wise, I'm part of the 40% decline. Getz is going to be a Hahn/Williams clone and without a blank check he's worthless. I'm not saying to spend MY Met's money. that would be insane but you need to get 1 or 2 100 million dollar comtracts. I'm not that deeply involved in rearch like I've been in the past, seeing who's a free agent and available like in the past. one problem and gapping hole that could be solved is keeping Anderson for maybe one more year and move hime to second, he's is willing to do it, he's said and bring up the kid to play short and live with it for 2024. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted October 25, 2023 Share Posted October 25, 2023 Hiring Bochy was definitely not an unpopular stance in 2020 or 2022. In 2020, people fell into three camps: Hinch, Bochy or Ozzie In 2022: Espada, Bochy or Ozzie A lot people were fine with Espada/Hinch or Bochy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RibbieRubarb Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 2 hours ago, Quin said: Hiring Bochy was definitely not an unpopular stance in 2020 or 2022. In 2020, people fell into three camps: Hinch, Bochy or Ozzie In 2022: Espada, Bochy or Ozzie A lot people were fine with Espada/Hinch or Bochy. Bochy had a previous relationship with Rangers GM Chris Young. That and the promise to get good players helped lure him out of retirement. I don’t think the Sox could have matched that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 14 minutes ago, RibbieRubarb said: Bochy had a previous relationship with Rangers GM Chris Young. That and the promise to get good players helped lure him out of retirement. I don’t think the Sox could have matched that. The dude was talking about coming out of retirement all the way back in 2020, he was noncommittal but he was asked about it and publicly commented on it. Same thing in 2022. Had it come down to "Both Texas and Chicago are interested in me" he might well have gone to Texas, and frankly they probably would offer a better contract, but it never got to that point because the White Sox weren't interested either time. https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/bochy-hasnt-talked-to-white-sox-wont-rule-out-managing-again/1124242/ https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/report-bochy-was-white-soxs-no-2-choice-if-la-russa-said-no/1125605/ Quote "Sure, I'd listen to anything," Bochy said. "I can't say anything, but they're a good team. I haven't talked to anybody. It hasn't been mentioned or anything." Quote "I'd be lying if I said I didn't miss it, especially watching the postseason," Bochy told KNBR. "It's exciting times. I could see it happening to be honest, but it's not something right now that I'm pushing. When you've been in the game as long as I have, and you've managed as long as I did, you're gonna miss it. Now especially with watching these postseason games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 (edited) 10 hours ago, Snopek said: Amazing that the concept of having good players on your team gives you a better chance to win than not having good players is controversial or difficult to grasp. Does spending big guarantee you postseason success? Of course fucking not. No one ever said it does. Stop being deliberately obtuse. Injuries happen. Cold streaks happen. It's baseball. But if you are arguing against the idea that spending money on good players is worth it because there's a possibility that you might not win the World Series, then have fun with your stars aligning, team of destiny bullshit. You’re the one who is being obtuse. What people around the game are saying, which I largely agree with, is the fact that giving the best teams over the course of 162 games a marginal advantage of one possible home game waters down the value of the season, and disincentives owners to invest in their teams, especially along the margins at the deadline, when there isn’t a significant advantage finishing 14 or 16 games ahead of your opponent, when all that matters in the post season is winning a best of 3/5/7 series by one game. That spending like the Mets, Padres or Dodgers give a marginal edge that doesn’t come close to matching the EV (on field and current revenue and future goodwill revenue post a pennant or world series) of the meager edge a team has fielding superior regular season teams. To me, the obvious solution is to only have regular season division champions involved. If these owners are so desperate to squeeze a few more wild card dollars more out of playoffs most MLB fans don’t even bother watching if their team is out, to do it like the Japanese or Korean leagues where the regular season champion has the advantages winning the far more substantial regular season affords. Top seed only plays one round for the championship, higher seed hosts all home games, higher seeds start with a series lead before it begins, etc. Its ludicrous for a team to win their division by 16 games to have to beat the same team in the best of 5 or 7. The second, third or fourth place teams already lost their chance at a credible “World Championship”. They couldn’t even beat four teams. Not surprised most here seem to be fine with it, with Americans used to taking it up the rear in most other aspects of life from their “leaders”. That’s why over 75% of MLB fans don’t give a s%*# about the World Series anymore. May as well use lottery balls to conduct the playoffs. Fans see right through it and know it’s all bullshit, as is the 162 game exhibition season. Edited October 26, 2023 by South Side Hit Men 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 My man is passionate about this subject. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 17 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said: You’re the one who is being obtuse. What people around the game are saying, which I largely agree with, is the fact that giving the best teams over the course of 162 games a marginal advantage of one possible home game waters down the value of the season, and disincentives owners to invest in their teams, especially along the margins at the deadline, when there isn’t a significant advantage finishing 14 or 16 games ahead of your opponent, when all that matters in the post season is winning a best of 3/5/7 series by one game. That spending like the Mets, Padres or Dodgers give a marginal edge that doesn’t come close to matching the EV (on field and current revenue and future goodwill revenue post a pennant or world series) of the meager edge a team has fielding superior regular season teams. To me, the obvious solution is to only have regular season division champions involved. If these owners are so desperate to squeeze a few more wild card dollars more out of playoffs most MLB fans don’t even bother watching if their team is out, to do it like the Japanese or Korean leagues where the regular season champion has the advantages winning the far more substantial regular season affords. Top seed only plays one round for the championship, higher seed hosts all home games, higher seeds start with a series lead before it begins, etc. Its ludicrous for a team to win their division by 16 games to have to beat the same team in the best of 5 or 7. The second, third or fourth place teams already lost their chance at a credible “World Championship”. They couldn’t even beat four teams. Not surprised most here seem to be fine with it, with Americans used to taking it up the rear in most other aspects of life from their “leaders”. That’s why over 75% of MLB fans don’t give a s%*# about the World Series anymore. May as well use lottery balls to conduct the playoffs. Fans see right through it and know it’s all bullshit, as is the 162 game exhibition season. Have you run for office? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted October 27, 2023 Share Posted October 27, 2023 (edited) On 10/25/2023 at 9:16 PM, South Side Hit Men said: You’re the one who is being obtuse. Edited October 27, 2023 by Vacheron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted October 27, 2023 Share Posted October 27, 2023 The potential revenue from the new stadium in Arlington made it a heckuva lot easier to go all in on Semien deGrom and Seager. That's probably more financial commitments to FAs than the White Sox have made all decade plus if you strip away Dunn Grandal and Benintendi. Heck...you probably could still include 1-2 of those aforementioned 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 Evan Carter comes up from the minors and rakes. You can't make this stuff up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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