Highland Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 The Bears are who we thought they were. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 minute ago, fathom said: I can’t imagine how much money Penix can make tomorrow night with a great game I think if he repeats his performance from the semi finals against a much better defense in Michigan, there's a good chance he's a lock at QB4 in this draft. Which might be a top 15 pick. He might be the closest comp to Stroud in this draft. Where he was criticized for his inability to improvise and throw under pressure and on the run, but proved otherwise on the big stage in the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 4 minutes ago, chw42 said: I think if he repeats his performance from the semi finals against a much better defense in Michigan, there's a good chance he's a lock at QB4 in this draft. Which might be a top 15 pick. He might be the closest comp to Stroud in this draft. Where he was criticized for his inability to improvise and throw under pressure and on the run, but proved otherwise on the big stage in the playoffs. Agreed and agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 58 minutes ago, CentralChamps21 said: The gap between Stroud and Fields is not as big as the gap between the Texans OL and the Bears OL. I'm not saying Fields is ever going to be an MVP, but he's good enough to win if surrounded with the right talent and coaching. I don't see any QB in this draft who's any better than 50/50 to be better than Fields, and drafting a QB at #1 means not getting a LT, so I say give Fields one more year. Trade the #1 pick to the Patriots. They'll probably be the worst team next year and you get the #1 pick a 3rd year in a row. Then if Fields hasn't gotten it done with the better OL, you pull the trigger then. The Texans lineup has been a plug and play lineup most of the year. They had Tytus Howard playing out of position and then he got hurt early in the year. They lost Kenyon Green for the full season and he was supposed to be one of their starting guards. They also struggled mightily with the run the whole year. If you think Houston’s line is solid, then either Stroud or their coaching is also a big factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 7 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: The Texans lineup has been a plug and play lineup most of the year. They had Tytus Howard playing out of position and then he got hurt early in the year. They lost Kenyon Green for the full season and he was supposed to be one of their starting guards. They also struggled mightily with the run the whole year. If you think Houston’s line is solid, then either Stroud or their coaching is also a big factor. The Texans were 3-13-1 last year. They are now 10-7 and in the playoffs. It’s pretty obvious who the difference maker is. Stroud did in his rookie season what Fields couldn’t do in 3 seasons. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 That went pretty much how I said it would. Packers did what they did at the beginning of the year - take away the runs and make Fields beat them through the air. Get pressure on him. And the result was 9 points, 0 TDs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 14 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: The Texans were 3-13-1 last year. They are now 10-7 and in the playoffs. It’s pretty obvious who the difference maker is. Stroud did in his rookie season what Fields couldn’t do in 3 seasons. Well there’s been a few changes. In defense, Houston was the worst in the NFL against the run in ‘22, they’re top 10 against the run this year. Stroud is a big part, but they also did a good job with the coaching staff and with the defense. Much like the Bears, they also had a metric ton of dead cap space in 2022 that they cleared out, allowing them to build much better depth this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) 1 hour ago, CentralChamps21 said: I watched all of their game last night and parts of some other games. Their OL is pretty solid. Getting rid of the ball quicker is also easier when you have receivers who can get open. Again, not saying Fields is ever going to be an MVP, but Brock Purdy, Joe Flacco and Mason Rudolph are quarterbacking playoff teams. Fix the OL and WR positions and if Fields doesn't get it done with the improved team, then move on after next year. Keeping Fields could be a 1 year mistake. Drafting a new QB could be a 4-5 year mistake. 1 hour ago, Quin said: Honestly, beg Harbaugh to be the coach. If he thinks the haul for #1 is worth it instead of Caleb or Maye, go for it. Maybe it gets you MHJ and one of the tackles. But draft a QB in the third or second. It was just amazing seeing so many Packers wide receivers open in the midfield vs. the Bears. And of course the O-Line getting obliterated. But if a new coach thinks that situation isn't tenable, you have to move on. Just pray for Caleb/Maye's life. If the goal for Poles is to build sustainable success, I would much rather them build around Fields this next year. Trade out of the first position, get MHJ. Then draft another tackle. Get a center in the second or third round. If Fields doesn’t do it next season, then draft a quarterback in 2025. If they really want to take Williams or Maye, then they have to shore up that starting offensive line and wide receiver core and fast. There also has to be a market for Justin Fields when teams can just get a quarterback in the draft. We will see what they get for him if he gets dealt and where he goes. I also think Eberflus has to go if they are to pick a QB and they have to bring in a Ben Johnson or offensive minded coach. So I’m wondering if Eberflus is gone if that is an indicator of what is to come. Edited January 8 by The Beast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 hour ago, bmags said: https://x.com/robertkschmitz/status/1744156188453790138?s=46&t=9lkBcVJmwvxFpyVi5DNtCg Pretty much. If we build the perfect team around fields we could indeed be a top 14 offense! My comment to that user on Twitter. If Williams or Maye are drafted, are they getting a year under