bmags Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Especially with a struggling team, you have to do everything in your power to preserve the game. He saved it for later ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (flavum @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:40 PM) Here's the video of Robin and Alexei after the game. http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...0417-story.html Holy hell look at how awkward his interpreter is the guy is probably thinking he's going to get fired for translating that comment. and Robin's typical "ah shucks" routine with the media. f*** off dude. Own up to your error. Edited April 17, 2015 by chitownsportsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:32 PM) Please clarify your position for me. My take is that there was an organizational failure on this play. 1) The Sox broadcast didn't have the best angle of the tag. Why didn't they? 2) The Tigers broadcast had that angle. Did the Sox video crew have access to the Tigers feed and, if so, why weren't they looking at all possible angles to put Robin in the best position to succeed? 3) Even in light of the above, given score and situation, Robin still should have challenged because runner on 2nd with nobody out in a tie game in the bottom of the 9th merits making the umps take a look. Even if you are taking Robin's statement at face value, and the video crew told Robin Alexi definitively missed the tag, and Robin is excused from challenging the call, there is still a failure by the organization because the information relayed to Robin was wrong. Objectively, the White Sox had bad information that potentially cost them the game. My take, reading your arguments in this thread, is that you are arguing there wasn't anything the Sox could do. Is that a correct reading of your take on the play? My take is taking this out in Robin is wrong. He did what any of us would have done without access to replay, which he had none, and the information he received. As to the Tigers feed and all of that, I don't know if the White Sox have access to all of their angles, and as I posted if it is anything like the NBA, NY might not have the angle. I do believe both teams should have access to the same angle that would be used to determine challenges. I don't know if they do, and I don't think anyone here knows either. Ther are a lot of assumptions, but the fact is Robin has to rely on the replay people and they told him the tag was missed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Fans of other teams ripping Robin now on twitter. This is bad. I just hope it goes viral enough to where they have to make a change sooner rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:44 PM) My take is taking this out in Robin is wrong. He did what any of us would have done without access to replay, which he had none, and the information he received. As to the Tigers feed and all of that, I don't know if the White Sox have access to all of their angles, and as I posted if it is anything like the NBA, NY might not have the angle. I do believe both teams should have access to the same angle that would be used to determine challenges. I don't know if they do, and I don't think anyone here knows either. Ther are a lot of assumptions, but the fact is Robin has to rely on the replay people and they told him the tag was missed. No he did not. It's the 9th inning. There is zero harm to coming out and getting the challenge going on a close play. Even if he thought that the tag was missed he should have gotten the challenge started. Whatever the other deal was, that's the #1, unavoidable thing. A guy got 2nd in the 9th inning of a tie game and your SS thought he got him. You have the ability to ask for a replay. You don't even need to wait for the booth to decide this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:44 PM) My take is taking this out in Robin is wrong. He did what any of us would have done without access to replay, which he had none, and the information he received. As to the Tigers feed and all of that, I don't know if the White Sox have access to all of their angles, and as I posted if it is anything like the NBA, NY might not have the angle. I do believe both teams should have access to the same angle that would be used to determine challenges. I don't know if they do, and I don't think anyone here knows either. Ther are a lot of assumptions, but the fact is Robin has to rely on the replay people and they told him the tag was missed. I think you have to review it just like they do in football at that point. If its close which it obviously was at least close to the naked eye, in the 9th inning you have to challenge. No matter what they say in the booth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBatadatz Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Condor13 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 03:31 PM) KW has made this organization horrible. Ever since he got rid of the greatest player in a Sox uniform (The Big Hurt). I have felt for a few years now that the only way this organization gets turned around is for JR to throw KW out a window and let some other unsuspecting team to catch his ass. Teams are built from the top down bc the top makes all of the decisions. We NEED new blood to turn this train wreck around, but that ain't happening anytime soon. Just pray someone in that locker room gets tired of being the butt of all jokes and gets so pissed that he can light a fire under the other players ass