12 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

What is Jerry thinking right now?  Dude is 86 years old and watching the team flop despite a franchise high payroll.  At some point he’s got to run out of the patience.  The question is who does he blame for this mess?  Hahn?  Tony?  The players?

Personally, I think he’s so infatuated with Tony there is zero chance he would ever consider canning him.  That leaves a front office shakeup or simply pointing fingers at the players through Stone Pony.  My guess is probably the latter and we all suffer at the hands of La Russa’s epically bad managing.

Maybe they fire a coach as a scapegoat, but I simply can’t see JR firing TLR.  Not now, not ever.  

Hahn's personnel decisions are more to blame for the state of the Sox than anything.  Every move he made since the start of last year has been a disaster.  He should be gone before Tony.

21 minutes ago, Green Line said:

Hahn's personnel decisions are more to blame for the state of the Sox than anything.  Every move he made since the start of last year has been a disaster.  He should be gone before Tony.

But they were all TLR's!

Hahn was forced at gunpoint into them...clearly under duress from rewatching his press conferences.

39 minutes ago, Green Line said:

Hahn's personnel decisions are more to blame for the state of the Sox than anything.  Every move he made since the start of last year has been a disaster.  He should be gone before Tony.

Leury was 100% a Tony signing

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

What is Jerry thinking right now?  Dude is 86 years old and watching the team flop despite a franchise high payroll.  At some point he’s got to run out of the patience.  The question is who does he blame for this mess?  Hahn?  Tony?  The players?

Personally, I think he’s so infatuated with Tony there is zero chance he would ever consider canning him.  That leaves a front office shakeup or simply pointing fingers at the players through Stone Pony.  My guess is probably the latter and we all suffer at the hands of La Russa’s epically bad managing.

He’s thinking how he can shed payroll. He’s thinking, “why can’t these players play like winners under the great Hall of Fame baseball person?”

I am terrified what this team might look like come July if they are not in the division lead and below .500 - and it starts with Giolito.

Edited April 27, 20223 yr by CWSpalehoseCWS

3 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

He’s thinking how he can shed payroll. He’s thinking, “why can’t these players play like winners under the great Hall of Fame baseball person?”

I am terrified what this team might look like come July if they are not in the division lead and below .500 - and it starts with Giolito.

terrified? shed some of the high salary guys for prospects with something to prove and i'm down

4 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

terrified? shed some of the high salary guys for prospects with something to prove and i'm down

So a rebuild. Again. No thanks.

5 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

He’s thinking how he can shed payroll. He’s thinking, “why can’t these players play like winners under the great Hall of Fame baseball person?”

I am terrified what this team might look like come July if they are not in the division lead and below .500 - and it starts with Giolito.

If they are below 500 come July, then you top down blow it up.  You get a new GM and do it all over again.  There is no possible way you let Hahn and company fuck this up again.

But let's see where they are in a couple weeks.  A lot can change by then.

25 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

terrified? shed some of the high salary guys for prospects with something to prove and i'm down

Undecided, depends on offers/interest:  Bummer

Start exploring potential market/s for beginning in early June if no turnaround or managerial change:  Anderson, Giolito, Kopech (control through 2025, would have to be absolutely blown away with an offer)

Salary dumps to regain financial flexibility and replenish AA/AAA quality depth (plug n play guys like the Olson trade to ATL):  

Grandal, Hendriks, Keuchel (almost all dead money at this point), Abreu, Pollock, Lynn (depends how he looks upon return), Graveman, Kelly

Imagine having this much talent and deciding it is time to tear it all down again, and rebuild. Instead of, you know, firing the incompetent fucking asshole in the dugout who handicaps the team every single game, and maximizing your talent. 

What a bunch of fucking idiots Sox fans are. Jesus Christ. 

 

11 hours ago, chw42 said:

lol TLR definitely got a talking to. Who knows if he took it seriously or not. 

He was probably dozing off throughout.

5 hours ago, fathom said:

Tim Anderson has more errors than Leury and Harrison have hits combined

Jason should use this on Sox Math.

2 hours ago, Paulie4Pres said:

Imagine having this much talent and deciding it is time to tear it all down again, and rebuild. Instead of, you know, firing the incompetent fucking asshole in the dugout who handicaps the team every single game, and maximizing your talent. 

What a bunch of fucking idiots Sox fans are. Jesus Christ. 

 

Do you really see JR doubling down if they pull a Twins 2021 and trading Giolito (equivalent of Jose Berrios), extending Cease or Kopech and pulling a Carlos Correa level superstar out of the FA hat???  Not to mention trading Hendriks for a reliever and starter?

(Note:  Correa has been lousy so far, like Lindor in NY last season.)

5 hours ago, ron883 said:

Leury was 100% a Tony signing

They also specifically told us that Joe Kelly was a LaRussa thing.

 

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

They also specifically told us that Joe Kelly was a LaRussa thing.

 

Harrison feels more like LaRussa, Pollock hard to say but common theme is preference for NL guys.  Even VV was mostly associated with Phillies.  Cueto also a lot more time in the NL Central then West.

