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Indians removing Chief Wahoo

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QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:04 PM)
It's no flaming spear being thrown into the ground while riding bare-back on a horse like Florida State, but they did research and based it off of the dances of plain indians, right?

 

The dance was created by a bunch of former boy scouts without any input from Native Americans. That makes it "based on a true story." It doesn't make it authentic...

 

Without getting into a tangent, that was a huge problem with the Chief. I distinctly remember getting a program at a game in the 90s that told me the dance was authentic. When the university is peddling a false narrative, it makes it very difficult to obtain allies from the other side of the debate...

 

 

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Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians.

 

Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target.

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QUOTE (GoSox05 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 08:59 PM)
One thing I never understood about teams holding on to these weird old racist names and logos based on Native Americans. There are so many cool names to go with.

 

 

Cleveland Spiders was a really cool name. That would be bad ass if they changed to that now. I saw some of the alternate logos people did for the Redskins, some really cool ones.

The Spiders would really be good. The Cleveland Spiders. Wow. You have something here. Send some tweets to their media.

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QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:46 PM)
The dance was created by a bunch of former boy scouts without any input from Native Americans. That makes it "based on a true story." It doesn't make it authentic...

 

Without getting into a tangent, that was a huge problem with the Chief. I distinctly remember getting a program at a game in the 90s that told me the dance was authentic. When the university is peddling a false narrative, it makes it very difficult to obtain allies from the other side of the debate...

 

If it wasn't for that dance, the Chief logo might still be around. I thought the halftime dance was awesome as a student years ago, but yeah, it was probably time to retire it. I still wear the logo, I don't see a problem with it.

 

My biggest annoyance is that FSU can do all those "traditions" because the Seminole tribe is still around. Meanwhile Illini were a tribe in the area, but since they are not around anymore, it's a trouble point.

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QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM)
Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians.

 

Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target.

I guess I’m missing the point here. Are you suggesting that referring to a Native American as an “American Indian” would be offensive? Maybe I’m not informed on the issue, but my understanding is a vast portion of the world back then was considered part of “India”. Regardless, the Cleveland Indians aren’t based on modern day Native Americans but Indian tribes that existed in the early days of America. So calling them the “Cleveland Native Americans” really does not make any sense.

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When our kids grow up and see what we've done, they're going to ask how we can bear the sight of our own faces in the mirror, knowing that we passively let this tragedy occur. This is truly a sad day.

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The FDR "correction" will occur about the same time that the Japanese admit to what they did in Nanjing, the Bataan Death March, etc.

 

We all know that there was a large element of racism, the fact that German-Americans were not similarly rounded up and placed in internment camps, but there's at least some evidence out there that Japanese working at Pearl Harbor were part of the attack planning and execution.

 

Should everyone ELSE in the Western US have suffered due to the actions of maybe 10? That's a question for the historians to discuss and decide.

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QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM)
Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians.

 

Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target.

 

 

National Museum of the American Indian

 

What is the correct terminology: American Indian, Indian, Native American, or Native?

 

All of these terms are acceptable. The consensus, however, is that whenever possible, Native people prefer to be called by their specific tribal name. In the United States, Native American has been widely used but is falling out of favor with some groups, and the terms American Indian or indigenous American are preferred by many Native people.

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QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM)
Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians.

 

Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target.

American Indian is actually the preferred term for a lot of indigenous groups in the US. They use First Peoples a lot in Canada, not sure about Central and South America, but here American Indian is perfectly acceptable.

 

e: thoroughly beaten by Leonard!

Edited by StrangeSox

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QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 04:58 PM)
It wasn't authentic...

According to the group that ran it and various articles it was. That was part of the defense of it. That it wasn't a caricature or made up, it was authentic.

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QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 09:34 PM)
American Indian is actually the preferred term for a lot of indigenous groups in the US. They use First Peoples a lot in Canada, not sure about Central and South America, but here American Indian is perfectly acceptable.

 

e: thoroughly beaten by Leonard!

In the lacrosse world where the Native Americans are dominant they want to be referred to as the Iroqouis nation, as Leonard said.

 

as a matter of fact they cannot participate in any World Cup tournament outside north america because they do not have passports. No other countries recognize them as an Independent nation and they have no passports.

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QUOTE (greg775 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 08:12 PM)
The Spiders would really be good. The Cleveland Spiders. Wow. You have something here. Send some tweets to their media.

 

GAY! Oops a non political correct comment. Queer sports names just like the Wizards. I'm done with this thread. I am part Cherokee. It's not the end of the world what is being done in Cleveland. Maybe our team should be called the Sox too.

 

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QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 07:30 PM)
I guess I’m missing the point here. Are you suggesting that referring to a Native American as an “American Indian” would be offensive? Maybe I’m not informed on the issue, but my understanding is a vast portion of the world back then was considered part of “India”. Regardless, the Cleveland Indians aren’t based on modern day Native Americans but Indian tribes that existed in the early days of America. So calling them the “Cleveland Native Americans” really does not make any sense.

 

 

QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 08:36 PM)

 

 

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 09:34 PM)
American Indian is actually the preferred term for a lot of indigenous groups in the US. They use First Peoples a lot in Canada, not sure about Central and South America, but here American Indian is perfectly acceptable.

 

e: thoroughly beaten by Leonard!

 

My point is that the word "Indian" is only associated with Native Americans because Columbus thought he was in India and thus called them Indians at first. The term stuck through time. In my opinion, the word "Indian" should only be used in the context of the country of India, and not Native Americans. Not about being offensive, just a matter of accuracy

 

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QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM)
Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians.

 

Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target.

 

Its only a 500 year old mistake. No biggie.

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Manfred also made sure to note that Tiffany has 1/64th Cherokee ancestry, so the costume is basically celebrating her own heritage if you think about it.

 

:lol:

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Would anyone had noticed if they did this but didn't announce it or put out a press release?

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QUOTE (Brian @ Jan 31, 2018 -> 10:19 PM)
Would anyone had noticed if they did this but didn't announce it or put out a press release?

That is a fantastic post. Now that I think about it, they should have not even put out a press release. Just don't use Chief Wahoo and move on. Excellent take.

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yes people of course would notice, chief wahoo has started to be phased out of the past few years and people noticed that too.

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QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Jan 31, 2018 -> 12:12 AM)
GAY! Oops a non political correct comment. Queer sports names just like the Wizards. I'm done with this thread. I am part Cherokee. It's not the end of the world what is being done in Cleveland. Maybe our team should be called the Sox too.

 

Wat

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