Snopek Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 7 hours ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said: I think it’s a legitimate thing to consider. I drive in for games currently (about 45 min to 1 hr) and I’ve definitely thought about what I’d do. I go to games with my father who requires handicap parking because he has trouble walking with diabetes and his heart, but is not immobile. I’m not entirely sure how I’d get him there if the only options are public transit. I’m not gonna sit there and cry about it, but it certainly makes it tougher. Right on. I’m very pro public transit/anti car in general, so I love the new idea. It’s perfect for me and I imagine many others. But to assume that public transit is a viable option for everyone is a little narrow minded. That said, there’s obviously no outcome that will be perfect for everyone. Looking forward to seeing how things shake out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 3 hours ago, Dick Allen said: All fine and dandy. Now the big question. Who pays for it? Personally, as a fan who would enjoy going there instead of the current stadium, who cares. Just do it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 3 hours ago, Dick Allen said: All fine and dandy. Now the big question. Who pays for it? As I said before, it appears the goal is to utilize the existing tax structure for the new stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 7 hours ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said: I think it’s a legitimate thing to consider. I drive in for games currently (about 45 min to 1 hr) and I’ve definitely thought about what I’d do. I go to games with my father who requires handicap parking because he has trouble walking with diabetes and his heart, but is not immobile. I’m not entirely sure how I’d get him there if the only options are public transit. I’m not gonna sit there and cry about it, but it certainly makes it tougher. Would a shuttle from one of the remaining GRF lots be feasible for you or more of a pain? Or an Uber from a nearby garage/lot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highland Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 3 hours ago, Dick Allen said: All fine and dandy. Now the big question. Who pays for it? I think this is important. I am not in favor of the White Sox getting public help without sinking more money into this franchise. I don't care about a new stadium if a fourth-place team is playing in it and the ownership is making a ton of money. I find a great deal of this offensive. The team comes off a 101-loss season, and then it plays the Nashville and new stadium card? Work needs to be done on this team. Do it already and then we can talk about a new stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 8 minutes ago, Highland said: I think this is important. I am not in favor of the White Sox getting public help without sinking more money into this franchise. I don't care about a new stadium if a fourth-place team is playing in it and the ownership is making a ton of money. I find a great deal of this offensive. The team comes off a 101-loss season, and then it plays the Nashville and new stadium card? Work needs to be done on this team. Do it already and then we can talk about a new stadium. The team never did. It was crappy reporting. JR met with the Nashville folks on behalf of the TLR group who wants an expansion team there, and not the White Sox. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 17 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: The team never did. It was crappy reporting. JR met with the Nashville folks on behalf of the TLR group who wants an expansion team there, and not the White Sox. It was sort of a threat by association...that JR and TLR would still be connected somehow business-wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 30 minutes ago, Highland said: I think this is important. I am not in favor of the White Sox getting public help without sinking more money into this franchise. I don't care about a new stadium if a fourth-place team is playing in it and the ownership is making a ton of money. I find a great deal of this offensive. The team comes off a 101-loss season, and then it plays the Nashville and new stadium card? Work needs to be done on this team. Do it already and then we can talk about a new stadium. If the ISFA is still in existence when this is built, I would like them to alter the rent agreement that now gives them a break when they suck, and have it tied into wins. The more you win, the lower your rent. JR would never go for it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurtCG Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: As I said before, it appears the goal is to utilize the existing tax structure for the new stadium. There is still 50 million dollars to be paid off on GRF. They are talking about this development being a 8 billion dollar project. No existing hotel tax is going to come close to covering that. Also, would the State and/or city then own a major share of the ballpark? Most owners seem to want to own their new stadiums outright these days. 29 minutes ago, Highland said: I think this is important. I am not in favor of the White Sox getting public help without sinking more money into this franchise. I don't care about a new stadium if a fourth-place team is playing in it and the ownership is making a ton of money. I find a great deal of this offensive. The team comes off a 101-loss season, and then it plays the Nashville and new stadium card? Work needs to be done on this team. Do it already and then we can talk about a new stadium. Agree 100%. JR and company need to worry about putting a competitive team out on the filed first and foremost. The Rate would bumping and packed every night of the Summer if the Sox actually had a fun and exciting team to watch. JR is going to be in for a very rude awakening once it comes time to talk about the financing. This is not the 1980s anymore. The political and economical landscape of the City have changed tremendously since the 1980s. There will be very little appetite for public funding on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 "No new taxes" was the end of a