caulfield12 Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 We're at that point in the rebuild (finally) where it's much better to have a 1.5-2.5 fWAR outfielder under team control than finish 2-3 games worse because of all the garbage we've sent out there in order to get the 6th pick rather than the 7th. By that, I mean 2020...not the remainder of 2019. (Waits for someone to assert, "Well, at least we'd have Benintendi instead of Fulmer in that scenario.") Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 (edited) To clarify: I don't necessarily think they should trade Lopez for Mazara but if they won't back off that ask, Hahn should sleep on it. They should seriously consider it, at the very least. You have to give to get. Edited July 25, 2019 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sox72 Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 What’s sometimes tough to swallow is that if he were a Sox prospect and we were trading him, some posters here would be demanding a few top 100 prospects in return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 3 hours ago, Jake said: Give them Carson Fulmer and let's make a deal. If they're too stubborn, I'll throw in an Alec Hansen This. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 3 hours ago, Jake said: Give them Carson Fulmer and let's make a deal. If they're too stubborn, I'll throw in an Alec Hansen Fulmer and Hansen isn't a bad offer. Hansen can still be something if someone can get his delivery cleaned up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moan4Yoan Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: Fulmer and Hansen isn't a bad offer. Hansen can still be something if someone can get his delivery cleaned up. This junk is about all I’d offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 17 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: To clarify: I don't necessarily think they should trade Lopez for Mazara but if they won't back off that ask, Hahn should sleep on it. They should seriously consider it, at the very least. You have to give to get. No way would I move Lopez for only 2 years of Mazara. Especially with the way Lopez has pitched since the break. If he gets back on track and closer to 2018 Lopez you have yourself another quality arm for the future. Sox can’t really afford to subtract potential starting pitching at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 It is amazing Lopez is now suddenly worth something when he needed to be DFA'd only a couple of weeks ago, even though I still think he has options left. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Deep Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Dick Allen said: It is amazing Lopez is now suddenly worth something when he needed to be DFA'd only a couple of weeks ago, even though I still think he has options left. I think we saw how it took Giolitto took time to figure it out. Lopez has better stuff and if he can figure it out, he's much more valuable then a Mazara. You may be watching a young kid who is beginning to figure it out with his last 3 outings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackDoorBreach Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Lopez has given up 4 ER his last 21 innings and is young. In no way would you ever give him up for Mazara. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said: Lopez has given up 4 ER his last 21 innings and is young. In no way would you ever give him up for Mazara. Even ignoring this as we probably should, I'm not giving up 4 years of a meh player for 2 years of a meh player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 30 minutes ago, mqr said: Even ignoring this as we probably should, I'm not giving up 4 years of a meh player for 2 years of a meh player Exactly. Mazara's trade value is not huge right now. I'd rather have 4 years of control on Lopez. Young pitching can take time to figure things out at the mlb level, and Mazara's performance has left a ton to be desired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 If we are entertaining trading Lopez, I'd look to Tampa where Snell was just shut down for at least 4 weeks. Between Lopez and Colome, we might be able to extract serious prospects....i.e. Sanchez, Liberatore, Baz, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 12 minutes ago, Flash said: If we are entertaining trading Lopez, I'd look to Tampa where Snell was just shut down for at least 4 weeks. Between Lopez and Colome, we might be able to extract serious prospects....i.e. Sanchez, Liberatore, Baz, etc. Dude it's the rays, when do they send out good stuff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 1 hour ago, bmags said: Dude it's the rays, when do they send out good stuff. so true Mags Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 9 hours ago, Tony said: Puig is another option (and one I think the Sox will pursue) Not the best work ethic in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted July 26, 2019 Share Posted July 26, 2019 17 hours ago, Dick Allen said: It is amazing Lopez is now suddenly worth something when he needed to be DFA'd only a couple of weeks ago, even though I still think he has options left. It's not that he has a bunch of trade value, it's that Mazara doesn't. Unless you're just poking fun at people who wanted him DFA'd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moan4Yoan Posted July 26, 2019 Share Posted July 26, 2019 Another article that says both the Sox and Padres are scouting Mazara. The Padres want to steal yet another player away from Hahn. 😂 https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/texas-rangers/rangers/2019/07/25/rangers-joey-gallo-likely-miss-six-weeks-undergoes-surgery-broken-hamate-bone-in-willie-calhoun-called-up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted July 26, 2019 Share Posted July 26, 2019 On 7/24/2019 at 9:05 PM, Lip Man 1 said: Because the Sox pro scouting department is obviously bad at what they do. or they think NL talent translates to AL talent....they don't have the best of luck in this area Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 I've thought about this a bit now, and I don't think if this happened it is necessarily as terrible of a move as some of you have suggested. I would preface this by saying this is totally dependent on what it would cost to get him, and also depend on a key offseason move. If the Sox traded for Mazara, obviously the hope if that at 24 there is still loads of potential that will be unlocked over the next 2 years of control. That makes sense considering Tilson, Cordell, Jay, and Garcia have been trotted out there and are either AAAA fodder or solid bench pieces. It also doesn't appear that the current crop of minor league OF are going to be ready at any point in 2020, so there needs to be some type of solution. I know Puig is a favorite, but is he really worth what his contract may demand? And the next best option in Ozuna is not really a realistic option for RF. Now, what if the Sox make Grandal one of their top priorities heading into the offseason? We already know that they went after him last offseason and missed out. If they could land him, The Sox could end up with this lineup at some point in the 2020 season: 1. CF - Robert (R) 2. 