their belt first or are they expected to put up Mahomes like numbers in the first year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 20 minutes ago, The Beast said: My comment to that user on Twitter. If Williams or Maye are drafted, are they getting a year under their belt first or are they expected to put up Mahomes like numbers in the first year? They’re getting a year most likely, but it’ll be hard for them to not beat Fields’s numbers unless they’re straight bust territory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 https://chicago.suntimes.com/bears/2024/1/7/24029318/justin-fields-vs-jordan-love-for-next-10-years-not-even-close-bears-packers-ryan-poles-matt-eberflus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 9 minutes ago, almagest said: They’re getting a year most likely, but it’ll be hard for them to not beat Fields’s numbers unless they’re straight bust territory. Exactly. If any drafted QB can perform better than Fields (which is not a tall order), it will have been a success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 4 hours ago, almagest said: I don't think Fields is it either and a good QB is so hard to find that not taking shots at 1-1 two years in a row is hard to justify. I'm ambivalent about Flus but if there's a chance out there to take a solid upgrade they should do it just based on the 3 historic level losses when leading late. I don't think this game has much bearing on the outcome for Fields unless he absolutely lights it up. Then it might help him. If the Bears win that might help Eberflus though. Fields isn’t a multiplier. He does not make others better. He isn’t the qb who turns lemons into lemonade with his arm. Yes he can make big plays, but flat out he isn’t good enough. Today was open and shut. Against good zone defenses he has zero chance. His weakness is glaring and as much as I like his work ethic, I Hope Bears are moving on. They need to strive for better. not saying it has to be at 1-1 but they need to take a qb early. If they want to roll with fields too and create a real competition fine by me, but you can’t stay status quo at qb. I also need Bears to make a move for a new coach cause Flus is like Fields - just ok. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 8 hours ago, bmags said: Eh, I disagree. After the panthers traded for #1 Stroud became the favorite in the betting markets. Young retook that closer to the draft, but even day of there was heat about Levi’s/Richardson at 1. People thought Reich preferred bigger QBs, and Young’s height was a big deal. Bears brass also aren’t supposed to just take consensus picks as their options, so yes, they did pass on Stroud. And Richardson. And Young. The bears also had a qb who was a year younger with massive physical tools who you could squint and see a superstar. This year I think you would have to be hit in the head a few times before you could quint and say with a straight face Justin can be a top 5 qb. I hope Bears had Stroud top on their board but just saw the value in sticking with Fields and taking a haul as the smarter play than. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 42 minutes ago, The Beast said: If the goal for Poles is to build sustainable success, I would much rather them build around Fields this next year. Trade out of the first position, get MHJ. Then draft another tackle. Get a center in the second or third round. If Fields doesn’t do it next season, then draft a quarterback in 2025. If they really want to take Williams or Maye, then they have to shore up that starting offensive line and wide receiver core and fast. There also has to be a market for Justin Fields when teams can just get a quarterback in the draft. We will see what they get for him if he gets dealt and where he goes. I also think Eberflus has to go if they are to pick a QB and they have to bring in a Ben Johnson or offensive minded coach. So I’m wondering if Eberflus is gone if that is an indicator of what is to come. I don’t know how these things go together. Let’s remove Fields first season from the equation, let’s just go with the last two years. What has he shown you to tell you he is going to make a major leap, and he’ll lead this team over the Packers and other quality teams? The Bears can’t be ok with “ok” They have a super unique opportunity with the No. 1 pick, and you say “Well if it doesn’t work out after next year, go get a QB.” They won’t have a better opportunity than this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 minute ago, Tony said: I don’t know how these things go together. Let’s remove Fields first season from the equation, let’s just go with the last two years. What has he shown you to tell you he is going to make a major leap, and he’ll lead this team over the Packers and other quality teams? The Bears can’t be ok with “ok” They have a super unique opportunity with the No. 1 pick, and you say “Well if it doesn’t work out after next year, go get a QB.” They won’t have a better opportunity than this. Especially with how awful the QB class is next year 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 minute ago, Tony said: I don’t know how these things go together. Let’s remove Fields first season from the equation, let’s just go with the last two years. What has he shown you to tell you he is going to make a major leap, and he’ll lead this team over the Packers and other quality teams? The Bears can’t be ok with “ok” They have a super unique opportunity with the No. 1 pick, and you say “Well if it doesn’t work out after next year, go get a QB.” They won’t have a better opportunity than this. I’m just not sure that even if they draft Williams or Maye without the supporting cast I think they need, that the Bears will get to that next level. They still have several holes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 2 minutes ago, fathom said: Especially with how awful the QB class is next year How do we already know that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 3 hours ago, Tony said: If anything, this game was a really good microcosm of the problems with the Bears. - Fields has not had enough