presidency...that and not being familiar with a grocery store check out scanner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 1 hour ago, Snopek said: Right on. I’m very pro public transit/anti car in general, so I love the new idea. It’s perfect for me and I imagine many others. But to assume that public transit is a viable option for everyone is a little narrow minded. That said, there’s obviously no outcome that will be perfect for everyone. Looking forward to seeing how things shake out. Exactly. There won’t be a perfect solution. I’m very in favor this project happening, but I won’t lie that depending on public transport is not exactly trilling to me. I enjoy having personal freedom of driving on my own. Hopefully there will be some type of option for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 1 hour ago, Tnetennba said: Would a shuttle from one of the remaining GRF lots be feasible for you or more of a pain? Or an Uber from a nearby garage/lot? I mean sure, but it’s still more of an inconvenience to have to depend on that. I’ll figure it out, as it’s not going to be something that makes me scream at the clouds where I won’t go, but it certainly adds to commute time and planning when going to a game. Honestly my best option would probably be Ogilvie and then hopefully a water taxi to the park, assuming they put a pickup spot there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 1 minute ago, LittleHurtCG said: There is still 50 million dollars to be paid off on GRF. They are talking about this development being a 8 billion dollar project. No existing hotel tax is going to come close to covering that. Also, would the State and/or city then own a major share of the ballpark? Most owners seem to want to own their new stadiums outright these days. Agree 100%. JR and company need to worry about putting a competitive team out on the filed first and foremost. The Rate would bumping and packed every night of the Summer if the Sox actually had a fun and exciting team to watch. JR is going to be in for a very rude awakening once it comes time to talk about the financing. This is not the 1980s anymore. The political and economical landscape of the City have changed tremendously since the 1980s. There will be very little appetite for public funding on this. That $50 million is also still being actively paid off. These funds wouldn't be required until the process for the stadium began. At worst, someone has to cut a check for the balance. Even if they had to pay it today, $50 million isn't going to be the thing that breaks a deal here. That's absurd. Part 2 is that you are confligrating an 8 billion dollar development with the cost of the stadium happening somewhere between $500 million and a billion dollars, probably on the lower end of that guess due to no roof. The cost the Stadium Authority would be dealing with is the stadium itself. The rest of that cost would be separate projects (whether it is one large other project, or many smaller ones within a larger product) legally unrelated to this one. Even if JR is in this other project, it also allows him to still pass this on to his kids while selling off the White Sox. It would totally be separate financing and everything. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 1 hour ago, Snopek said: Right on. I’m very pro public transit/anti car in general, so I love the new idea. It’s perfect for me and I imagine many others. But to assume that public transit is a viable option for everyone is a little narrow minded. That said, there’s obviously no outcome that will be perfect for everyone. Looking forward to seeing how things shake out. I don't think this will be NO parking, it will be just be at a much reduced ratio, and probably a lot more expensive to keep people from wanting to park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurtCG Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 14 hours ago, Lightly Folded said: Well, this is both exciting and scary. WGN has confirmed that that the sox and the bears are in competition with each other. Both franchises are hoping any potential new baseball or football facility would be financed (in part) by tapping into a “unique binding clause” that governs the I.S.F.A. If the bears wind up winning this partial financing thingy I believe that would cause the Sox no other choice but to leave Illinois altogether. I hope Reinsdorf has a lot of “friends” in Springfield. It's pretty crazy to see both the Bears and Sox lining up for handouts from the State of Illinois. The State does not have hundreds of millions of dollars just laying around to give to Jerry McCaskey or Jerry Reinsdorf. The Sox won't leave Illinois if the new stadium plans fall through. There is nothing wrong with GRF. The thing that is rotten about the Sox is ownership. JR is using this new stadium ploy to drive up the value of the Sox. Hopefully the dude just sells the team sometime soon and screws off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 I don't know if it's possible, but getting the following to happen would be wild: Sox build South Loop Stadium Bears shift from Arlington Heights to lakefront, which Crain's just did a report on Spaceship is removed by Soldier Field, converted to public parks/athletic fields (suggested in Crain's) Fire move to the converted GRF, some parking lots converted to housing That'd be such a crazy, positive turn of events from the Arlington Heights + Nashville narrative 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurtCG Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 8 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: That $50 million is also still being actively paid off. These funds wouldn't be required until the process for the stadium began. At worst, someone has to cut a check for the balance. Even if they had to pay it today, $50 million isn't going to be the thing that breaks a deal here. That's absurd. Part 2 is that you are confligrating an 8 billion dollar development with the cost of the stadium happening somewhere between $500 million and a billion dollars, probably on the lower end of that guess due to no roof. The cost the Stadium Authority would be dealing with is the stadium itself. The rest of that cost would be separate