Not a Typical Rebuild According to White Sox

[southsider2k5]

With them taking a step back from competing, it is entirely plausible that they start him in A ball this year as a starter and see if they can make it work. He would move quickly as a RP, but with really no need for him at the ML level this season, they could really take their time and give him a shot. It is entirely possible that after a year they decide it just isn't going to work, but it will give him a chance to build some endurance as well as secondary pitches that could make him into a RP in the mold of Andrew Miller.

 

I agree totally with this. This would give you max flexibility. You can always push him as a reliever if things change. If he doesn't get IP, he is never going to be a starter, and now is the time because you won't need him for years.

[sin city sox fan]

Well, the 2013 team won 63, so anything is possible.

 

The 2013 team also had to deal with Robin Ventura as manager. That alone was good for 15-20 losses per season.

[Al Lopez's Ghost]

The 2013 team also had to deal with Robin Ventura as manager. That alone was good for 15-20 losses per season.

Ventura was awful, but no manager is 15-20 games bad.

[Thomas_Ventura_Roberts]

I would not be surprised if Avi Garcia has a breakout season. That will help their competitiveness.

[tray]

There are a few players and pitchers that might surprise us and change the rebuilding equation, at least in terms of the timetable.

I have a few favorites of mine that I think might be in that category - players that no one expects much from, and then end up over performing expectations.

First one is Omar Narvaez. Omar came up briefly last season and showed that at least he can hit the ball. I think he has some upside and he is just 24 years old.

Tyler Saladino in my opinion played a decent second base and made some unbelievable plays going up the middle. He also had some clutch hits and started hitting with some power. I would have him as my starting second basemen, then possibly play Moncada at third and Frazier at first. That would leave Abreu to share 1B/DH (until one is traded).

Matt Davidson started hitting very well in ST last year. I wonder if he could possibly play LF. If he could, then switch Melky to RF where his arm would be more valuable than it has been in LF. Then DFA Avi Garcia.

Charlie Tilson is another x factor who could end up surprising us as a Center Fielder, especially if he still has the speed he had before the injury.

Our pitching staff has too many potential surprises to mention and everyone here knows who they are. Burdi, Kopech, Gio, and others.

 

So it's the old story of "ifs" , that perennial questions that many teams have at the beginning of the season -- if, if, if multiple players perform beyond expectations, you might have a decent team. If that ends up happening you have to think about changing the timetable on the rebuild and maybe forget about tanking the season.

 

 

[Thomas_Ventura_Roberts]

There are a few players and pitchers that might surprise us and change the rebuilding equation, at least in terms of the timetable.

I have a few favorites of mine that I think might be in that category - players that no one expects much from, and then end up over performing expectations.

First one is Omar Narvaez. Omar came up briefly last season and showed that at least he can hit the ball. I think he has some upside and he is just 24 years old.

Tyler Saladino in my opinion played a decent second base and made some unbelievable plays going up the middle. He also had some clutch hits and started hitting with some power. I would have him as my starting second basemen, then possibly play Moncada at third and Frazier at first. That would leave Abreu to share 1B/DH (until one is traded).

Matt Davidson started hitting very well in ST last year. I wonder if he could possibly play LF. If he could, then switch Melky to RF where his arm would be more valuable than it has been in LF. Then DFA Avi Garcia.

Charlie Tilson is another x factor who could end up surprising us as a Center Fielder, especially if he still has the speed he had before the injury.

Our pitching staff has too many potential surprises to mention and everyone here knows who they are. Burdi, Kopech, Gio, and others.

 

So it's the old story of "ifs" , that perennial questions that many teams have at the beginning of the season -- if, if, if multiple players perform beyond expectations, you might have a decent team. If that ends up happening you have to think about changing the timetable on the rebuild and maybe forget about tanking the season.

 

 

Those players certainly can make a difference. I still remember when I was a kid, and the sports guy on 10 o'clock news made a number of pre-season predictions for the White Sox based on ifs. He then humorously ended by saying that 'if if was a ship, we would all go sailing.'

 

[WBWSF]

The 2017 White Sox team is going to be a train wreck. The team has 4 major holes at catcher, CF, Rf and DH. Plus they just traded one of the best pitchers in MLB (Sale). They have done NOTHING to improve this team this off season. After Frazier + Cabrera leave after the 2017 season the 2018 White Sox team will even be worse than the 2017 team. My only hope for the team is that after the 2018 season (hopefully before that) JR sells the team.

[Chicago White Sox]

The 2017 White Sox team is going to be a train wreck. The team has 4 major holes at catcher, CF, Rf and DH. Plus they just traded one of the best pitchers in MLB (Sale). They have done NOTHING to improve this team this off season. After Frazier + Cabrera leave after the 2017 season the 2018 White Sox team will even be worse than the 2017 team. My only hope for the team is that after the 2018 season (hopefully before that) JR sells the team.

