Contreras Update

[rokimar]

Player IP H R ER BB SO HR ERA

Contreras (W, 1-0) 6.0 3 0 0 5 5 0 0.00

 

Pitches-strikes: Contreras 108-57

 

no earned runs but 5 walks

 

 

on a side note:

Anderson went 2 for 4 with a triple

[Kyyle23]

57 strikes in 108 pitches? Man, his location is shot. he may not have given up runs, but I dont think major league players are going to let him off the hook with all of those walks like the AAA teams will

[greg775]

Luke Hochevar was something like 5-0 in the minors and got shelled the other day. Amazing difference.

 

 

[earthshiner]

I don't really think stats are what they're watching with Contreras. They more or less want to see if he can throw strikes. so far, the answer is no, but we'll see.

[Dick Allen]

His ERA means nothing. He needs to be able to throw his forkball for strikes. He even admits he has no problem throwing strikes in the bullpen, so I think its just a matter of time. This is a guy who usually shows up in spring training ready to throw 115 pitches. He wasn't this year, he had an extra long layoff, he's older. The Sox are going to need him.

Edited May 14, 2009 by Dick Allen

[southsider2k5]

57 strikes in 108 pitches? Man, his location is shot. he may not have given up runs, but I dont think major league players are going to let him off the hook with all of those walks like the AAA teams will

 

I think Kal posted he was 39 strikes and 35 balls at one point, so something changed...

[CanOfCorn]

I know he looked great in Spring Training, but he needed to have an extended spring. That's just me though.

[SoxFan562004]

I would be more intrigued by a line where he gave up a few ERs but walked 0.

[watchtower41]

People are so quick to forget that Jose is all about confidence. He dominates Triple A hitters, he will be back and become servicable to this team again.

[Balta1701]

People are so quick to forget that Jose is all about confidence. He dominates Triple A hitters, he will be back and become servicable to this team again.

Confidence and throwing strikes. He needs to throw strikes so that people have no choice but to swing at the dancing stuff.

[The Ginger Kid]

to me it looked like Jose was dropping down on EVERYTHING he threw, instead of occasionally doing it to throw off hitters. Seems like he just gave up on throwing from over the top.

[southsider2k5]

Am I the only who wonders if Contreras is indeed not feeling any pain right now? He is having a problem with location, which could very well be a product of having a sore achillies and not being able to plant and fire consistently because of it. Without a solid finish, his release point could be deviating a lot, which would explain the wildness, especially in the forkball which he has to over throw to make sure it is down, and has been bouncing into the plate very often this year. We know Jose hid pain from Ozzie last year, would he be above doing it again this year in an effort to get back to play before his contract is up?

[kapkomet]

Am I the only who wonders if Contreras is indeed not feeling any pain right now? He is having a problem with location, which could very well be a product of having a sore achillies and not being able to plant and fire consistently because of it. Without a solid finish, his release point could be deviating a lot, which would explain the wildness, especially in the forkball which he has to over throw to make sure it is down, and has been bouncing into the plate very often this year. We know Jose hid pain from Ozzie last year, would he be above doing it again this year in an effort to get back to play before his contract is up?

You beat me to it. I wonder the same thing. He doesn't seem like he was pushing all the way through on his delivery, which means with that arm angle, he's going to be wild because he can't get enough torque on the ball to keep it where he wants it (especially on that forkball).

 

 

[Kyyle23]

Am I the only who wonders if Contreras is indeed not feeling any pain right now? He is having a problem with location, which could very well be a product of having a sore achillies and not being able to plant and fire consistently because of it. Without a solid finish, his release point could be deviating a lot, which would explain the wildness, especially in the forkball which he has to over throw to make sure it is down, and has been bouncing into the plate very often this year. We know Jose hid pain from Ozzie last year, would he be above doing it again this year in an effort to get back to play before his contract is up?

 

There is probably so much muscle atrophy that he is still recovering from, he is probably constantly sore in his leg/ankle.

 

I had a sore achilles once in high school due to a growth spurt, I cannot even imagine tearing it and the residual pain that would accompany that.

[elrockinMT]

His ERA means nothing. He needs to be able to throw his forkball for strikes. He even admits he has no problem throwing strikes in the bullpen, so I think its just a matter of time. This is a guy who usually shows up in spring training ready to throw 115 pitches. He wasn't this year, he had an extra long layoff, he's older. The Sox are going to need him.