projects (whether it is one large other project, or many smaller ones within a larger product) legally unrelated to this one. Even if JR is in this other project, it also allows him to still pass this on to his kids while selling off the White Sox. It would totally be separate financing and everything. Who is gonna cut that check for the remaining balance on GRF? I don't see Jerry lining up to do that. Also, the stadium would still exist in Bridgeport without a tenant and without revenue coming in. So the State of Illinois and/or City of Chicago would be part owners of the new stadium? Like I said, good luck with that. The private develepors are also going to be asking for $$ from the State and City. $$ that doesn't exist without new taxes or some sort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 3 minutes ago, LittleHurtCG said: Who is gonna cut that check for the remaining balance on GRF? I don't see Jerry lining up to do that. Also, the stadium would still exist in Bridgeport without a tenant and without revenue coming in. So the State of Illinois and/or City of Chicago would be part owners of the new stadium? Like I said, good luck with that. The private develepors are also going to be asking for $$ from the State and City. $$ that doesn't exist without new taxes or some sort. If you think Jerry is going to tank a deal that could be worth billions between the stadium, the franchise value, plus the real estate developments over something less (and maybe nothing by the time this starts) than $50 million that is laughable. That's a down payment. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurtCG Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 14 minutes ago, Quin said: I don't know if it's possible, but getting the following to happen would be wild: Sox build South Loop Stadium Bears shift from Arlington Heights to lakefront, which Crain's just did a report on Spaceship is removed by Soldier Field, converted to public parks/athletic fields (suggested in Crain's) Fire move to the converted GRF, some parking lots converted to housing That'd be such a crazy, positive turn of events from the Arlington Heights + Nashville narrative First I've heard about the Bears wanting to shift away from Arlington Heights. Didn't they already buy all the land in AH and do a bunch of renderings of what the new stadium and surrounding area would look like? Where would they go on the lakefront? Would they put a massive domed stadium right on the lake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 2 minutes ago, LittleHurtCG said: First I've heard about the Bears wanting to shift away from Arlington Heights. Didn't they already buy all the land in AH and do a bunch of renderings of what the new stadium and surrounding area would look like? Where would they go on the lakefront? Would they put a massive domed stadium right on the lake? They want to build where the Lucas Museum was supposed to go. Just south of Soldier Field. It will never happen. Its Arlington Heights or bust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurtCG Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: If you think Jerry is going to tank a deal that could be worth billions between the stadium, the franchise value, plus the real estate developments over something less (and maybe nothing by the time this starts) than $50 million that is laughable. That's a down payment. I mean this a owner who still hasn't given out a $100 million contract. Color me skeptical that he would write out that check for 50 million from his own pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 They can draw these things up and make them as nice as they want to make them look, the problem is, they cost a ton of money. They are saying the 78 development has a $9 billion price tag. If they build the drawings, you could bet it would be a lot closer to double that. And how much would it cost to fix the stadium for the Fire? These are pipedreams unless some private fund rich person or persons step way up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 23 minutes ago, Quin said: I don't know if it's possible, but getting the following to happen would be wild: Sox build South Loop Stadium Bears shift from Arlington Heights to lakefront, which Crain's just did a report on Spaceship is removed by Soldier Field, converted to public parks/athletic fields (suggested in Crain's) Fire move to the converted GRF, some parking lots converted to housing That'd be such a crazy, positive turn of events from the Arlington Heights + Nashville narrative I don't give a s%*# about the Bears personally, but I'm curious where on the lakefront this would be. I'm all for erasing the ugly spaceship from the Soldier Field colonnades, but a lake front location doesn't seem to solve their supposed issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 Just now, LittleHurtCG said: I mean this a owner who still hasn't given out a $100 million contract. Color me skeptical that he would write out that check for 50 million from his own pocket. It's also an owners who has cut players with no gain at all. He essentially cut John Danks a $10 million check when he cut him. He did it last year with Leury Garcia. JR and his ancestors stand to gain hundreds of millions of dollars here. This isn't something as simplistic as a baseball contract. This is investment that pays off for decades (maybe longer), not a baseball player which pays off for a period of less than a decade, at most. This is a man who has cut checks for investments all of his life. It is where he made his fortune to buy into the White Sox and Bulls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted February 8 Share Posted February 8 13 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: If you think Jerry is going to tank a deal that could be worth billions between the stadium, the franchise value, plus the real estate developments over something less (and maybe nothing by the time this starts) than $50 million that is laughable. That's a down payment. The bump in franchise valuation alone just from moving downtown easily covers that. It would be a drop in the bucket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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