qwerty

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Jul 1, 2009 -> 07:22 PM) As everyone knows, Hawk has been critical of McDowell's article regarding Beckham's development, but this whole thing makes me think...why the F&CK do we disregard PERFORMANCE in spring training and in the regular season from rookies??? I am sorry, but Beckham is the real deal and should have been on the roster from day 1. I realize there are issues with arbitration etc, but still. Nonsense. Let's put the best team on the field. Secondly, why are we batting our hottest hitter at 8 or 9??? Are we "protecting" him?? This is complete nonsense. For those of you old enough to remember, we "protected" the Big Hurt back in 1990 by having him spend a meaningless 4 months in the minors even though he hit .400 in spring training and tore the cover off the ball. MAKES NO SENSE to me. It's a joke and someone should challenge this mentality of "not wanting to destroy someone's confidence" etc. Too bad. Gordon is stronger than you think, there is NO FREAKING NEED to protect him. Joke. Bat him at #2 or 3. Ok, so I welcome comments. And yes, I had a few drinks tonight! There have only been twenty players since 1965, when the draft began, that went straight from being drafted to the major leagues and never looking back. Believe it or not there is a very valid reason. Frank thomas had 240 at-bats in 1989 in the minors, 240 very mediocore at-bats. Those 240 at-bats>>> 70 or less at-bats he may have received in spring training. Those four months were far from meaningless. The sox wanted to assure themselves what exactly they had on their hands, and it couldn't have worked out any better. The sox went the same route with beckham, and it couldn't have worked out any better. Were you one of the many that wanted viciedo to start on the major league team? I would not doubt it. Sometimes people just complain for the sake of complaining, it's f***ing weird.

He is serious.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 1, 2009 -> 03:43 PM) Actually Jermaine Dye is a very good defensive outfielder On opposite day.

QUOTE (hogan873 @ Jul 1, 2009 -> 02:33 PM) Granted Dye is not a great RFer, and is probably below par, but I don't think he's horrible. Certainly lacks some speed, but he still makes some good plays. These ''good'' plays you speak of even a mediocore player gets there with ease. Generally when a player has to dive or jab at a ball it was due to a bad jump, read, or overall speed getting to the ball. Very rarely is the ball placed perfectly in which the only way to get there is by doing everything perfect in return to hunt it down, whenever you see andruw jones dive, it was necessary. When dye dives, not so much. Dye fits into the rare group that can read the ball off the bat well, get a good jump, and yet it doesn't matter because he is just that damn slow. This is the worst group to be associated with because there is no turning back. You can learn how to get a better jump, a better read, but you cannot learn how to get faster (technically i suppose you can) at dye's age. For how great dye has been here offensively in his tenure with the sox... he is a large part of the reason why the sox have been awful defensively going on four years now.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jul 1, 2009 -> 12:01 PM) Quentin is not much of a defensive upgrade from Dye. And Beckham and Alexei are still learning their positions, they are both likely to get better as the season goes on. Dye is one of the very worst fielders annually in all of baseball. Dye is simply disgusting to watch out there. Dye's throwing arm just so happens to be one of the worst in the majors also. Quentin has long proven to be a better right fielder than left fielder, he is actually a plus defender out in right. While quentin in left is no where near as good as he is in right, he is several times better out there than dye on his best day. All the numbers and visuals suggests that much.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Jun 30, 2009 -> 01:57 PM) I'm so sick and tired of this argument. Fine, yeah, he'll be a premium hitter there. But how the f*** does that help the team if Getz is the better option to have in the lineup instead of Fields? I think Beckham will have to move eventually to the MI because I don't think he's a good enough 3B, but right now, you do what's best for the team. And honestly, with Getz being pretty clutch for us lately, having him in the lineup instead of Fields helps the team. Irrational to say he will have to change positions (which i think he will... though not likely this season) based off a total of 21 games at third in the major leagues, and in total 29 games between the majors and the minors. Neither you or anyone else has seen nearly enough of him to have even a semi decent grasp of what we have on ours hands defensively. Sample sizes are are no ones friend.

QUOTE (rangercal @ Jun 30, 2009 -> 07:45 AM) What about Harold? Ever since 1987 he went on to dh, 1987 was the best he ever hit while with the sox, and he eventually went on to be traded to the rangers after 97 games played. Baines was in the field for 6 seasons with the sox, and he practically never played the field after that 1987 season and on. Five of his seven best years were either when he was no longer a sox, no longer in the field, or a combination of the two. Shoeless joe jackson. Magglio ordonez. Jermaine dye. Carlos lee. Harold baines. Realistically lee and baines could be flipped and it would not bother me.

