Zack Collins agrees to deal with White Sox

[bmags]

.450 OBP?? Last I saw his OBP was .538....

 

You know, that's what I thought it was but figured I was wrong.

[Dam8610]

Has he been assigned yet?

[Jose Abreu]

Sox website still lists him as unsigned.

[Y2Jimmy0]

Sox website still lists him as unsigned.

 

 

He has agreed to terms. I bet he's at The Cell tonight or tomorrow and then off to Winston Salem.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Has he been assigned yet?

 

Probably at least a week away until he gets in a game. Hostetler wanted him to catch his breath a bit before picking up a bat again.

[Bob Sacamano]

Probably at least a week away until he gets in a game. Hostetler wanted him to catch his breath a bit before picking up a bat again.

 

I respect it.

[Whisox05]

White Sox top draft pick Zack Collins officially signs. He's here tonight, will meet with media on Saturday.

https://twitter.com/scottmerkin/status/746515572897251328

[Whisox05]

Okay, Zack Collins. We see you. 🙌 https://t.co/nsAiMzZsvq

https://twitter.com/whitesox/status/746730461074984960

 

Taking batting practice

[Dunt]

I'm not sure it happens, but wouldn't it be fun for the Sox to just live with Collins defense next year and add him and a guy like Encarncion to DH. That lineup would have so much firepower.

 

Anderson SS

Eaton RF

Abreu 1B

Encarnacion DH

Collins C

Frazier 3B

Cabrera LF

Lawrie 2B

Jackson/May/Engel? CF

 

The potential of that is scary

[caulfield12]

When's the last time a collegiate catcher jumped from the draft to the majors the following season?

 

Just curious. Charles Johnson with the Marlins, maybe? I think he also played at Univ of Miami if I recall correctly.

 

I think it would be mistake, though, primarily because all of the mental aspects of catching are going to have a completely negative effect on his hitting if he's just totally overwhelmed. Do you really want to take a college catcher whose future position isn't even 100% clear yet and throw him into the fire of another "all in" season?

 

You seemingly owe him the rest of this season, the entire offseason, spring training and probably 2-3 months next year in the minors.

 

Of course, if he just completely lights up Winston-Salem and then Birmingham in August, you can THINK about giving him some more tutoring/mentoring time in Chicago in September. That would be invaluable for him.

 

Then probably the Arizona Fall League as well.

 

It might almost make just as much sense to have him be the DH for the Sox next year...if they're really hoping to rush to Chicago in 2017. Of course, the obvious problem there is you've wasted a year of development time in terms of honing his catching craft.

 

Not an easy position to be in. Someone like Wilson Ramos will get a HUGE contract because of the dearth of catching on the market...perhaps the same with Matt Wieters if he can stay healthy this year.

Edited June 27, 2016 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

I'm not sure it happens, but wouldn't it be fun for the Sox to just live with Collins defense next year and add him and a guy like Encarncion to DH. That lineup would have so much firepower.

 

Anderson SS

Eaton RF

Abreu 1B

Encarnacion DH

Collins C

Frazier 3B

Cabrera LF

Lawrie 2B

Jackson/May/Engel? CF

 

The potential of that is scary

 

Considering his age, but also past production (which is no guarantee of future production for 30+ players)....what contract would you offer Encarnacion that would be enticing enough for him to leave Toronto (I'm assuming they will end up keeping 1 of him or Bautista, but not losing both).

[Bigsoxhurt35]

I'm not sure it happens, but wouldn't it be fun for the Sox to just live with Collins defense next year and add him and a guy like Encarncion to DH. That lineup would have so much firepower.

 

Anderson SS

Eaton RF

Abreu 1B

Encarnacion DH

Collins C

Frazier 3B

Cabrera LF

Lawrie 2B

Jackson/May/Engel? CF

 

The potential of that is scary

 

 

Seems like Engel is probably another year from being ready. He's been much better at AA since brought back there.

 

I'd love to add an Encarnacion to this lineup

[gosoxgo2005]

Considering his age, but also past production (which is no guarantee of future production for 30+ players)....what contract would you offer Encarnacion that would be enticing enough for him to leave Toronto (I'm assuming they will end up keeping 1 of him or Bautista, but not losing both).