It's called a rebuild bro, they're supposed to suck.

[SCCWS]

Those players certainly can make a difference. I still remember when I was a kid, and the sports guy on 10 o'clock news made a number of pre-season predictions for the White Sox based on ifs. He then humorously ended by saying that 'if if was a ship, we would all go sailing.'

 

I could be wrong, but didn't Hahn say Moncada was being moved back to 2nd?? I think one of the big questions in ST will be what his future position will be. Boston moved him from 2nd because of Pedroia but his play at 3rd was mediocre. There was talk by some media in Boston that he might ultimately end up as a RF due to his arm strength.

[WBWSF]

It's called a rebuild bro, they're supposed to suck.

They can call it a rebuild, I call it a train wreck. They have nobody in the farm system to help their every day lineup at 3B, Catcher, Dh, and all 3 outfield positions. This so called REBUILD has all the potential of lasting for many years.

[Bob Sacamano]

They can call it a rebuild, I call it a train wreck. They have nobody in the farm system to help their every day lineup at 3B, Catcher, Dh, and all 3 outfield positions. This so called REBUILD has all the potential of lasting for many years.

 

Its early in the rebuild though. Yes as of right now, it still lacks depth but they still have a couple more years of trading players and drafts to fix that.

[witesoxfan]

They can call it a rebuild, I call it a train wreck. They have nobody in the farm system to help their every day lineup at 3B, Catcher, Dh, and all 3 outfield positions. This so called REBUILD has all the potential of lasting for many years.

 

Uhhh

[Panerista]

The 2017 White Sox team is going to be a train wreck. The team has 4 major holes at catcher, CF, Rf and DH. Plus they just traded one of the best pitchers in MLB (Sale). They have done NOTHING to improve this team this off season. After Frazier + Cabrera leave after the 2017 season the 2018 White Sox team will even be worse than the 2017 team. My only hope for the team is that after the 2018 season (hopefully before that) JR sells the team.

My friend, it's time to join the rest of Sox Nation and move past this short sighted attitude.

[elrockinMT]

They can call it a rebuild, I call it a train wreck. They have nobody in the farm system to help their every day lineup at 3B, Catcher, Dh, and all 3 outfield positions. This so called REBUILD has all the potential of lasting for many years.

 

 

Apparently we are doomed

[caulfield12]

If the young pitching comes around quickly and Moncada is as good as advertised, that's easily a 74-78 win team in 2018 and really promising/competitive in 2019.

[Con te Giolito]

If the young pitching comes around quickly and Moncada is as good as advertised, that's easily a 74-78 win team in 2018 and really promising/competitive in 2019.

They need more depth. Right now they are pretty well set up to just become the White Sox of the past three or so years just with different names. What are they gonna do about 3b? Cf? Lf? Rf? DH?

 

Not to try and bleed the Q thread into this one, but keeping Quintana robs them of at least a couple worthwhile position player prospects and a shot at a top 3 pick. Sox are counting on Call, Fisher, Michalczewski, Adolfo or Basabe (or someone I am missing entirely) to really take a huge step and become a Tim Anderson-like (I mean tier, not profile) prospect in the next six months. I think someone surprises us, but I'm not sure they will make that kind of leap forward.

 

You'll still see the likes Jerry Sands, Moises Sierra, Gordon Beckham, JB Shuck, Carlos Sanchez having everyday roles in 2018. Cant win like that, we've learned that much.

[SonofaRoache]

If we trade Q and Robertson we are still a 72 win team. There is still some talent on this team and the players here wont tank with their jobs on the line. We are not getting a top 3 pick next year. We will pick between 5 and 10 where it's about picking the best bat. I think we can get a pretty damn good bat in that range who plays a little D. We just have to stop drafting athletic freaks or brutes and go with official talent.

[Con te Giolito]

If we trade Q and Robertson we are still a 72 win team. There is still some talent on this team and the players here wont tank with their jobs on the line. We are not getting a top 3 pick next year. We will pick between 5 and 10 where it's about picking the best bat. I think we can get a pretty damn good bat in that range who plays a little D. We just have to stop drafting athletic freaks or brutes and go with official talent.

Replacing Robertson with Jones probably makes them better.

[professa]

There are a few players and pitchers that might surprise us and change the rebuilding equation, at least in terms of the timetable.

I have a few favorites of mine that I think might be in that category - players that no one expects much from, and then end up over performing expectations.

First one is Omar Narvaez. Omar came up briefly last season and showed that at least he can hit the ball. I think he has some upside and he is just 24 years old.

Tyler Saladino in my opinion played a decent second base and made some unbelievable plays going up the middle. He also had some clutch hits and started hitting with some power. I would have him as my starting second basemen, then possibly play Moncada at third and Frazier at first. That would leave Abreu to share 1B/DH (until one is traded).

