Getz: "We are... building from the ground, up"

[WhiteSox2023]

8 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

I think I generally stay away from the drive-bys, and people like you who are frustrated, and for the most part, talk baseball. When Caulfield or WS2023 do their BS, yeah, I'll get sucked in and argue. I believe that's the point of their behavior. 

I come here because it's probably the best gathering of rumors and sports talk/blogs/etc. I ignore what I can, but the negative stuff builds up, and I respond sometimes. 

I call a spade a spade.  Go look back at my posts once Crochet was traded.  I gave Getz a ton of credit for a great trade.  But my praise is few and far between because the majority of Getz’s moves have been poor.

[southsider2k5]

27 minutes ago, Bonerko4Konerko said:

It's not a lie if you believe it.

Which is a whole different problem and one that would also deserve an explanation to fans.

[Kyyle23]

31 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Here's a paraphrasing of what you're responding to:

I didn't recall people being "duped", here, by the press conference. 

TRU responded, complaining about the hiring process and the "waste a year" comment.

I agreed with him on hiring process, but I said I moved on, and now want the team to succeed. 

You come in and accuse me of being mad. There isn't any anger in my words. People have said that they're hyper-critical because of the hiring. That's not about observing the actual process of what's going on. 

"Ruining my life" is you engaging in hyperbole, and deciding that you want to attack somebody. I believe I'm participating in a discussion about Getz rebuilding from the ground up. Surprise!! That's in the name of the string. So I think I'm good. 

Anyway...

A rebuild does not start with a world series victory. 

I'm not mad at people saying they don't see it. There are obvious results. You just saw two of our minor league teams compete in their league's championships this year. You saw the Sox rise to a top 5 farm system. You saw the Sox clock in with the 2 top left-handed pitching prospects in the game, #1 taken late in the 1st round, and developed. No, those aren't major league wins and losses. But judging the overhaul of an organization in it's first year by the major league product is mistaken. Those statements don't get me angry, I just figure those are people not really engaged in what the Sox are doing as an organization, and will complain about anything.

Again, screaming about "dumpster-diving" a guy off of waivers, then tying it back to a sentence from a press conference 18 months ago has nothing to do with criticism of how Getz is overhauling the organization. 

While I thank you profusely for the cliff notes, I know what I was responding to.    You clearly aren’t getting angry at statements none of us see any of that

[caulfield12]

Well at least we have cornered the market on LHSP and catching...so there's that.

Not sure how Quero fits now/exactly.

He might be good enough to DH or play first...for the Sox.  Just not sure about a legit playoff contender.

Maybe he's worth more to another organization seeking a catcher.  With Teel now being ahead of Salas at Pipeline...he definitely won't be the one traded as Getz is getting a lot on him and Braden being meaningful contributors.

[WestEddy]

42 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

While I thank you profusely for the cliff notes, I know what I was responding to.    You clearly aren’t getting angry at statements none of us see any of that

So we're in agreement, then. God go with you. 

[WestEddy]

33 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Well at least we have cornered the market on LHSP and catching...so there's that.

Not sure how Quero fits now/exactly.

He might be good enough to DH or play first...for the Sox.  Just not sure about a legit playoff contender.

Maybe he's worth more to another organization seeking a catcher.  With Teel now being ahead of Salas at Pipeline...he definitely won't be the one traded as Getz is getting a lot on him and Braden being meaningful contributors.

Or maybe having 2 catchers who have appeared in 54 AAA games between them represents the beginning of "depth" at a key position. I just get confused reading your posts, in that depth is key in baseball, considering guys can move off of CF, SS and C to play other positions, and injuries and flameouts always happen. 

Hahn's folly was planning on one guy for each position, then somebody's grandmother at each level after that. 

[caulfield12]

19 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Or maybe having 2 catchers who have appeared in 54 AAA games between them represents the beginning of "depth" at a key position. I just get confused reading your posts, in that depth is key in baseball, considering guys can move off of CF, SS and C to play other positions, and injuries and flameouts always happen. 

Hahn's folly was planning on one guy for each position, then somebody's grandmother at each level after that. 

Well, when we don't have any position prospects that project at 2 fWAR or higher right now...maybe we do need 3-5 potential guys at every position like we currently have for 3B and 2B.

There's depth...and then there's quality depth, so that remains to be seen with a very fluid in field situation.

 

At any rate, we shall see what they end up doing with Quero.

Unfortunately the White Sox usually work from the "outside in"... rather than taking SS and CFers and allocating them across the diamond to the corners.  We take 1B DH 3B (Burger/Ramos)...and try to put them in the outfield (or at 2B), like Vaughn/Sheets as well.  And now trying to make a SS in Meidroth out of a 2B/3B.