 

 

I'd offer him whatever it took for him to play for the White Sox, which is probably 5 years, 150+ million. Get him signed through the 2020 season when Sale and Co's contracts are up and live with the 1-2 years of dead weight at the end of it.

 

Now, this will never in a billion years happen, not with Reinsdorf at the helm.

[Quin]

I'd offer him whatever it took for him to play for the White Sox, which is probably 5 years, 150+ million. Get him signed through the 2020 season when Sale and Co's contracts are up and live with the 1-2 years of dead weight at the end of it.

 

Now, this will never in a billion years happen, not with Reinsdorf at the helm.

 

Well that contract just isn't responsible

[gosoxgo2005]

Well that contract just isn't responsible

 

why not? Because you'd have a 4-5 win player in the "win now" window that the team has set?

 

They haven't been able to develop their own talent, so they have to buy it. Sale doesn't count, he wasn't developed. Anderson will probably be a good player, chances are he won't be a great player. After that, bone dry.

 

Since they can't draft and/or develop their own players they have to buy them. And for a player as good as Encarnacion, $150ish million is the going rate. So unless you're willing to live with cheaper/older/washed up options a la Austin Jackson (who is a fine player) and more mediocrity, then you are forced to sign players to longer deals knowing you may have a few bad years at the end of them.

 

What's "irresponsible" is continued organizational half measures

[Quin]

why not? Because you'd have a 4-5 win player in the "win now" window that the team has set?

 

They haven't been able to develop their own talent, so they have to buy it. Sale doesn't count, he wasn't developed. Anderson will probably be a good player, chances are he won't be a great player. After that, bone dry.

 

Since they can't draft and/or develop their own players they have to buy them. And for a player as good as Encarnacion, $150ish million is the going rate. So unless you're willing to live with cheaper/older/washed up options a la Austin Jackson (who is a fine player) and more mediocrity, then you are forced to sign players to longer deals knowing you may have a few bad years at the end of them.

 

What's "irresponsible" is continued organizational half measures

 

Austin Jackson is four years younger than Encarnocion, who will be 34 at the beginning of this monstrous contract proposal you have.

 

You're maybe getting one good year from that deal before it cripples your team.

 

[Quin]

And just for reference, Mike Trout got 6 years/144M.

[gosoxgo2005]

And just for reference, Mike Trout got 6 years/144M.

 

Encarnacion is also wildly better than Jackson.

 

Trout was extended while still arb eligible and wasn't eligible for free agency when he was extended. He will be 29 when his deal is up and he'll probably exceed $300MM with relative ease in his next deal, so that point you made is moot

 

The Sox aren't winning with scabs like Austin Jackson on 1 year, low cost deals. Encarnacion at 34-36 will be a better player than Austin Jackson at 30-32. If you don't agree then I don't know what to say

[Quin]

What is it with posters here and moving goal posts?

[lasttriptotulsa]

why not? Because you'd have a 4-5 win player in the "win now" window that the team has set?

 

They haven't been able to develop their own talent, so they have to buy it. Sale doesn't count, he wasn't developed. Anderson will probably be a good player, chances are he won't be a great player. After that, bone dry.

 

Since they can't draft and/or develop their own players they have to buy them. And for a player as good as Encarnacion, $150ish million is the going rate. So unless you're willing to live with cheaper/older/washed up options a la Austin Jackson (who is a fine player) and more mediocrity, then you are forced to sign players to longer deals knowing you may have a few bad years at the end of them.

 

What's "irresponsible" is continued organizational half measures

 

Encarnacion has not had one 5 win season in his career and has only had three 4 win seasons out his 12. He'll be in his mid '30s at the start of that contract and will more than likely be a 3.5-4 win player the next couple years and even lower towards the end of that ridiculous contract you suggest. His value is hurt even more by the fact that he would be a DH with the Sox. There is not one single position player making $30 million this year and you suggest the Sox should pay that to Edwin Encarnacion? Not a chance in hell he gets $30 million per year.

[gosoxgo2005]

Encarnacion has not had one 5 win season in his career and has only had three 4 win seasons out his 12. He'll be in his mid '30s at the start of that contract and will more than likely be a 3.5-4 win player the next couple years and even lower towards the end of that ridiculous contract you suggest. His value is hurt even more by the fact that he would be a DH with the Sox. There is not one single position player making $30 million this year and you suggest the Sox should pay that to Edwin Encarnacion? Not a chance in hell he gets $30 million per year.

