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A Realistic Offseason

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45 minutes ago, Flash said:

Love the idea of Grandal and Wheeler as our 'expensive' additions. As a trade acquisition, wonder if Yankees would consider moving Mike Trauchman - .277/.361/.504 with 13 home runs and six stolen bases across 87 games and strong glove displayed at all 3 OF positions. Cheap and under team control for 5 yrs. Born in Palatine and attended Bradley. Hits from left side. Yankees have some roster moves to make and seek pitching (Lopez?). Also, Gregorius likely to be available. Could be LH DH with middle infield capability.

Wheeler and Grandal are my two top targeted additions.  As long as the RF and 2nd starter are above average the off season will be a success.

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The plan should be to quickly do the following:

  • Land one of Wheeler or Bumgarner
  • Land one of Grandal or Martinez

We should then evaluate trade options for RF.  If there’s something worthwhile at a reasonable price (Nimmo being the dream), go ahead and pull the trigger.  If not, sign Dickerson or Kalhoun to be a stop-gap.  Doing so buys you a year on your OF prospects and if none of them take a major step forward you look at being serious players for Betts, Springer, & Pederson in 2021.

After those critical needs are filled, it’s primarily about pitching depth.  We definitely need another starter type (there are plenty or options) and at least one established bullpen arm to add to the mix.  Maybe look at a bench piece as well, but only if you can land said player on your own terms. 

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8 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The plan should be to quickly do the following:

  • Land one of Wheeler or Bumgarner
  • Land one of Grandal or Martinez

We should then evaluate trade options for RF.  If there’s something worthwhile at a reasonable price (Nimmo being the dream), go ahead and pull the trigger.  If not, sign Dickerson or Kalhoun to be a stop-gap.  Doing so buys you a year on your OF prospects and if none of them take a major step forward you look at being serious players for Betts, Springer, & Pederson in 2021.

After those critical needs are filled, it’s primarily about pitching depth.  We definitely need another starter type (there are plenty or options) and at least one established bullpen arm to add to the mix.  Maybe look at a bench piece as well, but only if you can land said player on your own terms. 

Is Nimmo really the "dream" or just a realistic upgrade?

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6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The plan should be to quickly do the following:

  • Land one of Wheeler or Bumgarner
  • Land one of Grandal or Martinez

We should then evaluate trade options for RF.  If there’s something worthwhile at a reasonable price (Nimmo being the dream), go ahead and pull the trigger.  If not, sign Dickerson or Kalhoun to be a stop-gap.  Doing so buys you a year on your OF prospects and if none of them take a major step forward you look at being serious players for Betts, Springer, & Pederson in 2021.

After those critical needs are filled, it’s primarily about pitching depth.  We definitely need another starter type (there are plenty or options) and at least one established bullpen arm to add to the mix.  Maybe look at a bench piece as well, but only if you can land said player on your own terms. 

Absolutely starting pitching has to be priority #1.  Make a strong offer early and land a starter in November.  Waiting around for the market to dictate things needs to not happen this year.  Target who you want (outside of Cole and Strasburg because they will not pay that amount of $) and sign them quickly.

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2 minutes ago, bmags said:

Is Nimmo really the "dream" or just a realistic upgrade?

Realistic upgrade.

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9 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The plan should be to quickly do the following:

  • Land one of Wheeler or Bumgarner
  • Land one of Grandal or Martinez

We should then evaluate trade options for RF.  If there’s something worthwhile at a reasonable price (Nimmo being the dream), go ahead and pull the trigger.  If not, sign Dickerson or Kalhoun to be a stop-gap.  Doing so buys you a year on your OF prospects and if none of them take a major step forward you look at being serious players for Betts, Springer, & Pederson in 2021.

After those critical needs are filled, it’s primarily about pitching depth.  We definitely need another starter type (there are plenty or options) and at least one established bullpen arm to add to the mix.  Maybe look at a bench piece as well, but only if you can land said player on your own terms. 

Steve Stone keeps insisting on Twitter that the fans will be “pleasantly surprised” with the offseason results, that the money will be spent, just not on Cole.