and they wake up and play better. Bc the players are the only ones that can salvage this season bc management and coaches are not gonna do anything about it Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (shipps @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:47 PM) I think you have to review it just like they do in football at that point. If its close which it obviously was at least close to the naked eye, in the 9th inning you have to challenge. No matter what they say in the booth. You see it in FB all the time where coaches realize they have nothing to lose by challenging and once in awhile you get incredibly lucky (the Calvin Johnson play against the Bears for example) and the officials reverse it. HE HAD NOTHING TO LOSE. God if the neurons in his brain aren't connected in such a way to REALIZE THAT THEN HE'S f***ING UNFIT TO MANAGE. _____________ I agree Condor KW is JR's butt boy and what he wants he gets because 2005. I have no doubt that Hahn wanted to fire Robin but KW and JR over ruled him. Turn the reigns over to Hahn and GTFO out of the way JR and KW. Edited April 17, 2015 by chitownsportsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:41 PM) Rongey defending Robin now trying to blame Alexei for not "insisting" he made the play. Wow. What's Ramirez supposed to do it was obvious from his body language he knew he made the play. Did RV miss that? Rongey never ever blames Sox management cannot stand the guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:47 PM) No he did not. It's the 9th inning. There is zero harm to coming out and getting the challenge going on a close play. Even if he thought that the tag was missed he should have gotten the challenge started. Whatever the other deal was, that's the #1, unavoidable thing. A guy got 2nd in the 9th inning of a tie game and your SS thought he got him. You have the ability to ask for a replay. You don't even need to wait for the booth to decide this one. Alexei saying he tagged him didn't stop you from initially saying he missed the tag, and you looked at some replays, Robin didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:51 PM) Rongey never ever blames Sox management cannot stand the guy. Rongey, Hayes, Merkin...anything that involves an "opinion"...in one ear, out the other. They have nothing credible to say. Report the news, and leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:52 PM) Alexei saying he tagged him didn't stop you from initially saying he missed the tag, and you looked at some replays, Robin didn't. Lets say that the replay shown that he didnt tag him. What would be saying then? Boy Robin sure was smart, he saved us from _____________ there! No there was no reason to not give it a whirl for s***s and giggles even if it was a no tag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor13 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:03 PM) If Micah is going to sit against tough lefties he should be in AAA. If he's the future at 2B he's going to be a regular. Regulars play against tough matchups. It's why they are regulars. Of course, on the evidence, he's not a MLB ready 2B. So yea, not only is he not playing every day in the hopes he can improve against tough lefties, he's not in AAA either. Good job White Sox you've completely f***ed it up! Meanwhile all Sanchez does is outhit Micah in spring, play an elite 2B in his cup of coffee last year, and he gets sent to AAA. After Ramirez' comments today they might have a full on mutiny on their hands. Sanchez is much more limited on the d side then Micah, as well as a much much worse baserunner.and bunter. MICAH has made at least three plays that Sanchez or Bacon would have had ZERO chance of making. Sanchez would sit vs all tough righties so he is where he should, be in the minors. In fact there is nothing that Sanchez van do that Micah does not do better other then hitting vs top tier lefties. Based on your logic LaRoche needs to be sent back to the minors Chris Davis should be in the minors. Ryan Howard, Adam Dunn, Barry Bonds etc should all have never been promoted to the majors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:47 PM) No he did not. It's the 9th inning. There is zero harm to coming out and getting the challenge going on a close play. Even if he thought that the tag was missed he should have gotten the challenge started. Whatever the other deal was, that's the #1, unavoidable thing. A guy got 2nd in the 9th inning of a tie game and your SS thought he got him. You have the ability to ask for a replay. You don't even need to wait for the booth to decide this one. Alexei saying he tagged him didn't stop you from initially saying he missed the tag, and you looked at some replays, Robin didn't. It is the,replay guys' job. He even said if he got a maybe he would have challenged. Edited April 17, 2015 by Dick Allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (shipps @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:56 PM) Lets say that the replay shown that he didnt tag him. What would be saying then? Boy Robin sure was smart, he saved us from _____________ there! No there was no reason to not give it a whirl for s***s and giggles even if it was a no tag. If I had to guess, the opposite of what everyone else was saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 03:47 PM) I think he was safe, but yeah, the manager is pretty much supposed to challenge that. QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:52 PM) Alexei saying he tagged him didn't stop