games where he is the main reason they won the game. They aren't losing today because of Fields, but he's done nothing to help them - Has been absolutely no pash rush today, like even a little bit. That's a talent and scheme issue, and both need to be seriously addressed - The WR core still sucks. There needs to be another option out there outside of DJ, there just isn't a ton of talent for Fields to throw to - The offensive line has been BAD. You've got two legit starters in Jenkins and Wright, everyone else is just a body, and multiple guys on the OL are plain bad Well written - to me it is simple. Fields has 35 plus starts - I can’t think of any where he had a dominant 4th quarter. Any. Maybe I’m missing something but that is damn near incredible. Point blank - he isn’t elite. He’s meh but I get why if I were another team who didn’t have a top 5 pick I would be willing to take a chance on him and trade a 2nd rounder. Cause physically his tools and personality are awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 3 hours ago, Quin said: Sweet Jesus, I feel bad for Caleb Williams if he's playing behind this line Why you can draft Caleb, sign a center and draft a tackle at 9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 2 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said: Well written - to me it is simple. Fields has 35 plus starts - I can’t think of any where he had a dominant 4th quarter. Any. Maybe I’m missing something but that is damn near incredible. Point blank - he isn’t elite. He’s meh but I get why if I were another team who didn’t have a top 5 pick I would be willing to take a chance on him and trade a 2nd rounder. Cause physically his tools and personality are awesome. I like Justin. I think his development has been stunted with the Bears many times. Probably has a different career trajectory with a well-run franchise. But to your point, the reality is we've had 35 starts with him and have a very good idea of who he is as a Chicago Bear. They are going to need more out of the QB position if they want to win playoff games. I am not an avid watcher of college football, if Drake Maye was walking down the street next to me I wouldn't have a clue. But rookie QB's can be successful in Year 1, as we have seen multiple times. Drafting someone at 1 doesn't mean they are punting on the season. And they would be absolutely be investing into the team for the long term. Keeping Fields doesn't do that, because by trading out of No. 1 and keeping Fields, you still haven't found your franchise QB and they're just kicking the can down the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Tony said: I like Justin. I think his development has been stunted with the Bears many times. Probably has a different career trajectory with a well-run franchise. But to your point, the reality is we've had 35 starts with him and have a very good idea of who he is as a Chicago Bear. They are going to need more out of the QB position if they want to win playoff games. I am not an avid watcher of college football, if Drake Maye was walking down the street next to me I wouldn't have a clue. But rookie QB's can be successful in Year 1, as we have seen multiple times. Drafting someone at 1 doesn't mean they are punting on the season. And they would be absolutely be investing into the team for the long term. Keeping Fields doesn't do that, because by trading out of No. 1 and keeping Fields, you still haven't found your franchise QB and they're just kicking the can down the road. Is it fair to say that if the Bears draft Williams or Maye, that fans should expect them to be elite by the end of the first year or second, especially with how Williams has been billed as generational? Edited January 8 by The Beast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 2 minutes ago, Tony said: I like Justin. I think his development has been stunted with the Bears many times. Probably has a different career trajectory with a well-run franchise. But to your point, the reality is we've had 35 starts with him and have a very good idea of who he is as a Chicago Bear. They are going to need more out of the QB position if they want to win playoff games. I am not an avid watcher of college football, if Drake Maye was walking down the street next to me I wouldn't have a clue. But rookie QB's can be successful in Year 1, as we have seen multiple times. Drafting someone at 1 doesn't mean they are punting on the season. And they would be absolutely be investing into the team for the long term. Keeping Fields doesn't do that, because by trading out of No. 1 and keeping Fields, you still haven't found your franchise QB and they're just kicking the can down the road. I hear you on fields could have been better elsewhere. With that said - he is showing the exact weakness he showed at OSU and the reason he ended up falling in the draft. He can’t process and read defenses. He can make all the throws and he has incredible ability to run - but he doesn’t throw guys open. Period. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 hour ago, The Beast said: If the goal for Poles is to build sustainable success, I would much rather them build around Fields this next year. Trade out of the first position, get MHJ. Then draft another tackle. Get a center in the second or third round. If Fields doesn’t do it next season, then draft a quarterback in 2025. If they really want to take Williams or Maye, then they have to shore up that starting offensive line and wide receiver core and fast. There also has to be a market for Justin Fields when teams can just get a quarterback in the draft. We will see what they get for him if he gets dealt and where he goes. I also think Eberflus has to go if they are to pick a QB and they have to bring in a Ben Johnson or offensive minded coach. So I’m wondering if Eberflus is gone if that is an indicator of what is to come. The best way to have sustained success is to have a QB who makes everyone else around them better and can win games on his own. This is not Fields. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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