That leads me to believe it almost has to be the landing of “one of” the two selections you put forth, plus maybe some other surprise acquisition.  What else could it be if not Cole?

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1 minute ago, bmags said:

Is Nimmo really the "dream" or just a realistic upgrade?

Dream for a realistic / won’t break the bank option.  I honestly don’t think we can do much better than him via trade.  After him, you’re looking highly flawed but talented guys like Mazara & Polanco and one year rental types like Joc.  We simply don’t have the assets to acquire a more impactful player unless we’re prepared to trade from the Cease, Madrigal, Vaughn talent pool which we shouldn’t.  While Mookie would be the absolute dream, his acquisition cost and lack of control don’t make sense for us.  We aren’t far enough into the rebuild to take chances like that IMO.

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13 minutes ago, Thad Bosley said:

Steve Stone keeps insisting on Twitter that the fans will be “pleasantly surprised” with the offseason results, that the money will be spent, just not on Cole.

That leads me to believe it almost has to be the landing of “one of” the two selections you put forth, plus maybe some other surprise acquisition.  What else could it be if not Cole?

Agreed, not sure what else is could really be.  I mean technically Ozuna or Castlellanos would be bigger name free agents for RF, but my god would they be terrible fits given their defensive concerns / limitations.

I do think they’ll evaluate trade options for RF and could see Joc being positioned as that third big addition along with Grandal/Martinez and Wheeler/Bumgarner.  Would need to find a way to extend him, but he’d be an excellent fit and may not cost a ton given his lack of control beyond 2020.

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5 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Agreed, not sure what else is could really be.  I mean technically Ozuna or Castlellanos would be bigger name free agents for RF, but my god would they be terrible fits given their defensive concerns / limitations.

I do think they’ll evaluate trade options for RF and could see Joc being positioned as that third big addition along with Grandal/Martinez and Wheeler/Bumgarner.  Would need to find a way to extend him, but he’d be an excellent fit and may not cost a ton given his lack of control beyond 2020.

I think Joc would be absolutely worth trading for IF we can extend him. He's one of the better obtainable fits out there.

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4 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

I think Joc would be absolutely worth trading for IF we can extend him. He's one of the better obtainable fits out there.

I just don’t even know how to speculate on the price.  The rumor last offseason was Bummer, Fulmer, and a prospect like Laz Rivera.  Given he has one less year of control now, would something like Fry straight-up work?  Obviously he’s coming off a terrible year, but the strikeout stuff is still there and he’s got four years of control left (including two options).  We’d be selling low on Fry, but it’s something I could see definitely the Dodgers being interested in.

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23 hours ago, bmags said:

And colin mchugh / wood getting unlikely small contracts.

Wood is almost certainly going to take a 1 year pillow deal after this season.  

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Theoretically if you could sign Grandal and trade/extend Joc, you could be rocking out this lineup by 2021:

  1. Robert, CF
  2. Moncada, 3B#
  3. Jimenez, LF
  4. Pederson, RF*
  5. Abreu, DH
  6. Vaughn, 1B
  7. Grandal, C#
  8. Anderson, SS
  9. Madrigal, 2B

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3 minutes ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:

I do think Joc is a solid fit as well, but the Sox might be better off signing a 1 year stopgap like Calhoun for 2020 and then just sign Pederson in the 2020 offseason without giving up any prospects. Trading for a rental doesn't make much sense at this point.

It all depends on the cost.

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19 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Robert: Did you have a chance to see Micker Adolfo in Arizona? Do you think he can still unlock his massive tools if he stays healthy?
Keith Law: Yep, can still hit, with power, going to swing and miss but will walk some and hit enough HR to profile as a regular.

Not 100% about this off-season, but I found this response to be a good thing at the least.

I still think Adolfo is going to be a monster.  It may not happen for a few more years, but remain patient Sox fans.  He could develop into a star.  

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14 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I still think Adolfo is going to be a monster.  It may not happen for a few more years, but remain patient Sox fans.  He could develop into a star.  