3B - Moncada (S) 3. C - Grandal (S) 4. LF - Jimenez (R) 5. 1B - Abreu (R) 6. RF - Mazara (L) 7. SS - Anderson (R) 8. DH - Collins (L) / McCann (R) 9. 2B - Madrigal (R) I think that is a fairly competitive and realistic lineup. Remember, rosters are going to expand to 26 players in 2020. You can carry 3 catchers theoretically - always playing 2 of them utilizing the DH. Let Collins get his AB's and rotate McCann and Grandal with him. If Mazara is more of the same, the hope is that by 2021 season, you have one of Rutherford, Basabe, Walker, or Adolfo make the jump. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moan4Yoan Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 1 hour ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said: I've thought about this a bit now, and I don't think if this happened it is necessarily as terrible of a move as some of you have suggested. I would preface this by saying this is totally dependent on what it would cost to get him, and also depend on a key offseason move. If the Sox traded for Mazara, obviously the hope if that at 24 there is still loads of potential that will be unlocked over the next 2 years of control. That makes sense considering Tilson, Cordell, Jay, and Garcia have been trotted out there and are either AAAA fodder or solid bench pieces. It also doesn't appear that the current crop of minor league OF are going to be ready at any point in 2020, so there needs to be some type of solution. I know Puig is a favorite, but is he really worth what his contract may demand? And the next best option in Ozuna is not really a realistic option for RF. Now, what if the Sox make Grandal one of their top priorities heading into the offseason? We already know that they went after him last offseason and missed out. If they could land him, The Sox could end up with this lineup at some point in the 2020 season: 1. CF - Robert (R) 2. 3B - Moncada (S) 3. C - Grandal (S) 4. LF - Jimenez (R) 5. 1B - Abreu (R) 6. RF - Mazara (L) 7. SS - Anderson (R) 8. DH - Collins (L) / McCann (R) 9. 2B - Madrigal (R) I think that is a fairly competitive and realistic lineup. Remember, rosters are going to expand to 26 players in 2020. You can carry 3 catchers theoretically - always playing 2 of them utilizing the DH. Let Collins get his AB's and rotate McCann and Grandal with him. If Mazara is more of the same, the hope is that by 2021 season, you have one of Rutherford, Basabe, Walker, or Adolfo make the jump. Mazara is currently a .750 OPS guy for the past 4 years. He has 2 years left of control. The Sox era should be over the next 6 seasons, right? So Mazara will either be mediocre for the next 2 seasons or he will show some talent and get himself a nice long-term contract in 2 years. His agent is Boras so there is no hope in extending him until his free agency. Mazara would be a very pointless acquisition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 20 minutes ago, Moan4Yoan said: Mazara is currently a .750 OPS guy for the past 4 years. He has 2 years left of control. The Sox era should be over the next 6 seasons, right? So Mazara will either be mediocre for the next 2 seasons or he will show some talent and get himself a nice long-term contract in 2 years. His agent is Boras so there is no hope in extending him until his free agency. Mazara would be a very pointless acquisition. This is why I hate Boris clients. It's always about I ….never team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moan4Yoan Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 12 minutes ago, poppysox said: This is why I hate Boris clients. It's always about I ….never team. Oh well, too bad. That is the way most free agents are. They want the biggest contract. Why should any top player sign with the White Sox otherwise? Because of their long history of winning? Because the Sox offer the most money? What would it be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 25 minutes ago, Moan4Yoan said: Oh well, too bad. That is the way most free agents are. They want the biggest contract. Why should any top player sign with the White Sox otherwise? Because of their long history of winning? Because the Sox offer the most money? What would it be? I don't at all think a FA needs to sign for less money although considerations such as climate, near friends and family, etc. can be in play. Also, there are places I wouldn't want to live...in my case N.Y. My primary gripe is with current players who leave for the highest bidder via free agency rather than work a deal out with their current club. Lot's of people work where they are comfortable and feel appreciated rather than the place down the block that pays more. Fans give their allegiance to players and I like that loyalty returned to the fans. At some level I don't have a lot of sympathy for a guy with 100 million really needs to go because someone offered 105 million. I understand the other side of the issue...just not my style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 6 hours ago, Tony said: Poppy, you have every right to feel that way. You’re obviously an old school guy but unlike some of your other AARP brothers, you can at least respect both sides of the argument, which we all appreciate. And as I’ve consumed more sports over the years and be involved in the business side of things, you have to remember it’s just that. A business. You can choose not to view baseball as a business, and you have every right as a fan to do that, but it’s just the harsh reality. From a players point of view, they’ve worked INCREDIBLY hard to reach the highest level of their craft, and in the specific instance we are talking about, have the opportunity to sign with a team that will pay them the most money for their talent. It would be great if both fans and athletes showed more “loyalty” as you said, but at the end of the day a players professional career is a very short time frame over the span of their entire life, and they have every right to try and generate as much money as possible until those skills diminish. That’s the other side of the argument. I respect that Trout didn't need to check out free agency in case a dime slipped under the table. I got hooked on baseball when kids had their Mr. Cub and Mantle was a Yank not a Dodger. I'm surprised baseball still has fans with all the player movement. When ownership didn't retain Bobby Hull...I was off hockey for 20 years. Oh yes...AARP is a fraud and I'm not a member.😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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