CaliSoxFanViaSWside

Dear Mr Magee, I should probably do this in a PM but making definitive statement like "He will never settle in at .250 " comes off as arrogant . Now I know in your mind his history and stats tell you you're right with a high degree of certainty. Might I suggest that you say his stats and history "suggest" or "point towards " unsustainability. Also you might not care that you sound arrogant but since you revealed that you never played the game or correct me if I'm wrong , haven't followed baseball for very long it appears doubly arrogant and that why sometimes people mention those things to you about having never played the game. Just throwing yourself into modern stats doesn''t make you a predictor of the future. A little humility goes a long way when dealing with hardcore fans who really don't want to hear there is no hope for a member of their favorite team . Hope is all we have most of the time so let a few of us hope Tyler can be more than his stats and history "suggest " that he is.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Aug 5, 2014 -> 04:42 AM) Right greg, but he COULD have spent a lot more time, money, and trade chips on it to give it a better shot, but doing so would have been completely irresponsible because expensive bullpens are a waste of resources on bad teams. And what we had at the time was a BAD team with some new acquisitions that would hopefully work out. Now that most of those acquisitions have worked out, we have the core of a decent team, we have enough information to start pushing more chips into the middle. Those of you that are advocating a complete hail mary every year need to realize that that very rarely ever works out and that the cost of missing is that you end up like the Phillies, Cubs, or Astros. Hahn's plan is to be patient and do this right, and we're all going to be very happy about it pretty soon. You know Eminor these people we're debating this with are not simpletons they understand the concept that rebuilding takes patience and time. Did I want more spent coming into the season ? I sure did. I wanted Ellsbury ,but when I saw what he signed for I wasn't upset the Sox didn't get him Did Hahn want more? He sure did, he wanted Tanaka. Had they got Tanaka would they have spent a bit more on the bullpen afterwards ? I don't know .We will never know. But Tanaka and Ellbury are both the kind of contracts you're speaking of that screw things up for teams. Unfortunately that's the price you have to pay now in the game. The agents and the deep pockets owners have made sure its the rich who will always get richer and to get a superstar and really even just good players you have to pay for their declining years .Teams that try and do it another way often have long dry spells of failure like you mention. The Cubs ,Astros, Royals . Tampa Bay has had some success with keeping costs down and so has Oakland recently. Marlins won 2 WS (1997 and 2003) then completely and utterly destroyed their teams. Pirates can never get anything accomplished because they just don't have the cash flow coming in. The Sox ? Well attendance could be better, they don't have a huge TV contract bringing in huge amounts of cash like the Yankees, Boston, Seattle or the Dodgers.They don't have an ownership group that will spend irresponsibly like the Phillies and Detroit. There are 2 teams in the city and of the 2 the Sox are the ugly stepchild. The fans just won't show up because we're the lovable losers . Our fans demand a winner , screw fiscal responsibility and the rest of those lame excuses about rebuilding. Screw the fact that bullpen pieces are rarely considered core pieces and their performances fluctuate greatly from year to year. or that sometimes things can blow up in your face like injuries and unexpected bad years . Screw the fact Hahn just got Sale and Q and now Abreu it seems under great to pretty good contracts. Screw his acquisitions of Eaton and getting Gillaspie for practically nothing. Yet ,as evidenced in this thread, they throw tantrums like whiny little brats when they can't have it all every year. Waaa it's all Hahn's fault for trading Addison Reed . My suggestion : go be Red Sox or Yankees, Dodger fans if you expect every last dime to be spent every damn year. Hahn can't say that but I can.

QUOTE (gatnom @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 10:00 PM) I don't see anybody particularly doubting him per se, just people pointing out that saying Danish is a top 20 prospect is a bit extreme. As far as why Danish isn't higher ranked, I don't think he had too much hype coming out of high school (admittedly, most likely due to the reasons Jake points out), and he doesn't exactly have the loudest peripherals to really overcome the sort of confirmation bias on these lists. Didn't he have a 0 ERA his Sr. year ?

QUOTE (Andy the Clown @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 09:45 PM) Is it possible that we might not need a new catcher after all? Good Lord. We will if he goes back to wearing contacts

QUOTE (Andy the Clown @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 10:00 PM) Meh. Non-dominant relievers don't excite me. Do they have to wear black leather if they are dominant ?

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 09:57 PM) Simply put he didn't put out enough "horses" to cover up the lose of 2 key bullpen pieces and that's something you should expect from a team that just lost 99 games. And really, most teams in baseball don't have the horses to cover losing 2 key guys. Shouldn't ?

QUOTE (VAfan @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 08:20 PM) Love the backtrack. Nice! Wasn't a backtrack. Everything I said Ive said before. Stating Hahn is human isn't some big revelation.

QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 08:56 PM) I don't think flowers would approve of this @DanHayesCSN: Last week in Detroit, Flowers asked why so many people have asked about glasses and when I started to recite numbers asked me to stop. Yea saw that pretty funny but he did ask and we probably won't have to worry too much about him sustaining it either. But it's pretty cool while it lasts.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 09:03 PM) Nooooooo!!!! Tyler was gonna hit for the cycle!!! Yes no bullpen necessary !!!!!!!!

