TheFutureIsNear

Continue starting him at 2B? Correa is going to 3B. Eduardo Escobar is out of a job….and probably not good enough to warrant pursuing.

They would just add prospects. McCann is negative value and Escobar doesn’t have much value. I might be the most pro trade Liam here…but you’re way undervaluing him if you think McCann and Escobar is a good deal. Maybe the 2 catchers and Baty would be off the table, but we should be able to get at least 2 of the Mets top 15 prospects back in that deal

I brought it up before, but San Fran would be an interesting destination. Unless I’m missing something looking at their roster they don’t have a decent backup C option behind Bart and their DH spot also seems to be pretty wide open. Grandal could (in theory) be a good mentor for Bart and Kapler loves to platoon/play matchups so Grandal could easily see a decent amount of AB’s at C/1B/DH (most of their options seems to be RH). Sox could easily take back Tommy LaStella as a salary dump as he doesn’t seem to really have a roster spot after the Correa signing (they have Flores for Utl)

No, there is no one close to Jansen on the free agent market. And if there was they would be going for 12+M on a multi year deal. Omar Navarez just got 8 mil and hasn’t had a WRC+ above 100 in 3 years. Not even trying to be a dick…but what’s the point of holding onto a closer on a team that clearly isn’t good enough in most other areas? For the warm fuzzy feeling of comfort? Liam is about to be 34 and the Sox aren’t a World Series contender…what’s the plan? Hold on to him to continue closing meaningless games?

Not saying either are great players by any means, but we don’t have a 2B and it’s very questionable whether Grandal can catch any kind of significant amount anymore. Escobar and McCann would definitely fill rolls we likely aren’t going to spend $ on in free agency. If Hahn could get those 2 AND prospects we’ve reallocated bullpen $ to fill needs while also improving the future of the team. Something like Liam and Luery for McCann, Escobar, Mauricio, and Butto (or pick your 2 favorite Mets prospects not named Baty, Alvarez and Parada) works out $ wise for both clubs and gives the Sox minor league depth we desperately need. And I realize this may not line up with the front office is trying to do, just my opinion on what a pretty good move would be. I’m not a fan of clinging on to an older closer for a team that isn’t going to win a World Series. If Liam’s elbow issue gets worse there’s a possibility that the Sox paid a closer a bunch of $ to never even win a playoff series(still a strong possibility without injury). If you aren’t a legit WS contender then cash in on value while you can is my thought, but I could see why some wouldn’t want to

Whether or not he is realistic is 1 thing, but Alvarez was in the majors at the end of last year and at least showed power. He’d be a mid ‘23 addition at worst. And even tho he was just drafted I highly doubt Parada needs 2-3 years. Most highly touted college catchers move up fast. Seems like a guy you would start in AA this year and see how fast he can can progress. With the Sox development team maybe it takes a little longer, but I don’t think expecting him to contribute in ‘24 is unrealistic. But you are correct that it’s not a move a team looking to win a World Series this coming year would do…also not sure what moves the Sox are making that make a WS possible this year.

It doesn’t have to be cost cutting. There is a a 3rd option of reallocating that $ to fill other needs.

If it’s only 1 prospect coming back it has to be either Alvarez or Parada. The combo of power and ability to play middle infield is obviously intriguing with Mauricio, but no way we should be trading Hendricks for a prospect that refuses to walk and has a questionable hit tool.

They absolutely could…but trading 1 of your better hitters for a setup man and counting on a rookie in what is essentially a do or die WS year? Doesn’t make sense to me, but it is the Mets so who knows

Hard to see a Mets deal working honestly. Are they going to open up a hole in their lineup by trading McNeil to get a really expensive set-up man?…after already giving David Robertson 10mil to presumably fill that role. Escobar definitely works to fill our 2B hole, I’m just not sure how Escobar + prospects makes sense for us. Unless it’s Baty, but that would leave a hole for the Mets at 3B. Maybe a 3 team deal, but good luck coming up with that proposal.

Which is why I said we need to add arms for AAA depth. Doesn’t change the fact that another legit MLB starter isn’t signing to pitch out of our bullpen as an emergency option. Search for another Cueto like arm…obviously easier said than done, but as you said, we have room to take multiple shots.

What starting pitcher is signing with the Sox to be the 6th starter? And how do we fit a 6th starter on the 26 man roster while keeping them stretched out to start in a pinch? We should absolutely be looking at minor league depth/NRI deals, but I don’t see how anyone can logically think we are signing a proven, healthy MLB starter right now.

I see he played CF in 2022, but is Duvall still capable of holding down CF for any kind of extended time? That would be the only thing that worries me as we are another Robert injury away from having Luery/Billy Hamilton as our starting CF.