you from initially saying he missed the tag, and you looked at some replays, Robin didn't. That's me mid-inning, before I saw the version that Tony posted. I thought he'd have been called safe because I didn't see the clear replay, but that's exactly the play you're supposed to replay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:59 PM) If I had to guess, the opposite of what everyone else was saying. We'd be very angry at Alexei Ramirez for missing the tag. We'd then be angry at Robin for not walking the batter after the bunt to try to set up a possible game-saving double play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:01 PM) That's me mid-inning, before I saw the version that Tony posted. I thought he'd have been called safe because I didn't see the clear replay, but that's exactly the play you're supposed to replay. Aso if you didn't see the replay and the guys watching the replay told you he clearly missed the tag, you would have challenged it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 06:04 PM) Aso if you didn't see the replay and the guys watching the replay told you he clearly missed the tag, you would have challenged it? Yes. Easiest decision possible. No penalty whatsoever for being wrong, maybe even only a slight chance it gets overturned. No need to even wait for the guys upstairs on this one. It's the 9th inning and that's the possible winning run. Just get out and get the challenge started. Hell, the amount of time Robin waited around for news from upstairs was enough time for MLB to finish most of the replays in NY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:06 PM) Yes. Easiest decision possible. No penalty whatsoever for being wrong, maybe even only a slight chance it gets overturned. No need to even wait for the guys upstairs on this one. It's the 9th inning and that's the possible winning run. Just get out and get the challenge started. Hell, the amount of time Robin waited around for news from upstairs was enough time for MLB to finish most of the replays in NY. If he challenged and lost, then the Sox lost on another bad call they couldn't challenge, if it came out the replay guys told him the tag was clearly missed, Robin would get blasted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitoMB345 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Hi-def and with the ability to slow down: http://gfycat.com/BlushingQuarterlyChrysomelid he's out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 04:20 PM) If he challenged and lost, then the Sox lost on another bad call they couldn't challenge, if it came out the replay guys told him the tag was clearly missed, Robin would get blasted. Ventura bunted on the road earlier in the week on the road to ATTEMPT to tie. Now on the road hes playing for the potential 14th or 15th instead of trying to preserve a tie with his closer not out there in the 9th? And seriously, I bet he didnt take Iglesias as a credible offensivee threat because he was pretty terrible last year...so why not at least take his results for a nine game stretch this year into account....when youre hitting over .400 something has to be going right and its not just complete luck or an anomaly. Edited April 17, 2015 by caulfield12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettie4sox Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:34 PM) Ventura bunted on the road earlier in the week on the road to ATTEMPT to tie. Now on the road hes playing for the potential 14th or 15th instead of trying to preserve a tie with his closer not out there in the 9th? And seriously, I bet he didnt take Iglesias as a credible offensivee threat because he was pretty terrible last year...so why not at least take his results for a nine game stretch this year into account....when youre hitting over .400 something has to be going right and its not just complete luck or an anomaly. Eh Iglesias got his hit because the infield was drawn in. That's a routine groundout otherwise. Edited April 17, 2015 by pettie4sox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyGillis Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) Tiger fans are shocked that Ventura did nothing. From the Tigers message board: "beginning in the seventh inning, a Crew Chief may, in his sole discretion, conduct Replay Review upon his own initiative or upon the request of a Manager who has no remaining Manager Challenges. These Replay Reviews are subject to the following: A Club that has exhausted its Manager Challenges may request but cannot insist that the Crew Chief invoke his right to initiate Replay Review. Except in the case of potential home run calls, the Crew Chief shall not initiate Replay Review of any play or call if the requesting Manager has a Manager Challenge remaining." So even if Ventura thought there was a chance he might lose the challenge, if there was another close call, the ump probably would allow a second challenge. Absolutely amazing. Edited April 17, 2015 by OnlyGillis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 17, 2015 -> 05:20 PM) If he challenged and lost, then the Sox lost on another bad call they couldn't challenge, if it came out the replay guys told him the tag was clearly missed, Robin would get blasted. This is the worst, most twisted defense of a bad manager. If this is what you have to do to defend Robin, he should already be out the door. Edited April 17, 2015 by AustinIllini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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