Wouldn't it be great if Tyler sustained it and the fans could wear Tyler Flowers googles like they do in Oakland with Sogard. Tyler Flowers Google's Giveaway Night.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 08:37 PM) Just realized that I kinda botched it all....you call them Sorcerers Spectacles....Will fix it in a sec I wasn't going to mention that since you obviously put a lot of effort into it on my behalf.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jul 29, 2014 -> 08:00 AM) It's a completely unsustainable .243, and it's also come along with a collapse in his power. If he produces the same whiff rates next year we should be looking at about a .200 hitter. Make that highly unsustainable .252 with an increase in his power since he's doubled his xtra base hits in 18 games.

Awesome !

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 08:27 PM) Hey Cali, go peep the Tyler Flowers thread. Very very good. You are the man !

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 08:11 PM) We can purchase half a dozen of these magical glasses and hand it out in the club house. Beckham gets a pair, Dunn's overdue for one, why not for ADA, Tank definitely needs a pair. And they ought to be upgrades over Belisario's hideous glasses. Ha I said that about that for BJ Upton after we steal him from the Braves for a bag of balls.

Just took a look at Flowers triple on Gameday and I think they missed it. I swear if you watch it very carefully in slo mo after it hit the top of the fence it hit the bottom rung of the metal railing. Doesn't that make it a HR since without the railing it goes over the yellow line ? http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/gameday/index.jsp?g...ay&c_id=mlb

QUOTE (VAfan @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 06:59 PM) Why is building a solid core of young position players and starting pitchers, AND having a plan for a competent bullpen MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE?? I guarantee that's NOT how Rick Hahn sees it. If he did -- if he had your approach -- he SHOULD be fired. The simple fact is the Sox could have fielded a much better bullpen without spending a lot more money. Rick Hahn made some very bad investments, and took far too much risk hoping that Nate Jones could step into the closing role and everyone else would fall in behind him. For that, he deserves the fair criticism I've raised here. Are you enjoying the Sox 2014 season???? I sure the hell am enjoying the season. Before it started I remember some poster wondering if he should get the Baseball package on DirecTV . I encouraged him to do so to watch the young core watch Abreu watch Sale watch Eaton and watch Avi. It'll be a delight and a disaster but very entertaining. That's how it is every year. Sometimes the delights outweigh the disasters and but most times the disasters outweigh the delights since nearly every season the Sox go home not winning the World Series.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:46 PM) We thought that the first month of the season too But doesn't this streak look a bit different than the early season one ? A lot more xtra base hits in this one.

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:45 PM) Tumbleweeds a double away from the cycle. He's back to being a Flower . No more Tumbleweeds or Weeds.

Wow Tyler wow Sorcerer's Specs . Double needed for the cycle. Piece of cake.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:25 PM) Here was the original question: "Is this bullpen Rick Hahn's fault?" The answer is obviously YES. To everyone who thinks he "couldn't" have fielded a better bullpen (which is frankly an absurd view) the answer is still YES. And I think Rick Hahn would stand up like a man, take responsibility for the bad choices he made, and agree. And most of his supporters never said he's infallible. In another thread I said he failed with potluck signees who could have had trade value but they all underperformed. I've chided SSk2 before about giving up on the season too early . Yes I want the Sox to contend every year. That doesn't mean I can't see the plan the Hahn is doing and I support what he's done and will continue to do . GM's make mistakes , they are human. If that was your point thank you Capt. Obvious I'm pretty sure we know that.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:03 PM) Much has been said here recently about the 2014 pitching staff. It needs help next year. Free Agency will be discussed in off season, but you can't count on that as a savior for next year. Even though most of Sox better pitching prospects are in lower minors (W-S on down) there are several at Charlotte and Birminghame who will probably be given serious consideration sometime in 2015. Alphabetically, they include Bassitt, Beck, Blough, Bucciferro, Casey, Fuentes, Recchia, Snodgrass, Vance. The following roster pitchers probably don't figure to be in the mix Belisario, Guerra, Jones, Lindstrom, Paulino, Rienzo, Surkamp, Thompson. I didn't include Rodon, only because he is still at W-S. I don't know where I'm going with this, just looking for some positive comments on Sox pitching next year. Sale and Q will still be here. You're welcome.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:17 PM) Not a good decision to put runners in motion with a 3 outcome king up. Both runners were going ? If so it was a hit and run But even if it was how the hell does Eaton only make it halfway to thrird ? You have to be out stealing making a real good attempt at stealing 3rd with Adam Dunn up even on a hit and run.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:14 PM) Dunn still sucks. Not sure why the runners were going Not even sure it was a hit and run . You'd think he'd be a lot closer to 3rd if it was.

QUOTE (Jake @ Aug 4, 2014 -> 07:04 PM) So how well does Tyler have to hit before we take him seriously? I suggested.270 a week ago but I'll take .260 if he hits more bombs. As hot as he's been maybe he can bat in the middle of the order for a while. Yea yea I know comfort zone yada yada.