Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
greg775

George Floyd Thread

Recommended Posts

The looting and destruction seems to have slowed down significantly thankfully. My area (east Lakeview) remained relatively untouched. Hope others managed to avoid all the madness. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Texsox said:

I've told the story here before but it was life changing for me. Back during one of the Bulls championship season playoff games at the original stadium we arrived early for a Sunday afternoon game. We got an easy out at our usual lot facing the street and the high rises across the street. The weather was perfect and there were dozens of kids playing in the courtyard at the apartments. I believe that's Robert Taylor Homes.

 

The Robert Taylor Homes were much farther south. Across from the Sox park.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Iwritecode said:

 

The Robert Taylor Homes were much farther south. Across from the Sox park.

He's probably thinking of the Henry Horner homes. This was before my time, but I believe there were still occupied when Chicago stadium was still standing. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Iwritecode said:

 

The Robert Taylor Homes were much farther south. Across from the Sox park.

Henry Horner? 

Let's play match the stadium to the housing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Henry Horner? 

Let's play match the stadium to the housing.

That's probably right. 

I just remember people always talking about the Robert Taylor homes being visible from the upper deck in New Comiskey before they were torn down. That's the only reason I knew. Not trying to take anything away from your story though. I would probably be the same way.

Our neighbor's have been letting off fireworks almost every night for the last week or so for some reason and one night my wife asked me if they were fireworks or gunshots. I said fireworks and she was like "How would you even know what gunshots sound like?"

She has a point. It's not something we hear in our neighborhood, like ever.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 I don't have to worry too much about my safety, black folks have to whenever they leave home. That's why people are in the streets protesting. Enough is enough. 

Everyone affected is tired of being different in any way, whether it's skin color, being a non-Christian, being an immigrant, being disabled, being female, you name it.....being warped into some kind of character flaw. 

It's not having a victim mentality, it's acknowledging that there are serious societal roadblocks to overcoming poverty. 

No amount of mindset change, no amount of hard work, no amount of education...can overcome the societal roadblocks that exist for people who are different..... they can all do the best they can...but at some point, you have to stop pointing the finger at them and look in the mirror. What can you do to help create change? It starts by listening, and self reflecting. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, southsideirish71 said:

Good luck with that.  The first gang banger who decides to disobey your volunteer non-violent force.  Good luck arresting anyone that has a weapon.  It will be the wild west.  

We've tried your way. It breeds more violence, more crime, more poverty, more suffering.

 

 

 

For local news, the mayor of Joliet, former cop, got in on the violence:

 

Edited by StrangeSox

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

How are people today personally responsible for their parents and grandparents being discriminated against.

Its a bit hokey, as it is was designed for kids, but this is a great way of putting the generational effects of poverty and discrimination into a skit.  It is WAY bigger than personal responsibility as a society.  At the very end, where you have the kids who don't even run, those are the kids who turn into adults who poison the next generation, and they take down the generation after that, etc.  Why run a rigged race?  There are A LOT of people who feel that way, and teach their kids the exact same thing.  So while it is easy to say it isn't my fault they ended up that way, WE ALL are the ones who bear the greater burden.  Who pays for them as adults who can't contribute to society?  We all do.

 

  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

We've tried your way. It breeds more violence, more crime, more poverty, more suffering.

 

 

 

I love this defund the police movement.  Maybe in your new utopia the police are not needed and you can send your army of social workers and others out.  Great I cant wait to hear how a social worker is going to stop gang bangers from shooting each other. Maybe some therapy, a hug, or a stern look in their general direction.  Maybe as you empty the prisons you can give us your address so we can target an area to relocate the serial killers, murders, child molesters, rapists and other violent offenders.   I sure as hell dont want them in my back yard.  I am sure they didn't get enough love and opportunities when they grew up as well.   Well good luck with your experiment.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gonna think about reparations for the rest of the day now.  Can't stop

 

 

  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

I love this defund the police movement.  Maybe in your new utopia the police are not needed and you can send your army of social workers and others out.  Great I cant wait to hear how a social worker is going to stop gang bangers from shooting each other. Maybe some therapy, a hug, or a stern look in their general direction.  Maybe as you empty the prisons you can give us your address so we can target an area to relocate the serial killers, murders, child molesters, rapists and other violent offenders.   I sure as hell dont want them in my back yard.  I am sure they didn't get enough love and opportunities when they grew up as well.   Well good luck with your experiment.  

I linked an interview and an entire book that discusses these ideas at length if you're interested in understanding them. 

There were always be murders, of course. Beyond the top level slogan is a recognition of that and a proposal of a better way forward that will reduce overall crimes, reduce the societal burdens on policing, while still being able to handle the sorts of situations you're bringing up. 

Our current method of using policing as our main tool combined with mass incarceration has very clearly failed. We would likely need to start over root and branch given the current state of things. That's the core of the movement, but it doesn't naively pretend that there will be no crimes after that. 