 

 

Yes. We have folks that forget he is about 6 months early in his original return date to major league play. Once he can regain his control, arm strength, feel for the pitches etc, I am thinking we will see Contreras providing that spark we need to win

[SleepyWhiteSox]

I cannot even imagine tearing it and the residual pain that would accompany that.

 

Not really much pain at all, just discomfort. That's just from my experience, and I didn't do any physical activity so soon afterwards, much less pitching. On the one hand, he's gotta get get used to it and play through some discomfort, which takes time, and on the other, he's old and his skills have diminished.

[WCSox]

As was mentioned earlier in this thread, Jose's arm tends to drop down when he's not healthy. This was evident when he began experiencing back problems a few years ago, and he's practically been throwing sidearm again this season. And whether it's pain or atrophy, I could easily see his not-quite-100% Achilles messing up his release point (just as his back did).

[StrangeSox]

Contreras pitched a 1-hit CG last night. 3 walks, 5 k's, 100 pitches 66 strikes.

 

http://www.examiner.com/x-2683-Charlotte-S...edo-Mud-Hens-40

http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/st...94&sid=t494

 

 

[RockRaines]

I know he looked great in Spring Training, but he needed to have an extended spring. That's just me though.

Yup, his feel pitches are garbage and his release point is all f***ed up. Its going to take awhile after an injury like that to be yourself again. Maybe the original diagnosis was more accurate than we thought. He needs to pound the strike zone with his fastball in every start until he gets that down, then move to adding a slider, fork, etc. Work your way back.

[RockRaines]

As was mentioned earlier in this thread, Jose's arm tends to drop down when he's not healthy. This was evident when he began experiencing back problems a few years ago, and he's practically been throwing sidearm again this season. And whether it's pain or atrophy, I could easily see his not-quite-100% Achilles messing up his release point (just as his back did).

I disagree, his drop down 2-seamer in 05-06 was one of his best pitches and he threw it because it was unhittable, not because he wasnt healthy.

[fathom]

I disagree, his drop down 2-seamer in 05-06 was one of his best pitches and he threw it because it was unhittable, not because he wasnt healthy.

 

Yep, he was throwing it 96 mph and the hitter could do nothing with it but hit it right to Crede. He was basically a two pitch pitcher, and he didn't care if the hitter knew what was coming.

[Balta1701]

Yep, he was throwing it 96 mph and the hitter could do nothing with it but hit it right to Crede. He was basically a two pitch pitcher, and he didn't care if the hitter knew what was coming.

The difference is...if he's throwing strikes and ahead of the hitter, then those 2 pitches work great together. If he's falling behind hitters, then people can simply lay off when he drops down and wait until they get the fastball down the middle to drive or take the walk. Even in 05 when he was throwing harder, when he'd walk people, he'd struggle. It's all about the strike zone for him.

[caulfield12]

I disagree, his drop down 2-seamer in 05-06 was one of his best pitches and he threw it because it was unhittable, not because he wasnt healthy.

 

 

But there's a huge difference when you are at 95-97 and in the low 90's. Your margin for error on fastballs is razor thin...Jose got away with bad location because they would foul off the pitches when he was the best pitcher in the game that they are now dialing in on.

 

The other thing is that he consistently worked quickly, got ahead in counts and had that equalizing weapon nobody could hit, the forkball. The majority of his pitches were fastballs, but he was punching out batters with the off-speed stuff.

 

Now, they just wait on the fastball, which he throws it 90% of the time from drop down. That's not enough variation.

 

If he threw that slurve/slider 20-30% of the time, to the outside corner of the plate against RH hitters, he'd be much more effective. He comes inside almost every time with the fastball against RH hitters (08/09), but he doesn't ever knock batters off the plate, his velocity isn't a weapon anymore and everyone knows they can wait for a good fastball.

 

 

[SI1020]

I disagree, his drop down 2-seamer in 05-06 was one of his best pitches and he threw it because it was unhittable, not because he wasnt healthy.

You're right, that pitch was devastating because he could locate it with speed and movement. His drop down motion this year seems to me to be used more often and is more laborious. It's a get me over motion and pitch. He in no way looked like the pitcher he was the last half of 05 and the first half of 06. Which brings me to another point. Other than those two parts of a season when has he resembled a true ace for any decent period of time?

[Cali]

I think the point is he wasn't throwing it out of necessity in '05-'06. It was at 96 and nasty when he threw it sporadically. Now it's at 91 and EVERY pitch and missing badly most times.

 

I wish we had someone at his Charlotte start to see if he was dropping down every pitch or actually trying to go over the top...