Edited January 24 by caulfield12

[WhiteSox2023]

6 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Well, when we don't have any position prospects that project at 2 fWAR or higher right now...maybe we do need 3-5 potential guys at every position like we currently have for 3B and 2B.

There's depth...and then there's quality depth, so that remains to be seen with a very fluid infield.

 

At any rate, we shall see what they end up doing with Quero.

Unfortunately the White Sox usually work from the "outside in"... rather than taking SS and CFers and allocating them across the diamond to the corners.

That’s when Jerry steps in and gives Getzy the nod to sign a superstar free agent for $500+ million.  😏

[WestEddy]

50 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Well, when we don't have any position prospects that project at 2 fWAR or higher right now...maybe we do need 3-5 potential guys at every position like we currently have for 3B and 2B.

There's depth...and then there's quality depth, so that remains to be seen with a very fluid in field situation.

 

At any rate, we shall see what they end up doing with Quero.

Unfortunately the White Sox usually work from the "outside in"... rather than taking SS and CFers and allocating them across the diamond to the corners.  We take 1B DH 3B (Burger/Ramos)...and try to put them in the outfield (or at 2B), like Vaughn/Sheets as well.  And now trying to make a SS in Meidroth out of a 2B/3B.

Yes we do. Quero and Teel project as average major leaguers (50 FV) and C. Monty projects as 55 FV, slightly above average. 

Yes, it's good to have multiple layers of good players at multiple positions. You keep saying it like it's folly to have depth. I understand you have to constantly portray everything in a bad light or else you'll be branded as "pro-Getz" (shudder), but minor league depth is literally the entire point of a tiered minor league system. 

Yes, under the ex-GM, the ex-amateur scouting director did, indeed, draft a 2B, 3B and 1B with their top draft picks. The current amateur scouting director has drafted 7 pitchers, 3 SS's and a 3B in the first 2 rounds of the last 5 drafts. Vaughn was 6 drafts ago, and Sheets was 9. Meidroth played SS all of last season.

[caulfield12]

41 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Yes we do. Quero and Teel project as average major leaguers (50 FV) and C. Monty projects as 55 FV, slightly above average. 

Yes, it's good to have multiple layers of good players at multiple positions. You keep saying it like it's folly to have depth. I understand you have to constantly portray everything in a bad light or else you'll be branded as "pro-Getz" (shudder), but minor league depth is literally the entire point of a tiered minor league system. 

Yes, under the ex-GM, the ex-amateur scouting director did, indeed, draft a 2B, 3B and 1B with their top draft picks. The current amateur scouting director has drafted 7 pitchers, 3 SS's and a 3B in the first 2 rounds of the last 5 drafts. Vaughn was 6 drafts ago, and Sheets was 9. Meidroth played SS all of last season.

FV doesn't necessarily correspond exactly with fWAR...catchers usually don't amass massive numbers since many only get 100 games.

[nrockway]

7 hours ago, Tony said:

It's amazing how much damage Jerry caused from a PR perspective with his comments about "not wanting to waste a year"

And while there are MANY things to be frustrated about regarding this organization, their continued lack of media training and strategy has always been maddening to me. 

To your point, they could have done themselves a lot of favors by coming out and saying "Listen, we had people here that quite frankly we're probably here too long. We can't do anything about that now, they're gone, and this isn't about putting a fresh coat of paint on things, this is about tearing it down to the studs and starting over. And I know Sox fans aren't going to love hearing that, I know the pain the fan base suffered through a rebuild that didn't result in what everyone wanted, but this organization needs an entirely new approach or we're going to all suffer similar results, and that's not acceptable to anyone. It's going to be painful, it's going to take time, but I am so committed to doing things the RIGHT way to build something that will have sustainable, long lasting success. It's all I care about."

You say that out of the gate, you buy yourself A LOT of good will. But they went...a different route. And it's on THEM for that, not the fans. 

Daytime Emmy kinda post. I think it’s a good one. But you sure committed to the theoretical quote. 

[Leonard Zelig]

I don’t know, seems like they’re at least a couple feet below ground.  

[WhiteSox2023]

4 minutes ago, Leonard Zelig said:

I don’t know, seems like they’re at least a couple feet below ground.  

Perhaps six feet under?

[Tony]

3 hours ago, nrockway said:

Daytime Emmy kinda post. I think it’s a good one. But you sure committed to the theoretical quote. 

I think you’re just a little upset I’m better at this than a “professional” organization 

[Texsox]

Minor point, more about denotation and connotation of words. 