QUOTE (hogan873 @ Jun 30, 2009 -> 07:24 AM) Excellent. I suppose I was even thinking about how often the Sox make the playoffs. It is quite depressing when you think that they haven't been to the playoffs in back to back years in such a long time. We think about the WS in 2005 and the exciting way we got to the playoffs last year, and we smile. But then we think about 2007, and we weep like small children. The sox have never made the playoffs in back to back seasons in their history.

Shoeless joe jackson, magglio ordonez, jermaine dye, and carlos lee in that order. Lee has really come on strong once he left chicago. In no way was lee a slouch when with us, he hit 152 homeruns while here, which is good for 25 home runs per season. Since he left, not counting this season, lee has hit 129 home runs, which is good for 32.25 home runs per season

Click these links to see just how good dye has been, really is quite amazing, to myself anyway. Dye has 155 home runs since 2005... the next closes right fielder is vladimir guerrero with 121. Dye has the third most home runs out of all outfielders since 2005. Dye has the 8th most home runs since 2005 out of any position player. Dye also has a .891 ops since 2005... which is good for the 23rd best ops in all of baseball.

QUOTE (SouthsideDon48 @ Jun 30, 2009 -> 02:58 AM) I'd go after Doug Davis in a heartbeat. The guy is an unheralded stud. He's always been one of my sleeper-picks in late rounds in fantasy baseball for 3 years now and he never disappointed. I also think he might fare well in the Cell. Davis has a 1.5 whip since the start of the 2006 season. A transition to the american league likely would put him in the 4.75 era range. There are people that think the transition from the national league to the american league is overblown. For hitters it is less of a concern than pitchers. Part one. Part two. Most importantly part three.

QUOTE (ObamaKnowsBest @ Jun 29, 2009 -> 11:34 PM) There's a difference between riding out the season with Pods and hoping for him to carry the team into the future. I'm just saying he should not be traded. The same people who say we shouldn't count on Pods next year were the ones laughing when we signed him to a minor league contract. Truth is we don't know and I wish some people would admit that more often. There is also a difference between realism and fantasy. Fact is podsednik has long been an injury riddled player. Apr 30, 2009: Contract purchased from Charlotte (AAA). Apr 14, 2009: Signed by the Chicago White Sox to a minor league contract. Apr 1, 2009: Released by the Colorado Rockies. Jan 14, 2009: Re-signed by the Colorado Rockies to a minor league contract. Nov 1, 2008: Filed for free agency. Aug 22, 2008: Missed 23 games (finger injury). Jul 29, 2008: Finger injury, 15-day DL. Mar 30, 2008: Contract purchased from Colorado Springs (AAA). Jan 30, 2008: Signed by the Colorado Rockies to a minor league contract. Nov 20, 2007: Designated for assignment by the Chicago White Sox. Sep 2, 2007: Missed 10 games (ribcage injury). Aug 27, 2007: Ribcage injury, day-to-day. Jul 24, 2007: Missed 20 games (muscle strain). Jul 3, 2007: Muscle strain, 15-day DL. Jun 23, 2007: Missed 58 games (groin). Apr 17, 2007: Groin, 15-day DL. Apr 4, 2007: Missed 1 game (hernia). Apr 2, 2007: Hernia, day-to-day. Dec 1, 2006: Re-signed by the Chicago White Sox to a one-year contract. Aug 29, 2005: Missed 13 games (groin). Aug 15, 2005: Groin, 15-day DL. Aug 14, 2005: Leg injury, day-to-day. May 12, 2005: Missed 1 game (stomach injury). May 11, 2005: Stomach injury, day-to-day. Apr 18, 2005: Missed 5 games (groin). Apr 13, 2005: Groin, day-to-day. Someone claimed in the chat today that the free agent class was weak, i would say the exact opposite, it should be rather easy to fill the our holes with the money coming off the books this upcoming off-season. There really is no excuse to not be more prepared going into the 2010 season than we were this season.