I would even do Kelly if the Mets threw in 5/6 mil to make McCann’s contract more palatable next year. Kelly could at least be useful for the Mets, no one wants Leury on their 26 man roster. Paying McCann $12M next year should be a non-starter for any deal though. Mets #2 prospect is a 23 year old 3B Brett Batty that mashed in AA/AAA and got some time in the majors last year. I wouldn’t be surprised if they want him playing sooner rather than later and makes losing Escobar easier. And Grandal isn’t a bad DH insurance for them incase Vogelbach forgets how to hit again. Mets would be adding more $ to their payroll tho and the cost of paying luxury tax for Grandal/Kelly might not be worth it for minimal (if any) upgrades. Sox would save enough $ to be able to replace Kelly with another MRP tho.

Might as well say- “The Mets and White Sox are speaking about the sport of baseball to other human beings”

Yeah you can’t sign a LH corner OF’er to a 1 year prove it deal just to block Colas. Is Conforto even that much more of a sure thing over Colas in 2023? Growing pains for Colas vs rust for Conforto. Conforto is probably the safer bet, but I wouldn’t say by a wide margin. Sign a RH corner OF’er that can play multiple positions as an insurance/depth/platoon option behind Colas.

I acknowledged the volatility of Díaz and when you include his down 2021 year it’s going to skew things. The Mets clearly paid for the ‘18, ‘20, and ‘22 version of Díaz. And if he continues that I think there’s a fairly large gap between him and Liam. I also don’t know if you can use the Mets and their spending as a fair evaluation…they clearly committed to overspending on Díaz as soon they started playing those trumpets. Was any other team going to pay Díaz 100M? And the part we can agree to disagree on is projecting Liam over the next 2 years. I personally don’t feel all that confident in a 34 year old with a bad elbow going forward, but I could easily be proven wrong there

Nope. I’m aware that site sucks. I already explained my stance. Cheap catcher with a lot of surplus value for a soon to be 34 year old closer with a sketchy elbow making 29 mil over the next 2 years. I’m waiting for a convincing counter argument. It also probably comes down to how you value the prospects. I don’t care where they rank in our system because we have no one, Popeye and Kelly aren’t valuable pieces to give up in my option.

I don’t think Liam is comparable to what Díaz did last year. If you want to argue that Díaz may be more volatile, sure, but if Díaz is at his best again it’s not all that close between him and Liam.

A stud defensive catcher than can hit 20+ HR’s doesn’t project to 4 WAR over a 500 AB season? And I’m referencing Fangraphs WAR. I think Travis d’Araund is a great comp who was good for 3.9 WAR in 426 AB’s and hit .268/.319/.472 with 18 HR’s

Ok didn’t realize that. But unless I am missing something we are still talking about a trade for a C that will give us 4 WAR (conservatively) per season for a total of 8/9 mil over 2 years for a closer that will give you 2 WAR per year for 29 mil over 2 years…and the closer also has a questionable elbow. I don’t see the fair value 1 for 1 personally, but sure, I’d absolutely do the deal.

2 years of extreme surplus value of a cheap all-star level catcher for 1 year of Liam seems fair to you? I could (hopefully) be wrong, but that doesn’t seem right to me. Not like Kelly is much of a prospect anyway…

Trade Hendriks, Jose Rodriguez and Jared Kelly for Danny Jansen- Blue Jays trade 1 of their C’s to solidify their bullpen with a proven closer and add prospects to gear up for a mid-season trade to put them over the top. Obviously Jansen fits perfectly for the Sox and the trade saves 10mil Trade Grandal for Tommy LaStella- Giants have Joey Bart but no clear backup C or clear cut DH option. LaStella was a bust for them and has no path for playing time after recent signings. Grandal acts as a mentor for Bart and gets semi-regular AB’s at C/DH/1B. Sox save 7 mil and get a LH 2B platoon/utility guy while unloading Grandal after the Jansen trade Trade Burger for a young, cost controlled RP with a live arm and options- I think it will be hard for Burger to ever see playing time here as RH 1B/DH and more options in the pen will help after trading Hendriks. With saved 17mil from trades- Sign Michael Fulmer and Wil Myers. Fulmer fills a bullpen gap as a solid MRP and Myers is RH backup to both corner OF spots (possible platoon with Colas) to ensure that Eloy doesn’t see the field and also backups up 1B and DH. TA Benintendi Robert Eloy Colas Jansen Vaughn Yoan Sosa/LaStella Bench- Myers, Luery, Seby SP-Cease, Lynn, Gio, Kopech, Clevinger CL- Lopez Setup- Graveman/Bummer MRP- Fulmer, Kelly, Diekman, Lambert/Burger Trade Long- Avila

I think this is the year Robert is healthy and puts it all together. I don’t believe Granda is as bad at hitting a baseball as he was last year. But in order for him to have any value to us he needs to catch on a pretty regular basis…I have very little confidence he can still do that.

I get it…but who are we getting that is going to be a difference making 2B? I’m all for exploring a Lowe trade with TB, but that might be about the only option and it’s very unlikely. Like it or not, if this team is going anywhere carried by all-stars it’s going to be TA, Robert, and Eloy (with Benintendi, Vaughn, and Yoan also playing well).