His arm bouncing all the way back - which looks to be the case - is huge for Adolfo. He's a + defender with an elite arm. Pair that with 30-40 HR power, he could hit 240 and be a 4 WAR player.

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35 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Theoretically if you could sign Grandal and trade/extend Joc, you could be rocking out this lineup by 2021:

  1. Robert, CF
  2. Moncada, 3B#
  3. Jimenez, LF
  4. Pederson, RF*
  5. Abreu, DH
  6. Vaughn, 1B
  7. Grandal, C#
  8. Anderson, SS
  9. Madrigal, 2B

I love that lineup. I've always said that Anderson will be batting around 7th or 8th when we are really competitive. 

Trivia question:  How many teams in the history of MLB have had the first and second place finisher in the batting title race on the same team, and they were batting 8th and 9th?

Answer: One...the 2021 White Sox

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6 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

His arm bouncing all the way back - which looks to be the case - is huge for Adolfo. He's a + defender with an elite arm. Pair that with 30-40 HR power, he could hit 240 and be a 4 WAR player.

Explain what you mean by a plus defender.  Because in every element but arm, he’s most definitely not a plus defender out there.

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5 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Explain what you mean by a plus defender.  Because in every element but arm, he’s most definitely not a plus defender out there.

I've never read a single scouting report on Micker that didn't list + overall defender. He's got pretty good speed for his size, moves well, and has a great arm. Not enough defensive metrics for the MiLB but his scouting reports don't cite a - defensively anywhere. Maybe he's average in RF with an elite arm which would make him above average.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run

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1 hour ago, Thad Bosley said:

Steve Stone keeps insisting on Twitter that the fans will be “pleasantly surprised” with the offseason results, that the money will be spent, just not on Cole.

That leads me to believe it almost has to be the landing of “one of” the two selections you put forth, plus maybe some other surprise acquisition.  What else could it be if not Cole?

JDM for sure 

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16 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I've never read a single scouting report on Micker that didn't list + overall defender. He's got pretty good speed for his size, moves well, and has a great arm. Not enough defensive metrics for the MiLB but his scouting reports don't cite a - defensively anywhere. Maybe he's average in RF with an elite arm which would make him above average.

I’ve never read a scouting report that listed him as a plus defender outside of arm and Fangraphs (not the end all be all by any means) gave him a 40 grade on fielding.  I’m not ever suggesting he’s bad out there, but I don’t buy he’s plus outside of his arm.

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5 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’ve never read a scouting report that listed him as a plus defender outside of arm and Fangraphs (not the end all be all by any means) gave him a 40 grade on fielding.  I’m not ever suggesting he’s bad out there, but I don’t buy he’s plus outside of his arm.

Yeah I guess I'm just going off the fact that he's a real good athlete with nice speed for being 6'4. 

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14 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yeah I guess I'm just going off the fact that he's a real good athlete with nice speed for being 6'4. 

He’s really bulked up over the past few seasons and I think that’s taken away some of his athleticism / speed.  Again, not suggesting he’s a tank out there but he’s not the lanky 16 year with surprising speed we initially signed.

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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

His arm bouncing all the way back - which looks to be the case - is huge for Adolfo. He's a + defender with an elite arm. Pair that with 30-40 HR power, he could hit 240 and be a 4 WAR player.

Law was asked about Adolfo yesterday in chat. He's still in.

Quote

Robert: Did you have a chance to see Micker Adolfo in Arizona? Do you think he can still unlock his massive tools if he stays healthy?
Keith Law: Yep, can still hit, with power, going to swing and miss but will walk some and hit enough HR to profile as a regular.

 

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1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

He’s really bulked up over the past few seasons and I think that’s taken away some of his athleticism / speed.  Again, not suggesting he’s a tank out there but he’s not the lanky 16 year with surprising speed we initially signed.

I watched the most recent videos of the Micker and  read the reports of his AFL at bats. Unfortunately  the Micker looks like he has boxed out physically. He isn't Courtney Hawkins but he does look like he has the speed/athleticism to play outfield.  I admit I may be wrong because my impressions are only from available video.

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