 

 

I said 4-5 win player, meaning between 4 and 5 wins. Which he's done 3 of 4 years and is likely on his way to another one this year.

 

I was just also throwing X amount of money out there. What I'm saying is that the Sox need to cut the bull s*** half measure-scab-piece together rosters and sign the best possible free agent. If all that inhibits them from doing that is money, then f*** them. I don't care if it's Reddick, Encarnacion, or a trade for Bruce. MAKE IT HAPPEN. If not, then sell off anyone and everyone use players that other organizations have drafted and developed to be competitive in 2019-20 or so.

[caulfield12]

I was going to say $60 million for 3 years is the most I would possibly offer Encarnacion, and even that seems $5-10 million too high.

 

Somehow, Encarnacion without the "protection" of 3-4 other dominant hitters surrounding him in TOR turns into Cory Snyder and another contract albatross hung around Hahn's neck.

 

They're much better off piecing things together with Bruce or Carlos Beltran at that position (for now). Bruce is really good, you can THINK about picking up his 2017 option...and we probably (in Sept) need to give Coats/Hayes/Delmonico more of a look to see if any of them have the stuff to be counted upon.

[lasttriptotulsa]

I said 4-5 win player, meaning between 4 and 5 wins. Which he's done 3 of 4 years and is likely on his way to another one this year.

 

I was just also throwing X amount of money out there. What I'm saying is that the Sox need to cut the bull s*** half measure-scab-piece together rosters and sign the best possible free agent. If all that inhibits them from doing that is money, then f*** them. I don't care if it's Reddick, Encarnacion, or a trade for Bruce. MAKE IT HAPPEN. If not, then sell off anyone and everyone use players that other organizations have drafted and developed to be competitive in 2019-20 or so.

 

The Sox have made attempts to sign the best free agents. By many reports they were in on Upton, Cespedes and Gordon this past offseason. Had LaRoche retired earlier I wouldn't have been surprised if they upped their offers and landed one of them. They even reportedly offered Gordon more than the Royals. The prior year they signed the top closer on the market and signed one of the top OFs available. Before that they had one of the highest offers for Tanaka and also signed Abreu to at the time, the largest contract ever given to an international free agent. They are willing to spend money on the right players but if those players don't want to go to Chicago what are they supposed to do? What they are not willing to do is spend $30 million a year on a bat only player entering his mid '30s. Would I love Encarnacion on this team as a DH? Absolutely. Do I want any part of him at $30 million or even anything over $20 million? Not a snowball's chance in hell.

[gosoxgo2005]

The Sox have made attempts to sign the best free agents. By many reports they were in on Upton, Cespedes and Gordon this past offseason. Had LaRoche retired earlier I wouldn't have been surprised if they upped their offers and landed one of them. They even reportedly offered Gordon more than the Royals. The prior year they signed the top closer on the market and signed one of the top OFs available. Before that they had one of the highest offers for Tanaka and also signed Abreu to at the time, the largest contract ever given to an international free agent. They are willing to spend money on the right players but if those players don't want to go to Chicago what are they supposed to do? What they are not willing to do is spend $30 million a year on a bat only player entering his mid '30s. Would I love Encarnacion on this team as a DH? Absolutely. Do I want any part of him at $30 million or even anything over $20 million? Not a snowball's chance in hell.

 

 

Point taken, but if it comes down to overpaying for a Cespedes/Encarnacion type player or signing an Austin Jackson type player for peanuts and getting peanuts in production, I'm overpaying for those 2-3 good years all day. I'm not a financial whiz, and again, 150MM was the first arbitrary number that popped in my head. If a player of his caliber says "I want this and I'll sign with you", then you match that offer RIGHT NOW in my opinion. If this was a rebuilding team I'd say hell no, but it's a team that's in desperation mode and desperate times call for desperate measures.

 

What it boils down to for me is that they have to get to the playoffs by 2019. After that everyone will be on the backend of their careers. They'll be lousy after then anyways, so who cares if they have bad money on the books? Sale/Q/Eaton/Abreu will all be on the wrong side of 30 and not as valuable as they are now.

 

So, again, go big or go home. By then Reinsdorf will be 85ish anyways, so he shouldn't give a s*** about money.

[YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES!]

I'd give Encarnacion $100+ million. Why? Because it isn't my money.