 

Edit: to get to the heart of it, you're assuming a world where "gang bangers" always exist and will always exist as they currently do. If you address the things that lead to gangs and crime in the first place, rather than reactively through state use of force via police, you can reduce crime and the overall need for policing in the first place. It's not like there aren't plenty of countries we can point to a examples of much stronger social systems, lower crime rates, and much less policing and incarceration all over the world.

Edited by StrangeSox

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Imagine all the people . . .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Quin said:

This is lame Sabre rattling.   It really accomplishes nothing because nobody is gonna disband their Pd and be left with a vacuum of law enforcement for however long of a time it will be to replace that force, and the guys on the way out certainly aren't gonna help 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, southsideirish71 said:

I love this defund the police movement.  Maybe in your new utopia the police are not needed and you can send your army of social workers and others out.  Great I cant wait to hear how a social worker is going to stop gang bangers from shooting each other. Maybe some therapy, a hug, or a stern look in their general direction.  Maybe as you empty the prisons you can give us your address so we can target an area to relocate the serial killers, murders, child molesters, rapists and other violent offenders.   I sure as hell dont want them in my back yard.  I am sure they didn't get enough love and opportunities when they grew up as well.   Well good luck with your experiment.  

Every time you repeat this it reinforces how much of a problem the police are.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
  • Love 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Every time you repeat this it reinforces how much of a problem the police are.

Yep. Punishing gang members without addressing the underlying reasons for gangs existing is counterproductive, and perpetuates poverty. 

Crime is a symptom, not the disease. The disease is the socioeconomic conditions that push people to become criminals because they can't support themselves legally. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
  • Like 2
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Yep. Punishing gang members without addressing the underlying reasons for gangs existing is counterproductive, and perpetuates poverty. 

Crime is a symptom, not the disease. The disease is the socioeconomic conditions that push people to become criminals because they can't support themselves legally. 

Not just that, he's deliberately choosing language there for a reason. Note that you said "Gang members" and he didn't...and he's repeated that term more than once in this thread.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Not just that, he's deliberately choosing language there for a reason. Note that you said "Gang members" and he didn't...and he's repeated that term more than once in this thread.

People who join gangs do so because they've been rejected by society. They have no means to sustain themselves legally.....When you're so desperate that the choice is to live a life of crime or starve to death, how can you blame them? In a lot of ways, crime is a direct result of socioeconomic abandonment. People have exhausted their means of making a living legally, so the run the risk of incarceration in order to survive. If they go to prison, at least they'll get 3 meals a day and healthcare...at least they'll survive. 

We've literally created a society where chronic unemployment is worse than prison, and we wonder why people turn into criminals. 

Edited by Jack Parkman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Every time you repeat this it reinforces how much of a problem the police are.

I am sorry.  Organized groups of people who use alternative means of obtaining wealth and pharmacy.  I am sorry that I offended the Latin Kings and Gangster Disciples constituent of soxtalk.  My bad.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

People who join gangs do so because they've been rejected by society. They have no means to sustain themselves legally.....When you're so desperate that the choice is to live a life of crime or starve to death, how can you blame them? In a lot of ways, crime is a direct result of socioeconomic abandonment. People have exhausted their means of making a living legally, so the run the risk of incarceration in order to survive. If they go to prison, at least they'll get 3 meals a day and healthcare...at least they'll survive. 

We've literally created a society where chronic unemployment is worse than prison, and we wonder why people turn into criminals. 

Really.  So explain organized crime to me.  Do you think that the Outfit in Chicago or the mob is made up of people who are currently suffering from being rejected by society.  Do you think they are doing this to put 3 meals a day on the table.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

Really.  So explain organized crime to me.  Do you think that the Outfit in Chicago or the mob is made up of people who are currently suffering from being rejected by society.  Do you think they are doing this to put 3 meals a day on the table.  

I'm certain there are some that is to put three meals a day on the table and they feel like they aren't welcome in society. I also believe some have a choice and made a bad one. I find it impossible to paint them all with the same brush. But you seem to not have a problem at all combining them all in one group. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Contrary to what has been posted, I am proud to see peaceful protests in Downers Grove and the police officers responding well:

https://www.nbcchicago.com/top-videos-home/suburban-police-offices-kneel-with-protesters/2283848/?fbclid=IwAR21az4dTXRGLm3X2SC0lk8dkBoL9f1OlmvSN-4i-SYljVzu3Al7PyPYIyo
 

The Downers Grove mayor has been a leader in promoting peace and a peaceful response too. He’s doing a great job.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Yep. Punishing gang members without addressing the underlying reasons for gangs existing is counterproductive, and perpetuates poverty. 

 Crime is a symptom, not the disease. The disease is the socioeconomic conditions that push people to become criminals because they can't support themselves legally. 

So serial killers who are mainly white and middle class are killing people because of socioeconomic conditions?  What about rapist?  What about pedophiles?  Murder?  Domestic Abuse?  Child Abuse?  You can counter this and point to certain types of crime and find a correlation with the act and the motivation with regards to their situation.  But some people would commit crime no matter what their situation is.     You can terraform society all you want.  Its not going to eliminate crime.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×