Getz is unqualified to, for example, study the adaptations of terrestrial and marine life to extreme environments. He does have qualifications to be the GM of a MLB team. He is not extremely well qualified, he may not be the best person for the job, but he is qualified. Just like most everyone here is extremely well qualified to judge his performance. 

 

 

[Kyyle23]

1 hour ago, Texsox said:

Minor point, more about denotation and connotation of words. 

Getz is unqualified to, for example, study the adaptations of terrestrial and marine life to extreme environments. He does have qualifications to be the GM of a MLB team. He is not extremely well qualified, he may not be the best person for the job, but he is qualified. Just like most everyone here is extremely well qualified to judge his performance. 

 

 

I don’t agree Tex.  Just because someone says it is so, does not make it true. You or Jerry

[Highland]

The problem I have with the JR style of rebuiding is he feels he has to strip the team to the bare bones in the process. Tanking is absurd and now team had the worst season in MLB history.  In the late 1990s, the Sox could have brought up young players without that stupid White Flag Trade. I don't expect a contender for a while, but there is no excuse for a 121-loss season. And now it looks like another 100-loss season is on the way.

[caulfield12]

28 minutes ago, Highland said:

The problem I have with the JR style of rebuiding is he feels he has to strip the team to the bare bones in the process. Tanking is absurd and now team had the worst season in MLB history.  In the late 1990s, the Sox could have brought up young players without that stupid White Flag Trade. I don't expect a contender for a while, but there is no excuse for a 121-loss season. And now it looks like another 100-loss season is on the way.

Even if they hit on all their prospects...Detroit Cleveland have almost the same level of MiLB talent, Minnesota has two potential superstars and incoming new ownership and the Royals have Witt Jr. already extended.

[WhiteSox2023]

2 hours ago, Texsox said:

Minor point, more about denotation and connotation of words. 

Getz is unqualified to, for example, study the adaptations of terrestrial and marine life to extreme environments. He does have qualifications to be the GM of a MLB team. He is not extremely well qualified, he may not be the best person for the job, but he is qualified. Just like most everyone here is extremely well qualified to judge his performance. 

 

 

He didn’t even need to interview for his promotion to GM from assistant GM.  And his performance during his previous role as director of player development is questionable.

[Chick Mercedes]

19 hours ago, Bonerko4Konerko said:

Build from the ground up isn't singular to the ML roster. 

I know Paddy is gone. But is the actual approach any different? Genuinely asking. They just got done again purging the ML roster to import talent as the means to building up the farm. What is being done so that they do not have to repeat this cycle and build technique?

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, Chick Mercedes said:

I know Paddy is gone. But is the actual approach any different? Genuinely asking. They just got done again purging the ML roster to import talent as the means to building up the farm. What is being done so that they do not have to repeat this cycle and build technique?

Especially since pretty much all of our dev staff is the same.

[Tnetennba]

22 hours ago, Bonerko4Konerko said:

Build from the ground up isn't singular to the ML roster. 

 

What, in his brief tenure as GM, has instilled such confidence that he is or has started building a foundation in the org, 40 man roster or otherwise? The Cease trade? The Fedde/Kopech trade? A few new FO names that look good on paper but have no track record of success in their roles?

 

[Texsox]

8 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

I don’t agree Tex.  Just because someone says it is so, does not make it true. You or Jerry

How are you defining qualified? 

[Texsox]

23 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

He didn’t even need to interview for his promotion to GM from assistant GM.  And his performance during his previous role as director of player development is questionable.

Agreed. I'm not arguing that he should have the job. I'm not arguing he's highly qualified. I'm not arguing he's done a good job. I'm not arguing he's should stay. f*** the guy. He's a pathetic loser and I think we all know he won't turn this around. 

One area I'm qualified to speak about are word definitions and linguistics. I've spent a lot of time studying those areas. I have a  Masters in Literature and teach English. 

Is being an assistant a reasonable qualification to be a GM? Would you disagree with a  team why would be interviewing anyone that doesn't have front office experience? In any organization being an assistant is a qualification to be the manager. 

I would have set the bar much hire than being an assistant GM in a failing organization. 

I've been doing a lot of technical writing the past couple of months and word choice has been dominating my thoughts. My apologies for starting a semantic discussion on the nuances between poorly qualified and unqualified on a baseball message board. 

[Y2Jimmy0]

On 1/24/2025 at 12:58 PM, Tnetennba said:

Getz's signings last winter certainly weren't "build from the ground up" moves. It was pretty clear that Getz thought some vets and some defense would have them competitive in the division. Or at least better than the 101 loss team he took over.

It was always a 100 loss team. When Cease was traded, we said on the FutureSox podcast that it might be a 50 win team. Nobody thought they'd go 41-101 but I mean, 50-112 isn't much different.