2006 season... Paul konerko - 177 hits. Jermaine dye - 170 hits. Tadahito iguchi - 156 hits. Joe crede - 154 hits. A.j. pierzynski - 150 hits. Jim thome - 141 hits. Thome and dye were both in the top ten in ops, iso, wOBA, not to mention about 20+ other offensive categories that truly matter. Are you seriously try and tell me that konerko, iguchi, crede, and pierzynski were in anyway more valuable than thome? 2009 season... Paul konerko - 77. Alexei ramirez - 73. Jermaine dye - 70. A.j. pierzynski - 67. Scott podsednik - 66. Chris getz - 49. Josh fields - 47. Jim thome - 45. Despite a total of 7 other players with more hits than thome... the only player even remotely close to the production of thome's is dye.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jun 29, 2009 -> 10:18 PM) And that's why we post on message boards while significantly more knowledgeable people make actual baseball decisions. What people did not understand at the time of the signing, while he was struggling in his first first 8 starts when he had an era of 7.71, and even now... there is no way we could lose in extension. There is no doubt in my mind floyd would have made 15+ million in arbitration, and realistically, it would have been a good deal more. Jon garland signed for 6.25 million for the 2009 season. Jon garland. Garland for the past year and a half has sported an era of roughly 5 with a whip of 1.5. No one can tell me that floyd will not be worth 5 million in 2011 and 7 million in the 2012 season. Even with how the economy has impacted contracts during the second half of the off-season... it will not remain that way for eternity. Contracts are bound to go back up sooner rather than later. Floyd is averaging 6.3875 innings pitched this season which would be good for roughly 210 innings pitched. Workhorses do not grow on trees. Floyd QUOTE (kev211 @ Jun 29, 2009 -> 10:21 PM) Whats the post lillibridge record? 15-22 with lillibridge. 23-16 without. QUOTE (ObamaKnowsBest @ Jun 29, 2009 -> 11:05 PM) And this has bothered me with this site all year. Everyone wants to be their own GM and sometimes I wonder where the fandom went. We got people suggesting trading Pods and Dye who are the only reason this team has any life, and we might as well be paying Pods by the hour with the cheap salary we got him at. Too much panicking and not enough optimism. Hard to talk baseball when everyone wants to talk about where players should be traded and who we are going to get. The majority of "prospects" stay just that, prospects. You would think that trading for prospects guarantee wins in the future the way some people talk around here. Can we relax and enjoy some baseball please? Go Sox! Sure there are people who feel that we should trade off every and any piece for the sake of it, no matter what position we are in, but frankly, they are fools. Those people have got to realize you do not have to be the best team in any sport to win a championship, once you get in, literally anything can happen, it's all about whoever if the hottest at the moment. Podsednik, dye, and anyone else of any worth should, no, i mean has to be traded if the sox are substantially back in the standings... in the few days coming up to the deadline. It's only logical. We cannot be afraid of hurting a players feelings (which i'm fairly certain everyone on the sox would understand... it's a business afterall) if it benefits our future. It's also not always about trading people from the majors league roster for minor leaguers at the deadline. There are cases when teams pick up important pieces that can fill a major hole on their major league roster, while unloading someone they had no intention of ever bringing back in the first place. Prospects in no way guarantee wins, hell, if anything soxtalk as a whole vastly overrates the system (don't tell them i said that), mostly due to how barren the system has been for as long as it has.

This is the first time they have been .500 since june 1st.

If you want to get technical, the first is two hours and twenty four minutes long, the second is two hours and and thirty minutes long.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 28, 2009 -> 04:07 PM) Also, Jose Contreras only pitched 1/2 a season in 2003 for the Yankees. Was he in training camp with them? Most of the original 2003 tests were done in ST. Contreras was indeed in the yankees training camp in 2003.

QUOTE (dbaho @ Jun 28, 2009 -> 09:00 AM) Our highest rating fielder (for those who are qualified) according to RZR with .886 is....... Jermaine Dye, ha. Konerko's next on .875. Next best is Alexei with .817, which shows you how much of a drop-off there is. They also lead the AL in UER with 41, and have only made 191 plays OOZ, while the AL average is 218. At least Beckham has been a slight upgrade on Fields (who was woeful with a RZR of .659 ouch), but Beck's still pretty subpar compared to other third baseman. However Pods has a .914 RZR in LF and a .958 RZR in CF, so he has been a pleasent surprise. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 28, 2009 -> 12:42 PM) The amazing stat for the Sox this year is 43 unearned runs. They gave up 53 in all of 2005. I find it interesting that every place other than baseball reference has the sox with with 43 unearned runs given up... while baseball reference has them at 41 runs given up. Every other stat matches up perfectly across the board. Odd.