Matt Davidson started hitting very well in ST last year. I wonder if he could possibly play LF. If he could, then switch Melky to RF where his arm would be more valuable than it has been in LF. Then DFA Avi Garcia.

Charlie Tilson is another x factor who could end up surprising us as a Center Fielder, especially if he still has the speed he had before the injury.

Our pitching staff has too many potential surprises to mention and everyone here knows who they are. Burdi, Kopech, Gio, and others.

 

So it's the old story of "ifs" , that perennial questions that many teams have at the beginning of the season -- if, if, if multiple players perform beyond expectations, you might have a decent team. If that ends up happening you have to think about changing the timetable on the rebuild and maybe forget about tanking the season.

 

Agree with everything on this list and as much as I was impressed by Omar last year, I just can't see him hitting .267 & 687OPS. I mean he put up 667 & 608 OPS in the past 2 years in the minors. Don't see the upside offensively. No more than a 3rd catcher IMO.

 

I do get that we're rebuilding and everyone should get a chance, but I just don't see future for him in the MLB

[Lip Man 1]

They can call it a rebuild, I call it a train wreck. They have nobody in the farm system to help their every day lineup at 3B, Catcher, Dh, and all 3 outfield positions. This so called REBUILD has all the potential of lasting for many years.

 

2013, 2014, 2015 and 2016 were also train wrecks...seven out of the last 10 seasons have been train wrecks.

 

They weren't going to spend 150 million to sign the "best" free agents in poor classes this year and next...not with this ownership.

 

So what EXACTLY did you think they would do or could do?

 

I'd like to hear your plan.

 

And please don't start with the tired notion of "well JR can sell the team..." because in point of fact, (yet again) unless his health suddenly goes south HE IS NOT SELLING in the next few years. Like it or not, that's reality.

 

This was the best option in a difficult situation (created a lot by the Sox themselves...granted.)

 

Can we please move on from this...finally...please?????????????????????????????????????????

 

Oh, here's a hint for you..."rebuilds" usually DO take years. Better get used to it.

 

Mark

Edited January 22, 2017 by Lip Man 1

[greg775]

Oh, here's a hint for you..."rebuilds" usually DO take years. Better get used to it.

 

Mark

This is going to be a strange rebuild. I know this board has people who love prospects and the process of rebuilding, but the reality is that very few people care about stuff like that until the team actually starts winning. At major league prices I would imagine attendance will be at an all time low the next few seasons.

[Lip Man 1]

This is going to be a strange rebuild. I know this board has people who love prospects and the process of rebuilding, but the reality is that very few people care about stuff like that until the team actually starts winning. At major league prices I would imagine attendance will be at an all time low the next few seasons.

 

The Sox have been among the bottom feeding teams in MLB attendance-wise for the past several years. This won't be an issue (especially not with the money pouring in to teams from various means). Seriously in my mind there is no difference between being 27th in the league in attendance or 29th. If you aren't in the top 10 or top 15 it really doesn't matter, your attendance simply is not good.

 

But another point is if you think attendance would improve if the Sox trotted out the same philosophy and stunk up the joint by July again.

 

And nothing, NOTHING will beat the Sox drawing 495,000 fans FOR THE SEASON in 1970 after three straight terrible years and the social unrest of the 1960's (which led to the belief that Comiskey Park was in a "dangerous place...") If the Sox could survive that, they can survive anything.

 

And coincidentally what did they do as soon as that season ended? They traded their two best players and went into a rebuild mold. (Granted, Roland Hemond can and did run rings around Kenny and Rick as a G.M.)

 

Mark

Edited January 22, 2017 by Lip Man 1

[Panerista]

This is going to be a strange rebuild. I know this board has people who love prospects and the process of rebuilding, but the reality is that very few people care about stuff like that until the team actually starts winning. At major league prices I would imagine attendance will be at an all time low the next few seasons.

This is such a non-argument. Attendance is terrible now. We have literally nothing to lose by rebuilding. Houston had horrible attendance mid-rebuild in 2013, but they have shot up the list and added like 750,000 tickets by 2016.

 

This is a rebuild. The future in a rebuild is younger and more exciting. That's it.

[Thad Bosley]

This is such a non-argument. Attendance is terrible now. We have literally nothing to lose by rebuilding. Houston had horrible attendance mid-rebuild in 2013, but they have shot up the list and added like 750,000 tickets by 2016.

 

This is a rebuild. The future in a rebuild is younger and more exciting. That's it.

As in, we are still only in the beginning stages of this rebuild, and we already have the #1 prospect in all of baseball, and three of the top RHP prospects. Cause for genuine excitement I should think across the fan base, with attendance being the least of concerns at this point.

[Panerista]

As in, we are still only in the beginning stages of this rebuild, and we already have the #1 prospect in all of baseball, and three of the top RHP prospects. Cause for genuine excitement I should think across the fan base, with attendance being the least of concerns at this point.

Yes sir. That's a great start.