3 hours ago, Paulie4Pres said:

Imagine having this much talent and deciding it is time to tear it all down again, and rebuild. Instead of, you know, firing the incompetent fucking asshole in the dugout who handicaps the team every single game, and maximizing your talent. 

What a bunch of fucking idiots Sox fans are. Jesus Christ. 

 

It's not the Sox fans that are idiots.  We want the incompetent manager canned so the talent on the field can actually do what they can do.  TLR will not be fired, even if Hahn wants to fire him.  Hahn will be gone first, but even that isn't happening.  We're looking down the barrel of a truly worst case scenario where a rebuild (that was actually pretty exciting) is going for naught because of some bad signings to fill crucial holes and horrible on-field managing.  We are literally bracing ourselves for, at a minimum, a retooling that sets the team back another year or two.  And if the same sleepy, Leury-loving manager is in the dugout after this year, we're really fucked.

If Tony is the class act JR thinks he is...I would not be surprised if a resignation is coming shortly.   Something like Tony saying the team needs a new voice.

5 hours ago, joesaiditstrue said:

terrified? shed some of the high salary guys for prospects with something to prove and i'm down

I wouldn't trust Hahn and the FO to get that right based on their track record.

9 minutes ago, Chimpton said:

I wouldn't trust Hahn and the FO to get that right based on their track record.

Just don’t trade with anyone in the State of California.

Or the Indians/Twins/Tigers.

7 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

What is Jerry thinking right now?  Dude is 86 years old and watching the team flop despite a franchise high payroll.  At some point he’s got to run out of the patience.  The question is who does he blame for this mess?  Hahn?  Tony?  The players?

Personally, I think he’s so infatuated with Tony there is zero chance he would ever consider canning him.  That leaves a front office shakeup or simply pointing fingers at the players through Stone Pony.  My guess is probably the latter and we all suffer at the hands of La Russa’s epically bad managing.

While Tony should shoulder some of the blame,  because he's almost universally disliked by posters here, he shields the players from criticism. 

Leadoff double and we leave the guy stranded at second. Multiple errors. So many walks. Guys aren't playing well right now. 

I believe that overall baseball managers receive too much credit when players are playing well and too much blame when players are sucking up the place. 

 

19 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Just don’t trade with anyone in the State of California.

Or the Indians/Twins/Tigers.

What about the Cubs?

49 minutes ago, Texsox said:

While Tony should shoulder some of the blame,  because he's almost universally disliked by posters here, he shields the players from criticism. 

Leadoff double and we leave the guy stranded at second. Multiple errors. So many walks. Guys aren't playing well right now. 

I believe that overall baseball managers receive too much credit when players are playing well and too much blame when players are sucking up the place. 

 

Last night wasn’t on Tony. But several of the 8 were. 

1 hour ago, poppysox said:

If Tony is the class act JR thinks he is...I would not be surprised if a resignation is coming shortly.   Something like Tony saying the team needs a new voice.

This… and if not, someone needs to be whispering in his ear. Year 2 was always going to be more difficult.

JR doesn't like firing people, and he still felt bad the 1986 sacking of LaRussa. That is also why the Guillen departure in 2011 turned into a side show, and why he couldn't pull the trigger on Ventura. 

We can only hope things will improve as injured players return. But as much as I didn't like the LaRussa hiring, he can't be blamed for everything.  Perhaps. we will have to face up to the fact that this team isn't as good as we thought. We have 140 games to find out.

2 hours ago, NWINFan said:

JR doesn't like firing people, and he still felt bad the 1986 sacking of LaRussa. That is also why the Guillen departure in 2011 turned into a side show, and why he couldn't pull the trigger on Ventura. 

We can only hope things will improve as injured players return. But as much as I didn't like the LaRussa hiring, he can't be blamed for everything.  Perhaps. we will have to face up to the fact that this team isn't as good as we thought. We have 140 games to find out.

You are right, it isn't all his fault. The problem is this is a JR hire to try to , in his mind, right a wrong, and it was just wrong. They ignored his DUIs. They ignored he was out of the dugout for 11 years. They ignored the disaster in AZ, the last time he was given any baseball decision power. They ignored they had a shot at AJ Hinch, who many considered the gold standard for today's manager, or a shot at just about anyone they wanted. They bring in a has been, who admittedly wouldnt have taken the job if it meant he would be taken out of the HOF, and the Sox are now stuck with a guy who isn't going to outmanage anyone. That is a problem when the games mean a ton. 

Many speculate he has a hand in most if not all personnel moves, and it may be true. Why? Did they not see what happpened to the DBacks? Tony did mention he tried to get Valasquez when he was there.

 

I am quite sure if Renteria was not fired, the Sox would have won the division last year. He probably would have spent the first round against Houston hyperventilating bowled over, but the result would have been the same. I am not so certain if he was still here, they would currently be on an 8 game losing streak. They didn't upgrade the manager when they had a shot at just about anyone they wanted.

The guy got way too much credit for putting Rickey Henderson in LF, Canseco in FR, starting Dave Stewart and having Eck close. I did the same thing when I was 8 years old playing stratomatic.

Edited April 27, 20223 yr by Dick Allen