QUOTE (bobryansson @ Jun 27, 2009 -> 06:08 PM) I know I'm a draft pick and all, but I respectfully disagree. I think he played it well and correctly. That being said, I do want him at short. If you don't want to be a draft pick any longer you need to start raking up those posts quick, man.

Podsednik is a moron.

Lolz @ that girl.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Jun 26, 2009 -> 11:49 AM) So, Chad Billingsley hadn't given up more than 3 ER in a start all year. Gave up 5. Randy Wells hasn't given up more than 2 ER in a start this year... I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'. GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...YOU! WHITE! SOX! Wells gave up four earned runs against the twins on june 12th. Billingsley also gave up four earned runs on may 24th against the angels.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jun 22, 2009 -> 10:15 PM) We might be better served to blow it up regardless of where we are. The youngsters that will come up this year if we trade some veterans may be able to keep us at least hanging around if nobody else makes a good run. Also, I'd love to trade Dye, Thome, and Dotel if we're not going to renegotiate their contracts. The reason is, I wouldn't mind seeing any of those guys back here in 2010, maybe even all of them, and if we trade them we get around the arbitration problem. If we deal off Thome and Dotel for example, instead of being forced to wait until May or June or whenever it is to sign them at a reasonable rate, we may be able to get both guys back at about $10M combined. Maybe if we explain the situation to some of our veteran players that we'd like to bring them back but we can't afford to offer arb, maybe they'll still consider us over the offseason. I'd much rather deal all 3 of these guys and get a couple prospects/projects in return PLUS have a shot at signing them at a reasonable rate over the offseason than just hang on to them, get nothing in picks, and then certainly lose all 3 because we failed to offer arb. Otherwise, if there is any way to either renegotiate a contract now, or if there's any way to work out a new contract at a lesser amount before the players become FA during our negotiation window, I'd like to do that. Especially in Dotel's case. QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jun 22, 2009 -> 10:16 PM) We might be better served to blow it up regardless of where we are. The youngsters that will come up this year if we trade some veterans may be able to keep us at least hanging around if nobody else makes a good run. Also, I'd love to trade Dye, Thome, and Dotel if we're not going to renegotiate their contracts. The reason is, I wouldn't mind seeing any of those guys back here in 2010, maybe even all of them, and if we trade them we get around the arbitration problem. If we deal off Thome and Dotel for example, instead of being forced to wait until May or June or whenever it is to sign them at a reasonable rate, we may be able to get both guys back at about $10M combined. Maybe if we explain the situation to some of our veteran players that we'd like to bring them back but we can't afford to offer arb, maybe they'll still consider us over the offseason. I'd much rather deal all 3 of these guys and get a couple prospects/projects in return PLUS have a shot at signing them at a reasonable rate over the offseason than just hang on to them, get nothing in picks, and then certainly lose all 3 because we failed to offer arb. Otherwise, if there is any way to either renegotiate a contract now, or if there's any way to work out a new contract at a lesser amount before the players become FA during our negotiation window, I'd like to do that. Especially in Dotel's case. QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jun 22, 2009 -> 10:16 PM) edit: double post Hmm.

Ted williams personal top twenty hitters of all time as of 1994. 20. Ralph Kiner 19. Mike Schmidt 18. Frank Robinson 17. Harry Heilmann 16. Mel Ott 15. Johnny Mize 14. Al Simmons 13. Tris Speaker 12. Mickey Mantle 11. Hank Greenberg 10. Willie Mays 9. Hank Aaron 8. Joe Jackson 7. Stan Musial 6. Ty Cobb 5. Joe DiMaggio 4. Rogers Hornsby 3. Jimmie Foxx 2. Lou Gehrig 1. Babe Ruth

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Jun 22, 2009 -> 09:49 AM) I now feel justified because you disagree with me. Oh, and he's Rogers Hornsby, and Albert Pujols has hit more homers in nine years than Hornsby did in his entire career. In his first nine years in the majors, Pujols has over 50 more homers than Williams had to that point. All the while, Pujols was unknown until he tore up the majors. The guy is on something. You can flame me all you want because there's no rock solid proof yet, but I'm sure we'll see soon enough. By denying it now, you're really just putting off the inevitable. I don't disagree with you, but to be fair, the only season in which pujols played in the minors (2000), he was considered to be the 42nd best prospect around baseball the following season.